Did i fail my plumbing?

[Christoball]

Hi! Even tho i am a fairly new hobbyist i have come to the step where i am setting up a frag tank. My initial idea was to do this very easy and simple, but i think i may have already messed up… i would love to get you guys opinion to set this up correctly.

first, let my explain what my idea was and the what i actually want out of this plumbing.

I have this acrylic tank (23x18x8 inches) that i want to plumb to my maintank sump. (I will be moving it to this spot where the bucket it) i thought i could use a controlable dc pump up to the fragtank and adjust the power to match the drain. And here does the problem start for me.
The return plumbing is a 19mm hose to 20mm (1/2”?) piping. This i think is all good. But for plumbing i went for a 25mm (3/4”?) single drain and a ball valve. I did this because i thought it would be easy to controle the water level and noise in the fragtank. This has proven to be an impossible task for me! Haha. I simply cannot make it quite and have a steady water level. It either overflows or makes alot of noise. AND i can hardly push a normal amount of flow through the return with out it overflowing. Even with the valve completly open.

so what have a done wrong? Is it as simple of a solution to fix this by doing 1" (32mm?) for return instead?

and for safety i am defenitly doing an emergency drain. Because this project makes me nervous already!! Haha!

would it be possible to re-drill the existing bulk head hole to fit an 1” bulk head? And would it be possible to use the 25mm piping for en emergancy overflow?

I will add some more picture incase i made my self unclear.

thanks! Chris.

 

[Reefahholic]

Hi! Even tho i am a fairly new hobbyist i have come to the step where i am setting up a frag tank. My initial idea was to do this very easy and simple, but i think i may have already messed up… i would love to get you guys opinion to set this up correctly.

first, let my explain what my idea was and the what i actually want out of this plumbing.

I have this acrylic tank (23x18x8 inches) that i want to plumb to my maintank sump. (I will be moving it to this spot where the bucket it) i thought i could use a controlable dc pump up to the fragtank and adjust the power to match the drain. And here does the problem start for me.
The return plumbing is a 19mm hose to 20mm (1/2”?) piping. This i think is all good. But for plumbing i went for a 25mm (3/4”?) single drain and a ball valve. I did this because i thought it would be easy to controle the water level and noise in the fragtank. This has proven to be an impossible task for me! Haha. I simply cannot make it quite and have a steady water level. It either overflows or makes alot of noise. AND i can hardly push a normal amount of flow through the return with out it overflowing. Even with the valve completly open.

so what have a done wrong? Is it as simple of a solution to fix this by doing 1" (32mm?) for return instead?

and for safety i am defenitly doing an emergency drain. Because this project makes me nervous already!! Haha!

would it be possible to re-drill the existing bulk head hole to fit an 1” bulk head? And would it be possible to use the 25mm piping for en emergancy overflow?

I will add some more picture incase i made my self unclear.

thanks! Chris.

I have some homework for you. Read this and report back:

Silent & Fail-Safe Aquarium Overflow System | BeanAnimal's Reef

Build the world famous "Bean Animal" silent and fail-safe aquarium overflow system. No noise, no adjustment, no floods. A truly set and forget setup that makes the Durso and Stockman style of standpipes obsolete! Build your own today!

beananimal.com

 

[FishOkay]

Your drain needs to be a larger diameter than your return. Also the way youv set the drain up it up will be noisy it's quite high and will suck air.

 

[FishOkay]

Try 32mm but I think 40mm will be better for the drain especially if your not going to have an emergency drain

 

[FishOkay]

Try 32mm but I think 40mm will be better for the drain especially if your not going to have an emergency drain

And put an elbow inside the tank for the drain so it's taking water from lower in the tank

 

[reefteaser]

I’ve been using a Herbie system on my 115 gal mixed for years without any issues. If you drilled another drain much lower than the first it could become your siphon, and the current drain the overflow. I’ll bet a 1/2 siphon line would work well, as a full siphon drains a LOT of water.

 

[Rmckoy]

If I remember correctly .
the difference between gravity falling and pumping water through .
the gravity size needs to be 1.5 x to 2x the pumped dia .

there is a formula to calculate size of drain required to balance

 

[reefteaser]

If you MUST have an emergency drain, you could drill another, just make sure it drain slightly higher than the first one.
I wouldn’t change the size of your current drain just yet. Set up the siphon line first, making sure it has a strainer, or some way to keep debris or any critters from blocking it. Then adjust the ball valve so that just a small trickle of water goes though the top drain.
If something does block the siphon, the larger pipe should handle enough overflow to be safe until you fix things, and should be noisy enough to alert you of a problem.
It’s not as safe as having an emergency drain, but if set up correctly, the chances of a flood are remote. Having a larger overflow pipe that goes full siphon will handle much more water than the normal siphon if the normal one clogs up. It’s much more likely in that case that the overflow will NOT go full siphon, but you’ll hear the problem and fix it.

 

[Rmckoy]

Aquarium Plumbing Basics - Reef Aquarium

Aquarium Plumbing Basics

www.reefaquarium.com

 

[Tenecor Aquariums]

Overflow box would have been (and still could be) your easiest and safest way to get what you want. You have an acrylic tank. Easy to do and much better than going out the back and over the top. Order one here. Cheap. https://tenecoraquariums.com/collections/overflow-boxes-for-glass-tanks

 

[Tenecor Aquariums]

Curious, what is the thickness of your frag walls?

 

[theMeat]

You either need a single drain without a valve, which will make noise. Or two drains where one gets a valve, which will be quiet. Either way you should go larger diameter pipe.
When power goes out tank water will siphon down to sump. With an overflow box in tank to house the drain pipe or pipes, the amount of water that siphons down will be much less

 

[Tenecor Aquariums]

You either need a single drain without a valve, which will make noise. Or two drains where one gets a valve, which will be quiet. Either way you should go larger diameter pipe.
When power goes out tank water will siphon down to sump. With an overflow box in tank to house the drain pipe or pipes, the amount of water that siphons down will be much less

One way to silence is by adding a piece of open cell foam inside the overflow. And using flex hose instead of hard plumbing.

 

[theMeat]

One way to silence is by adding a piece of open cell foam inside the overflow.

Inside the overflow box, or inside overflow pipe?
Either way, it will clog and not end well.
On a single drain a stockman standpipe is about as quiet as you can hope to safely achieve, ime

 

[Tenecor Aquariums]

Inside the overflow box, or inside overflow pipe?
Either way, it will clog and not end well.
On a single drain a stockman standpipe is about as quiet as you can hope to safely achieve, ime

We put 10 PPI inside the overflow box. Been doing it for forty years on thousands of tanks. For 10 PPI to clog, is not likely. What would happen is return flow reduces. Eventually stops if in the impossible event the drain clogs 100 %. Sump fills up a bit but no flooding. You can also double drill two drains for extra safety. By orders of magnitude easier than plumbing it any other way. Easy and simple. Three drains? Valves? Air vents? Oh, flex hose. Big help in reducing noise. Again, easy. Simple.

 

[Tenecor Aquariums]

Here is a 350 gallons + we just shipped. Dual internal returns each on its own DC pump. Two drains. That's it. Flex hose.

 

[Christoball]

Thank you! I will read up on that post

I have some homework for you. Read this and report back:

Silent & Fail-Safe Aquarium Overflow System | BeanAnimal's Reef

Build the world famous "Bean Animal" silent and fail-safe aquarium overflow system. No noise, no adjustment, no floods. A truly set and forget setup that makes the Durso and Stockman style of standpipes obsolete! Build your own today!

beananimal.com

 

[Christoball]

Curious, what is the thickness of your frag walls?

Its 10mm

 

[theMeat]

We put 10 PPI inside the overflow box. Been doing it for forty years on thousands of tanks. For 10 PPI to clog, is not likely. What would happen is return flow reduces. Eventually stops if in the impossible event the drain clogs 100 %. Sump fills up a bit but no flooding. You can also double drill two drains for extra safety. By orders of magnitude easier than plumbing it any other way. Easy and simple. Three drains? Valves? Air vents? Oh, flex hose. Big help in reducing noise. Again, easy. Simple.

Guess we will disagree here. Have 10ppi to keep return pump section clear in my sump. Have to clean it weekly to keep water from building up. To me drilling another hole or running a single drain of adequate diameter to avoid a flood is cheaper and easier

 

[Christoball]

If you MUST have an emergency drain, you could drill another, just make sure it drain slightly higher than the first one.
I wouldn’t change the size of your current drain just yet. Set up the siphon line first, making sure it has a strainer, or some way to keep debris or any critters from blocking it. Then adjust the ball valve so that just a small trickle of water goes though the top drain.
If something does block the siphon, the larger pipe should handle enough overflow to be safe until you fix things, and should be noisy enough to alert you of a problem.
It’s not as safe as having an emergency drain, but if set up correctly, the chances of a flood are remote. Having a larger overflow pipe that goes full siphon will handle much more water than the normal siphon if the normal one clogs up. It’s much more likely in that case that the overflow will NOT go full siphon, but you’ll hear the problem and fix it.

would somethibg like this be correct for the siphon merhod you explained?