Curing aqua add dry rock

[petemichelle]

I just purchased 200lbs of aqua max dry rock from Marine depot, for a brand new 150 gal tank I am setting up. They say it is dig out of the ground and professionally cleaned, as opposed to coming out of the ocean and then dried. My question is. Does it still need to be cured on salt water for 4 to 8 weeks? Or at all? Or can I just put
It in the new tank and add sand and water without worry about nutrients and other things that you traditionally cure to avoid? And is there anything to gain from curing, like maybe letting it go through a diatom or algae bloom before going into the main display tank?

One more question. If I add a piece of live rock from another tank I obviously take the chance of introducing something into the new display, but what if I first dip it in a coral dip? Will that kill any unwanted hitch hikers? Will it also just kill everything good I am trying to introduce like the bacteria and coralline algae as we'll making it then moot?

 

[J062682l]

It's dry rock , I don't think u need to cure it just rinse. There shouldn't be algae , hitch hikers or anything. I think a rinse and go is all u need !

 

[J062682l]

As for the live rock. Hitch hikers are always gonna happen. And I think the dip will kill off most of that good bacteria You want.

 

[petemichelle]

thanks for the advice. hey, one more question about the sump. I was going to do a 4 inch deep sanded for my system, so I was going to do 4 inches in the sump refugium area as well. Should I be adding snails ie. nessarius and turbo (astria snails) into the refugium area as well to turn the sand? if so then do I have to feed them as separately as wells, ie put food right into the refugium. since the socks and skimmer will probably pick pick up any residual food coming off of the main display return lines. or will the algae, if any, growing in the refugium area be enough for them. also how do you contain them just in the refugium area and keep the from roaming into the first chamber where the skimmer and return socks are, or the last area where the return pumps are? should I also add dry rock into the sump area as well? thanks for all the help

 

[Reefing Madness]

Your new system is still going to have to go through a normal cycling process, wether using live rock or not, you need to grow bacteria on that rock to sustain life. Curing live rock you get die off, and grow the healthy bacteria, same thing, you just don't have to throw in a shrimp to get the cycle started.
If you use a piece of live rock from another tank, what would you be using it for? If you just want the coralline off of it, wait til your system has cycled, then scrape soem of the corralline off into your tank, this will get you started. If you don't want any hitch hikers, then i'd suggest you not put a piece of live rock in the tank, unless you bleach or cook the rock, theres no guarantee you kill off the critters inside the rock by just dipping it.

 

[Reefing Madness]

thanks for the advice. hey, one more question about the sump. I was going to do a 4 inch deep sanded for my system, so I was going to do 4 inches in the sump refugium area as well. Should I be adding snails ie. nessarius and turbo (astria snails) into the refugium area as well to turn the sand? if so then do I have to feed them as separately as wells, ie put food right into the refugium. since the socks and skimmer will probably pick pick up any residual food coming off of the main display return lines. or will the algae, if any, growing in the refugium area be enough for them. also how do you contain them just in the refugium area and keep the from roaming into the first chamber where the skimmer and return socks are, or the last area where the return pumps are? should I also add dry rock into the sump area as well? thanks for all the help

Snails will go where they want to, you, but if your using a sump or fuge with baffles, they won't be able to just run where ever. If using filter socks, that will keep them out of the intake lines, so your safe there also. If you are adding macro algae to the fuge, I'd not put snails or hermits in there, they will mow down the stuff your trying to grow, if your not adding macro, then go ahead, throw sand and rock in there with some snails and hermits, the algae growing in there will be enough for them. The baffles are the key to keeping critters where you want to keep them. Well, at least it will keep the bigger ones in the chambers you want to keep them, the smaller ones will go where they will. Sometimes by using a sponge inbetween the baffles will keep them in the chambers they are meant to stay in.

 

[petemichelle]

Snails will go where they want to, you, but if your using a sump or fuge with baffles, they won't be able to just run where ever. If using filter socks, that will keep them out of the intake lines, so your safe there also. If you are adding macro algae to the fuge, I'd not put snails or hermits in there, they will mow down the stuff your trying to grow, if your not adding macro, then go ahead, throw sand and rock in there with some snails and hermits, the algae growing in there will be enough for them. The baffles are the key to keeping critters where you want to keep them. Well, at least it will keep the bigger ones in the chambers you want to keep them, the smaller ones will go where they will. Sometimes by using a sponge inbetween the baffles will keep them in the chambers they are meant to stay in.

I plan on using only [FONT=arial, sans-serif]Chaetomorpha in the refugium.. is that the stuff you're saying the snails will mow down, so don't add any snails. If I don't add the snails then will the deep sand bed be okay without anything turning the sand over?

what do you mean by "baffles" can you describe better or a pictures if possible. [/FONT]

 

[Reefing Madness]

Cheato is the preferred macro algae, so if you use that don't throw in snails into that chamber.
You don't want a deep sand bed turned over, that defeats the purpose. You want to leave that part alone. No sand sifters needed or wanted.

the pieces in the sump that separate the chambers
What is a baffle?
Any divider used within your sump is a baffle, which either separates compartments, or redirects flow in a specific direction.
How do I determine how many baffles I need?
A bubble trap is a narrow section within the sump that is made up of three baffles. The center one is higher than the two outer ones. The bubble trap should be located after the area that contains the most bubbles. Normally, that would be where the water enters the sump and your protein skimmer is located. Microbubbles abound in this zone, so the bubble trap would be set up next, to prevent these from continuing through to the refugium and/or return section. If you have a refugium next, you'll need one more baffle between the refugium and the return section. All four baffles should be the same height in this setup.
Another way would be to have the return section in the center of your sump, between the skimmer section and the refugium. Water would drain into the skimmer section and the refugium from separate pipes. The refugium's baffle can be taller now, allowing greater depth for growth of macro algae. The height of the bubble trap baffles on the skimmer side is determined by your skimmer's requirements (see below).
Melevsreef.com | Acrylic Sumps & Refugiums

 

[petemichelle]

Your new system is still going to have to go through a normal cycling process, wether using live rock or not, you need to grow bacteria on that rock to sustain life. Curing live rock you get die off, and grow the healthy bacteria, same thing, you just don't have to throw in a shrimp to get the cycle started.
If you use a piece of live rock from another tank, what would you be using it for? If you just want the coralline off of it, wait til your system has cycled, then scrape soem of the corralline off into your tank, this will get you started. If you don't want any hitch hikers, then i'd suggest you not put a piece of live rock in the tank, unless you bleach or cook the rock, theres no guarantee you kill off the critters inside the rock by just dipping it.

I understand. i guess I have to get the worms, pods, brittle stars, and other animals that live in actual "Live Sand" from some kind of seeding kit that i see online. One question though, its' about the throwing in a raw shrimp since I won't be using live rock and using the die off as the ammonia source, I understand that chopping up the raw shrimp and putting it into the tank, the decay process will produce the ammonia that will start the cycling process. And that the process could be 4 to 8 weeks from start to finish. by the end of 8 weeks or however long the cycle takes to finish, all of the raw shrimp will have decayed and there won't be anymore decaying source to produce ammonia, hence shouldn't the bacteria start to shrink? in that case should I be continually adding more shrimp, or food in to keep that cycle going and not let it shrink due to no more ammonia source. it that's true, at what rate should I be adding shrimp or food at? I appreciate the help, the rock will be here tomorrow and I have some decisions to make so as not to go down the wrong road. going with a 150 gal tank plus 50 or so gal for the sump, and 4 inches of sand for both would make for a pretty big mistake if I had to take it all out because I blew setting up the tank in the beginning.

one more question and it's about the aquascaping of the dry rock. I have always put the sand in, a 1/4 of the water and then set the rock up onto of the sand and then filled the rest of the water. I've been told on this forum that I should set the rock up on the glass and then put the sand in around the rock, or put the rock up on some substrate and then pour the sand around it. Why??? what's the difference?? is it just for stability?? I would have thought that whatever life there was living on the rock that gets surrounded by the sand will die off causing hydrogen sulfide since nothing can get in or out of that depth..

 

[Reefing Madness]

You take the raw shrimp, put it in a small net, then lay the net in the water, this keeps the shrimp in the net, and not all over the tank when it starts to fall apart. You won't need to add anymore shrimp to the tank when its done, you will still have some left in the net when its all over. The bacteria will have grown enough that it will have overcome the ammonia source at that time.

Aquascaping, you want the rock on the bottom of the tank, not just sitting on the sand itself, for the shifting that will occur, with the snails and sifters that will come. They can get under the rock in the sand and shift it, or make holes enough to get the rock to shift on you, you can put the sand in first, but when you add the rock, kinda twist it back and forth to get it on the bottom of the tank, and not just sitting on top.

 

[petemichelle]

You take the raw shrimp, put it in a small net, then lay the net in the water, this keeps the shrimp in the net, and not all over the tank when it starts to fall apart. You won't need to add anymore shrimp to the tank when its done, you will still have some left in the net when its all over. The bacteria will have grown enough that it will have overcome the ammonia source at that time.

Aquascaping, you want the rock on the bottom of the tank, not just sitting on the sand itself, for the shifting that will occur, with the snails and sifters that will come. They can get under the rock in the sand and shift it, or make holes enough to get the rock to shift on you, you can put the sand in first, but when you add the rock, kinda twist it back and forth to get it on the bottom of the tank, and not just sitting on top.

you see, now that's the kind of answer i was looking for, very concise and descriptive. I am totally on the same page now. and if the cycle takes longer, I can even add more shrimp into the same net. when It's finished. I just take the net out and add my clean up crew and fish. It's answers like this that make all the posting all the worth while. thanks a million.

Now a plea..I totally understand the "obtaining detrivore "Live Sand" from multiple sources, so as to get the best diversity." None of the local fish stores have a deep sand bed which I can beg or buy, a cup of sand. I am in El Cerrito, Berkely, San Francisco, bay area. is there any other hobbyist in the area that might have a Deep Sand Bed that I can beg, buy, or trade for a couple of cups of sand?

 

[J062682l]

Reeding madness with the assist again!!

 

[Reefing Madness]

You might want to ask here:
California

 

[petemichelle]

Your new system is still going to have to go through a normal cycling process, wether using live rock or not, you need to grow bacteria on that rock to sustain life. Curing live rock you get die off, and grow the healthy bacteria, same thing, you just don't have to throw in a shrimp to get the cycle started.
If you use a piece of live rock from another tank, what would you be using it for? If you just want the coralline off of it, wait til your system has cycled, then scrape soem of the corralline off into your tank, this will get you started. If you don't want any hitch hikers, then i'd suggest you not put a piece of live rock in the tank, unless you bleach or cook the rock, theres no guarantee you kill off the critters inside the rock by just dipping it.

Okay just put in 150 lbs of dry rock and 4 inches of oceans direct live sand "number 0, sugar fine" in my brand new tank. I will order a starter/detrivore kit from inland aquatics just like you guys suggested. I do have a real big concern that just came up. I have a 29 gal bio cube which used to have worms and cop epodes and amphipods because I started it with real live rock. Then one day I realized they were all gone. Seems the 6 line wrasse I put in ate them all. Boo hoo. I obviously will not be putting any wrasse's in my new tank and will probably get rid of the one in my bio cube. Since the pods and worms are an integral part of the deep sand bed I am concerned that other fishes that I introduce may also eat them. Currently I hane a percula clown, a green chromis, a fire goby, and a hippo tang in my cube. Will any of these fish feed on the worms and pods? The clown in perticular, I keep getting different opinions but when asked directly nobody who has made a comment has ever had a deep sand bed or has direct experience. Just a he said, she said, they read somewhere...

Anybody with direct experience? This is my first deep sand bed and my second salt water tank, so I,m really looking to you guys with the experience so I don,t fall on my face.

 

[Reefing Madness]

I've never read, nor seen myself, Clowns eating Pods, but I know most fish will gobble them down when they are lookin for food, just nature, can't stop them. But I know the Wrasse was more than likely going to be the only one eating your worms, at least from the list you've shown.