Dead quarantine
- Thread starter mrmole83
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How are you aging the sponge filters? Throwing in a filter sock will have some bacteria on sock but not add much to the sponge filters. The sponges themselves should be aged well, which could be as easy as letting run in fallow tank while ghost feeding for a few weeks.
How are you keeping temperature stable? A swing of +/- 2°F within 24 hours can cause issues.
This time you skipped meds right off the bat, which is good. I only recommend medicating once fishes are eating very well, unless absolutely necessary. Sounds to me like the QT isn't stable. Either insufficient bacteria within filters, temp swings, or poor water quality.
I highly recommend looking into a quality H.O.B. filter. I have some AquaClears in great shape for sale here (shameless plug). An oversized H.O.B. filter will go long way in keeping your QT stable and highly oxygenated.
How are you keeping temperature stable? A swing of +/- 2°F within 24 hours can cause issues.
This time you skipped meds right off the bat, which is good. I only recommend medicating once fishes are eating very well, unless absolutely necessary. Sounds to me like the QT isn't stable. Either insufficient bacteria within filters, temp swings, or poor water quality.
I highly recommend looking into a quality H.O.B. filter. I have some AquaClears in great shape for sale here (shameless plug). An oversized H.O.B. filter will go long way in keeping your QT stable and highly oxygenated.
First, did you sterilize the QT since the last fish death?
Second, are you using rodi? Can't remember if you have said..
Third, did you add hiding spots? Chromis will pick each other off..
Finally, did they have anything abnormal to their appearance, like red spots or areas almost looking bruised? I have read they seem to carry Uronema frequently.
Second, are you using rodi? Can't remember if you have said..
Third, did you add hiding spots? Chromis will pick each other off..
Finally, did they have anything abnormal to their appearance, like red spots or areas almost looking bruised? I have read they seem to carry Uronema frequently.
4FordFamily
Tang, Angel, and Wrasse Nerd!
Oxygen sounds like the problem. Also, do not use any nitrite nitrate or ammonia detoxifiers (such as prime or amquel) in conjunction with these medications, particularly copper. This will be toxic.
Ammonia badge may also be bad, based on what you are saying I cannot imagine ammonia not being an issue. I see the testing but unless this QT has been cycled for a long time, you would definitely need to do LARGE daily water changes to keep things safe.
My 55 gal qt was stocked similarly (proportion-wise) and i had to do daily water changes @ 80% or better for AT LEAST two weeks, I think it was 3. And then every other day, and tapered off. I let my ammonia badge guide me, much as you are trying. I have a bubbler in my large HOB filter (in the back with all of the sponge in this filter I also have a bubbler, and then the HOB, and a powerhead also moves water and increases oxygen concentration. The powerhead is pretty strong but in a 10G you want to be careful not to overpower your fish. Angle it upward where it breaks the surface.
Much of this has already been suggested, but I want to re-itterate. I've learned a LOT of these QT lessons the HARD way. Now I have very very little trouble.
Ammonia badge may also be bad, based on what you are saying I cannot imagine ammonia not being an issue. I see the testing but unless this QT has been cycled for a long time, you would definitely need to do LARGE daily water changes to keep things safe.
My 55 gal qt was stocked similarly (proportion-wise) and i had to do daily water changes @ 80% or better for AT LEAST two weeks, I think it was 3. And then every other day, and tapered off. I let my ammonia badge guide me, much as you are trying. I have a bubbler in my large HOB filter (in the back with all of the sponge in this filter I also have a bubbler, and then the HOB, and a powerhead also moves water and increases oxygen concentration. The powerhead is pretty strong but in a 10G you want to be careful not to overpower your fish. Angle it upward where it breaks the surface.
Much of this has already been suggested, but I want to re-itterate. I've learned a LOT of these QT lessons the HARD way. Now I have very very little trouble.
^^This. It is very possible you have a disease lingering in your QT if you did not sterilize it beforehand. Chromis are very susceptible to Uronema marinum, which can survive indefinitely without a fish host. Also, Marine Velvet Disease will sometimes kill without showing any obvious physical symptoms.
What is considered sterilize? What do you do to consider it sterilize? I just want to ask to see if i have done a enough delicate work.
Now i have a dilemma:
Having in mind that The goal of qt is to keep fish in there and medicate them until parasites and all hitch hikers gets eliminate prior to introducing the fish to the main display.
The qt must have enough bacteria to keep the ammonia at bay. And we also must medicate.
Doesnt madication like copper kill also bacteria?
So one side keep as much bacteria as possible the other side is medication.
To me right isnt this contradicting?
How do you go about and arrange both?
Now i have a dilemma:
Having in mind that The goal of qt is to keep fish in there and medicate them until parasites and all hitch hikers gets eliminate prior to introducing the fish to the main display.
The qt must have enough bacteria to keep the ammonia at bay. And we also must medicate.
Doesnt madication like copper kill also bacteria?
So one side keep as much bacteria as possible the other side is medication.
To me right isnt this contradicting?
How do you go about and arrange both?
Brian Kim
Color My Reef
You are correct about having enough bacteria to keep the ammonia at bay. Copper will not kill beneficial bacteria, not a significant level to wipe them out of your system and it will recolonize considerably fast.
melypr1985
totally addicted
To sterilize your QT you can just empty it and wipe it all down with vinegar (includes all equipment in said QT) Let it dry completely and it will be completely free of any parasites that were in it before.
Brain Kim is correct... The copper and other meds wont wipe out your bacteria colony completely, only put a dent in them. They come back pretty quickly.
When you take down your QT to sterilize, you should throw away the filter media you had in there. Have another sponge in your sump being seeded for the next round of fish so your never without that.
Just FYI; I would dump that QT, wipe everything down with vinegar, rinse and then let air dry for a few days before using it again. You might have some unknown "Typhoid Mary" like disease going on in there. You gotta remember, the diseases that are known to us probably only represent a fraction of what's really out there.
TheWhiteFord
Well-Known Member
I don't know if this helps but I (so far) have been able to keep 9 fish (including 2 tangs) happy and healthy in a 30 gal tank with a 30 gal sump (only 10 gal in it) protein skimmer, gfo reactor, hob filter with sponge (no carbon). The fish have 5 different pieces of pvc to hide in and two Koralia nano powerheads. They have been in there for about 17 days.
I also would try a different supplier for your next batch of fish. The "Typhoid Mary" might be running rampant in their system too. Some dealers don't keep fish long enough to ever know. The "problem" just gets passed onto the customer.
rayn
Bluefin Believer
Not to be negative nancy, but try one fish. Clowns will pair up eventually, so you don't have to buy two. You don't have to buy 5 chromis.
Humblefish makes a good point of trying a different supplier too
Humblefish makes a good point of trying a different supplier too
Very quality advices. I appreciate alot guys. Now i have some more haha.
If medication does not wipe out bacteria, how long do you think i should cycle the tank?
Should i use sand and rocks from my dt?
What happens when i finish quarantining first batch? Do i tear down and start again from sterelizing?
If medication does not wipe out bacteria, how long do you think i should cycle the tank?
Should i use sand and rocks from my dt?
What happens when i finish quarantining first batch? Do i tear down and start again from sterelizing?
melypr1985
totally addicted
You will be cycling the tank quickly with the use of bacteria in a bottle products or a seeded sponge from your sump. You'll use large water changes to keep up with the ammonia. If your not adding a fish right away then you can just let it cycle like a normal tank.
Dont put any sand or rock in the tank at all. These things absorb meds (like copper) and leach them back out later making it difficult to keep the meds at proper therapeutic levels. Use pvc elbows for hiding spots.
I hope that answered your question
rayn
Bluefin Believer
If you seed a sponge filter from you DT and use it in your QT then it is cycled. However, ALWAYS watch your ammonia as it can and will creep up on you creating issues. If you use sand or rock from your DT it will become contaminated with any disease in your QT. Then you have to let it die off or take the chance of spreading a disease to a different fish. NEVER move rock to the QT then back again if you do choose to move rock over.
Start with a clean sterile tank. Add mixed water with a couple pieces of PVC, about the 4" diameter. This will give the fish a place to hide and will generally be big enough for most fish. Add fish. WATCH. Watch some more. Make sure it eats and lives for a few days. Decide if you want to take the watch and wait approach or treat for anything that can possibly be there. ONCE YOU ARE SURE IT IS HEALTHY move fish to DT. Tear down QT and sterilize it with a vinegar solution. Repeat.
It takes time and fish won't suddenly be in your DT, but your DT will be healthy. This also gives your DT plenty of time to adjust to the new bio load added each time you add a new fish.
Start with a clean sterile tank. Add mixed water with a couple pieces of PVC, about the 4" diameter. This will give the fish a place to hide and will generally be big enough for most fish. Add fish. WATCH. Watch some more. Make sure it eats and lives for a few days. Decide if you want to take the watch and wait approach or treat for anything that can possibly be there. ONCE YOU ARE SURE IT IS HEALTHY move fish to DT. Tear down QT and sterilize it with a vinegar solution. Repeat.
It takes time and fish won't suddenly be in your DT, but your DT will be healthy. This also gives your DT plenty of time to adjust to the new bio load added each time you add a new fish.
melypr1985
totally addicted
I think the general consensus has been oxygen depletion. We just gave you a quick overview of a proper QT. Make sure to sterilize your QT (as outlined above) before starting over.
