Cycle Issues

[Duberz]

I have cycle many tanks over the years. Most with Dr Tims one and only with ammonia chloride. It's has always gone pretty much flawless. This time for a new build I decided to use brightwell dry rock starter kit. It comes with their bacteria and ammonia chloride. I followed the directions to a T. I can dose ammonia up to 2ppm and it is gone quick. My problem is nitrites are off the charts on two different kits and won't go down. Nitrates are also off the charts. Ammonia started disappearing after about 7 days and processed it when I dose it back up. Not sure what is going on with the nitrites not going down. Any ideas?

 

[brandon429]

two factions exist now in reefing:

1. nitrite doesn't matter, only ammonia, which you can demo. you can reef right now.

2. nitrite matters, you can stall when it doesn't comply. you must be able to read zero to continue.


Choose your side, its like that. If you want to see plenty of actual examples from 1. I have them, that's my faction lol. I estimate to have over a hundred ready links of nitrite-not measured cycling, we don't care what it reads. here's one:

Fishelss Cycle Questions

Hi everyone. I'm currently on day 13 of a fishless cycle using Aquavitro Seed and Dr. Tim's ammonium chloride. I dosed to 4 ppm ammonia on day one. It took until day 11 to have ammonia back to zero, and I have not dosed ammonia again due to off the chart nitrite readings. I've well been over 5...

www.reef2reef.com

change your water out since its algae feed, and begin reefing, that's per faction #1.

faction #2 definitely wants you to wait longer, or buy more stuff. They would not be able to start a macna convention on time, though. half their reefs would only be able to show up when its closing, but our faction would have all 500 reefs ready and carrying for-sale items like 12$K anemones etc (this is making a play on how forum cycles are uncertain, but macna tanks NEVER miss the start date lol)

group #1 thinks that nobody is measuring nitrite accurately anyway; all the nitrate buildup from ammonia proofing causes misreads, and in another testing set its Prime water conditioner causing false reads...merely getting an accurate reading for nitrite is almost impossible in cycling tanks that could otherwise proceed safely.

group set #2 believes in getting zero nitrite so badly, they'll wait up to 90 days to get it, I have that example too. either way is ok, based on threads we can see. Group #1 says your ammonia proofing qualifies you to begin, after a nice water change to start with less algae fuel in the water.

 

[Duberz]

Thank you! Great info

 

[brandon429]

we need your updates too if you do the water change and start. first fail=I have lots of back editing to do, like twelve years worth

there are cycle challenges in some tanks that use no rocks and sand, like quarantine tanks. If someone has pvc in the display but only a few marine pure bricks in an isolated sump, passing all that water through the media isn’t efficient/takes many whorls and passes to strike the working bricks, especially in low flow tanks.

but a typical tank with rocks and sand, that’s excessive surface area contacting water even if low flow, hungry for ammonia when active.
from your quick ~2 ppm turnover and more than one ammonia dose, we can surmise you are either using a qt tank with plenty of surface area and current, or more likely it’s a rock/sand tank.

The rate and frequency of measured ammonia clearance here indicates strong surface area, so initial bioload is not expected to die. Post tank pic

 

[Duberz]

Yes water change is in the works. Well when I get the time off work to do it. Will update and thanks again Brandon.

 

[Duberz]

Ok another question.My cycle is complete and water change has been done. How long can the tank go before I put fish in? Will the bacteria die off without an ammonia source?

 

[brandon429]

they will never die off wo our added ammonia, because its getting in from trace means that runs lakes and puddles etc.

ammonia gets in by multiple pathways when something is wet, in a home. the bac only have to be kept wet/saltwater and they'll last forever.

*Dr Reef was able to demonstrate starvation in a bare substrate bottle bac cycle, but we had no open top; and only a pinhole to exchange contaminants with the home. A typical reef tank is totally open topped and totally full of skin cells, dead gnats, and a million colonies of non filtration bac all dying and rotting.

This was his experiment, what it takes to starve bac: bottle bac was added to a huge vase with a fitted lid and some siporax as substrate, nothing else. no ammonia offered. bottle bac from bottle into void vase, capped with a lid and a pinhole only. We killed em lol when measured at 14 mos.

we have tracked a 36 mo fallow test, full pass instantly upon ammonia testing after year 3 from DJ City here at r2r

and a 2 year one at nano-reef.com from a dry rock cycle, from poster Dandelion at nano-reef.com

 

[Duberz]

Awesome response thanks!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I have cycle many tanks over the years. Most with Dr Tims one and only with ammonia chloride. It's has always gone pretty much flawless. This time for a new build I decided to use brightwell dry rock starter kit. It comes with their bacteria and ammonia chloride. I followed the directions to a T. I can dose ammonia up to 2ppm and it is gone quick. My problem is nitrites are off the charts on two different kits and won't go down. Nitrates are also off the charts. Ammonia started disappearing after about 7 days and processed it when I dose it back up. Not sure what is going on with the nitrites not going down. Any ideas?

The nitrate is likely a false high reading if nitrite is elevated. 1 ppm nitrite can read as 100 ppm nitrate.

Nitrite is not toxic in a marine system like it is in fresh water, but it is still likely desirable to get it to cycle down before adding fish.