Deep sand bed in buckets

[Seneca]

I'm in the process of setting up my ~1000 gallon system (~700 main display).

Monster Build - 720 gallon acryllic

Just joined your forum. I've had a 180 gallon system at work (125 main display) for a few years and we just decided to upgrade. Just got our new tank unloaded from the truck after driving it 500 miles from where I picked it up. It has a central overflow and I've been thinking how I want to...

www.reef2reef.com

I'm wondering if anyone with experience with deep sand beds could comment on my idea of putting 8-10 buckets in my sump with 8-10 inches of sand. I figure I can swap them out one by one without disturbing them at all in 2-5 years ( is there consensus on how long a dsb is good for?).

Will this do anything good for my system volume or is this idea pointless? Obviously I hope it would help with managing nitrate (among other things). I love gadgets as much as anyone, but if I can avoid another one that sounds like a big benefit.

 

[Victor_C3]

I thought about doing what you just mentioned before. It sounds like a good idea to me.

Years ago, I read through a 40-page thread on reefcentral about RDSB. One of things I took away from that thread was that using a 55 gallon tall tank to house a RDSB provided enough filtration for more than 1,000 gallons worth of display tanks. The sand was up to about 4-6” from the top (so maybe 40-ish gallons worth of sand).

I’m in the middle of building a 115 gallon display with a 175 gallon sump. I had given it some though that I might go the RDSB route, but ultimately I decided that I would be better served using an additional 200 pounds of live rock in my sump instead.

The main reason I chose live rock over the RDSB was I figured it would provide more habitat for a larger variety of organisms than a sand bed. The additional rock would add more than enough filtration capacity to my display.

Perhaps if space was an issue I might go the RDSB route. You could cram a lot more filtration into a smaller space that way.

Either way, it can’t possibly hurt to add an RDSB to to your system.

 

[bobnicaragua]

8 to 10 buckets would take up a lot of real estate. Have you considered using all or some of that space for a refugium?

 

[fish farmer]

How about a bunch of chaeto or other macro algae instead...no need to swap out, just trim away and that will also consume some phosphates as well.

 

[Salt Addiction]

How about a bunch of chaeto or other macro algae instead...no need to swap out, just trim away and that will also consume some phosphates as well.

+1, I run this coupled with mangroves and had great success so far.

 

[Seneca]

8 to 10 buckets would take up a lot of real estate. Have you considered using all or some of that space for a refugium?

I didn't see any particular reason the "refugium" part of the sump couldn't be on top of the buckets (and around).

 

[Salt Addiction]

I didn't see any particular reason the "refugium" part of the sump couldn't be on top of the buckets (and around).

So just a thought. If your putting up that large of tank I imagine the budget is adequate, why not use a media like Marine-pure blocks instead of a DSB? They would be alot more efficient, then couple it with some free floating cheato.

 

[Seneca]

So just a thought. If your putting up that large of tank I imagine the budget is adequate, why not use a media like Marine-pure blocks instead of a DSB? They would be alot more efficient, then couple it with some free floating cheato.

If buckets of sand will do the job why would I spend money on some expensive engineered material that comes with its own set of problems and may or may not work? (for nitrate, I have no doubt about ammonia and nitrite, but my live rock is more than adequate for those). I'm genuinely asking the question, if you have some compelling reasons on how these ceramic media are obviously an amazing addition I would love to hear them. I'm old school in every area that makes sense, or try to be.

I'd love to hear from reefers who use a dsb, or esspecially a rdsb.

 

[brandon429]

At least this can easily be undone, it’s ideal to experiment with

 

[Salt Addiction]

If buckets of sand will do the job why would I spend money on some expensive engineered material that comes with its own set of problems and may or may not work? (for nitrate, I have no doubt about ammonia and nitrite, but my live rock is more than adequate for those). I'm genuinely asking the question, if you have some compelling reasons on how these ceramic media are obviously an amazing addition I would love to hear them. I'm old school in every area that makes sense, or try to be.

I'd love to hear from reefers who use a dsb, or esspecially a rdsb.

This is what I primarily based mine on, that and how most DSBs tend to need replaced after a few years due to build up:

BRS Porosity Comparison

Ultimately though, do what works best for you, some solutions that work for one person may not work for another. For me I also injured my spine in the military, so lifting buckets of sand isn't an option.

 

[Billdogg]

Here's my experience with a RDSB. It's a bit of a long story, but I'll keep it as brief as possible.

In 1990, I brought home a ~18" Gymnothorax Undulatus (Undulated Moray - one of the meaner of the Eels, not often imported (on purpose). I worked p/t and dated the owner of a LFS at the time and had just set up a 150L (72x24,21ish). In he went with a bunch of other large fish - trade-ins from customers who didn't realize that the grouper/snapper/puffer/tang/etc could get so dang big as to outgrow their HUGE 75g tank. WIthin a year, he had eaten everything except a very large Emperor Snapper and a Guineafowl puffer who was also rather large. It was a messy tank to say the least. With weekly 50g water changes I could almost get Nitrates down to testable but still way high. Eventually I found a taker for the snapper, and the puffer died of old age. Hannibal was now in the 150 by himself, but he had also grown to ~4' in length by then. He was eating at least 3 hand sized fillets of whatever seafood kroger had on hand weekly. Tons of food = tons of poop. I couldn't keep much rock in the tank because he'd knock them all over the place. There wasn't room in the sump, but the skimmer helped a lot.

Then I read about RDSB's on www.wetwebmedia.com around 2002. I just happened to have a spare 120g tank and a place to put it (YAY fishroom!!!) The sump was already in the fishroom so adding it was easy. I used about 6-8" of sugar fine sand in the 120 - probably 400+ lbs. and put it online. I used a DART as the return pump so T'ing of to feed the refugium/RDSB was easy - it sat directly above the sump and just drained back down to it.

Within 6 weeks or so nitrates had dropped from barely low enough to test after a 1/3 water change to barely detectable after a month without anything but topoff water. I ended up building a pvc platform above the sane for a bunch of LR and also transplanted a couple Kenya Tree sprouts to it. Between the sandbed, LR and softies filtering the water it became one of the cleanest tanks I've ever owned.

IMHO, your idea is a good solution to filtration using a RDSB. POST PICS!

Sadly, Hannibal died a few years back - probably of old age - after spending 25 years with me.

As ready as I was to be done with Eel keeping, I kinda miss the guy anyway.

 

[Seneca]

At least this can easily be undone, it’s ideal to experiment with

That was my main thought as well.

 

[Seneca]

Here's my experience with a RDSB. It's a bit of a long story, but I'll keep it as brief as possible.

That is fantastic information. Thanks!

What a great eel! I'd miss him too (challenges aside)

 

[TX_Punisher]

Rdsb as you know, are nothing new. I find it funny that some of the old methods are coming back. If I ever get the chance to upgrade, I’ll be going Barebottom with a rdsb fuge or miracle mud and macro refugium for nutrient control. The rdsb or miracle mud will add stability to the system while keeping detritus at bay in the display with very big flow.

 

[Seneca]

Rdsb as you know, are nothing new. I find it funny that some of the old methods are coming back. If I ever get the chance to upgrade, I’ll be going Barebottom with a rdsb fuge or miracle mud and macro refugium for nutrient control. The rdsb or miracle mud will add stability to the system while keeping detritus at bay in the display with very big flow.

I hadn't actually heard the term RDSB until this thread. It makes perfect sense. DSBs are a great source of nutrient control, but at least for many, are ticking time bombs. Obvious solution is to make the DSB detachable in some way from the system so it can be swapped out safely and easily before such concerns exist. Low cost, low effort, and apparently, effective.

These are the kinds of solutions that I attempt to employ whenever possible.

It would be nice if there was a compiled resource of such things, they tend to get drowned out by latest gadget crazes.