Dino ID

[safi]

Hi,

Is anybody able to give me an ID on the following pics and video please and how to treat it?

Thanks

19 July 2023

youtube.com

 

[The_Paradox]

Can you get a little more magnification or stain them? From photo best guess is Amphidinium.

 

[safi]

Can you get a little more magnification or stain them? From photo best guess is Amphidinium.

Hi, thanks for the reply.

I am still figuring out how to use the scope as its new and ive never used one before, but i will do more samples and try again. What do you mean when you stain them?

 

[The_Paradox]

Gram staining. It will increase the contrast of the cells actual structure and also allow you to identify if it’s positive or negative. A nice side effect is it also usually teases out a little more detail on lower end microscopes.

Here is a very basic video but if you want to go down the rabbit hole I suggest checking out the Microbiology Societies YouTube page.

 

[safi]

Gram staining. It will increase the contrast of the cells actual structure and also allow you to identify if it’s positive or negative. A nice side effect is it also usually teases out a little more detail on lower end microscopes.

Here is a very basic video but if you want to go down the rabbit hole I suggest checking out the Microbiology Societies YouTube page.

Okidoki, thanks for the link. The microscope i have is a Amscope M150C compound student microscope 40X-1000X. I am still getting used to how to use it as the manual that it came with isn't very detailed so i will look online for more info on the instructions.

Just as a sidenote…the algae in my tank was brown and covered everything to the point where i am having to clean the glass every day sometimes more than once! However, its still doing this but its now green? Is this normal for dinos?

 

[The_Paradox]

You have a couple types of algae in those photos plus possibly dinos. My experience is when you start to beat dinos you see an algae or sometimes a cyano bloom.

 

[safi]

You have a couple types of algae in those photos plus possibly dinos. My experience is when you start to beat dinos you see an algae or sometimes a cyano bloom.

Yeh i thought i have what looks like abit of briopsis maybe on the rocks? It was growing in the sandbed and also a small amount of bubble algae. First i tried to remove all the algae manually but they just kept coming back. Its the briopsis and bubble algae i was targetting more as i have quite a number of different CUC plus 2 fish that i thought would keep the GHA down.

So when manual removal didn't get rid i did some searching online and came across quite a few recommendations for Vibrant. I started dosing around the first week in April but only once every 2 wks at half the dose. Then after around 4 weeks i went upto the full dose (after noting there was no negative effects on my fish/cuc etc) I also started dosing it once a week. The bubble algae seems to have gone, so far i cant see anymore. The briopsis on the sandbed stopped also but now i have started with what looks like a fine coating of brown over everything, everywhere. Today it looks as if its turned green! Its causing my GSP and one of my toadstools to stay closed. And there are small tiny bits of what looks like red cyano in some of the holes in the rocks. Also there can be tiny little bubbles attaching to the rocks, sand bed, corals etc.

Throughout all this i also dose phyto & pods at least 1-2 times a week, do weekly water changes and dose MB7 afterwards. I used to feed heavy and my po4&no3 started to go up so i slowed up with the feeding but i think i may have been overfeeding again just lately.

If you have any ideas for the algae and the cyano i would appreciate it? I have a UV sterilizer and a skimmer but neither are running. The UV is new and i was trying to identify the dinos before i set it up incase it wont be any use and the skimmer can be a pain and the last time i ran it(about 6mths ago) i almost bottomed out the po4 & no3 so i took it off. I also have FluxRX but have never used it as i am unsure about dosing too many chemicals. On my last test on 17th july my no3 was 5.2 but my po4 was 0.11 using hannah tests.

 

[The_Paradox]

I would tackle one at a time. If it is Amphidinium, or any other dino that goes into the water, UV will handle it in a couple of days. As for the algae, if scrubbing it off is not an option, I would do 14 day fluconazole treatment.

 

[safi]

I would tackle one at a time. If it is Amphidinium, or any other dino that goes into the water, UV will handle it in a couple of days. As for the algae, if scrubbing it off is not an option, I would do 14 day fluconazole treatment.

Ok sounds like a plan! I will set up the UV today and see what happens with the dinos. Is the fluconazole safe with fish and inverts etc?

 

[The_Paradox]

Ok sounds like a plan! I will set up the UV today and see what happens with the dinos. Is the fluconazole safe with fish and inverts etc?

I’ve used with:
LPS
SPS
Sponges
Urchins
Fish
Crabs
Shrimp

Sponges lost some colour but nothing else has even reacted. My urchins which react to peroxide don’t even notice it. Obviously if you have anything that only eats algae you may need to supplement as it dies off.

Looking at your photos though I’m not sure your tank needs it though. A few more CUC and you should be fine.

 

[safi]

I’ve used with:
LPS
SPS
Sponges
Urchins
Fish
Crabs
Shrimp

Sponges lost some colour but nothing else has even reacted. My urchins which react to peroxide don’t even notice it. Obviously if you have anything that only eats algae you may need to supplement as it dies off.

Looking at your photos though I’m not sure your tank needs it though. A few more CUC and you should be fine.

What other cuc would you recommend and how many? In my tank i currently have:

3 blue legged hermits
3 trochus
2 nassarius
2 cerith
1 mex turbo
1 cleaner shrimp
1 peppermint shrimp
1 bicolour blenny
1 court jester goby
2 clownfish
Plus corals- softies mostly and a couple lps
(Also spotted a couple bristle worms just the other day!)

Tank is a fluval evo 13.5g. Wasn’t sure how many more i can have in this tank.

 

[The_Paradox]

Not seeing a lot of coralline but if you are willing to supplemental feed should need arise, a tuxedo urchin would do the job for sure. In a tank that size though you will almost certainly need to feed algae wafers or nori at some point though. The old go to of more hermit crabs would also help.

 

[safi]

Not seeing a lot of coralline but if you are willing to supplemental feed should need arise, a tuxedo urchin would do the job for sure. In a tank that size though you will almost certainly need to feed algae wafers or nori at some point though. The old go to of more hermit crabs would also help.

I have a little purple coralline on the back wall and some small patches on the rocks but the green hair is starting to take over so you cant see it all. I still think there should probably be a bit more for the age of the tank (running since march 2022) but i am still trying to figure out what works for the tank without bottoming out the nutrients but also trying to get the corals to thrive.
I dont seem to have much growth on some of the corals than others and i thought i would have after just over a year! I have a tiny 22l tank with a green goby a trochus snail and 3 large blue hermits in, which i took out of the evo tank as they were like bulls in a china shop and kept knocking over all the corals. Also i have a purple fuzzy mushroom on a rock which has split into 4 and seems to love it in there! I might put at least one of the hermits back in the evo and see if it helps?
How big do urchins get? And will it wear all my corals?! Lol

 

[The_Paradox]

Tuxedos stay pretty small. I have one that’s around two years old and it’s under 3”. They will take any coral that’s not glued down. It’s not a might, they WILL.

 

[safi]

Tuxedos stay pretty small. I have one that’s around two years old and it’s under 3”. They will take any coral that’s not glued down. It’s not a might, they WILL.

Yeh i have seen the pictures people keep posting on facebook with their urchins covered in nems and clove polyps! I have quite a few corals still on plugs in the sand and on a rack until i figure their places on the rocks etc. so the urchin might have to be a last resort!

I will manually remove some of the gha and transfer 1 or 2 of the larger hermits back over and see if they help to keep it down. Plus i’m throwing pods in like theres no tomorrow! Also if the UV helps with the dinos i might come out on top! Yay

 

[JoJosReef]

Doesn't look like large cell amphidinium to me--no "beak" at the front--but I don't have a positive ID for this one. Also, for amphidinium (large cell) UV does not work, since they don't go into the water column. And UV only partially works for prorocentrum since they do and they don't go into the water column.

First post in this link is quite helpful:

Dinoflagellate Identification Guide

I've had this laying around for a while. Had some recent interest, so I tweaked it a bit and am posting it. Not really about cures just ID pictures, videos, and a few short facts. Hope it can be helpful.

www.reef2reef.com

 

[safi]

Doesn't look like large cell amphidinium to me--no "beak" at the front--but I don't have a positive ID for this one. Also, for amphidinium (large cell) UV does not work, since they don't go into the water column. And UV only partially works for prorocentrum since they do and they don't go into the water column.

First post in this link is quite helpful:

Dinoflagellate Identification Guide

I've had this laying around for a while. Had some recent interest, so I tweaked it a bit and am posting it. Not really about cures just ID pictures, videos, and a few short facts. Hope it can be helpful.

www.reef2reef.com

Hi

Thanks for the link. Ive just had a look, it is a good read and helpful. Ive seen this file before from a facebook group i am in. I did have a read of it a week or so back but the cells i was seeing in the microscope seemed to fall into a few different sections! Some move and some dont plus they don't all look like the same shapes! I was wondering if you can have more than one type of dinos together?

I am dosing copepods and phyto more often this last couple weeks and some of it seems to have slowed up, such as the layer on the glass. I have had to scrape my glass sides everyday sometimes more than once but that seems to have slowed up now its the green/brown layer on the sand thats still there but even that doesn't seem as bad. Ive managed to get my po4 down to 0.06 and no3 is at 5.3 i thought i would set the UV going just to see if it made any difference.

 

[JoJosReef]

Hi

Thanks for the link. Ive just had a look, it is a good read and helpful. Ive seen this file before from a facebook group i am in. I did have a read of it a week or so back but the cells i was seeing in the microscope seemed to fall into a few different sections! Some move and some dont plus they don't all look like the same shapes! I was wondering if you can have more than one type of dinos together?

I am dosing copepods and phyto more often this last couple weeks and some of it seems to have slowed up, such as the layer on the glass. I have had to scrape my glass sides everyday sometimes more than once but that seems to have slowed up now its the green/brown layer on the sand thats still there but even that doesn't seem as bad. Ive managed to get my po4 down to 0.06 and no3 is at 5.3 i thought i would set the UV going just to see if it made any difference.

Good move. I've got some prorocentrum right now, and the UV does help. If I had to venture a guess I'd guess yours is proro dominant. UV + outcompete (can dose silicates to increase diatom population, or add different types of bacteria or mud/sand from ocean or other systems).

 

[safi]

Good move. I've got some prorocentrum right now, and the UV does help. If I had to venture a guess I'd guess yours is proro dominant. UV + outcompete (can dose silicates to increase diatom population, or add different types of bacteria or mud/sand from ocean or other systems).

Yeh i have also been adding MB7. I add it after my weekly water changes (usually every weekend) but I've been adding extra doses through the week.
I was thinking about dosing silicates but i haven't had chance to read up on it yet or look for a product. What im doing seems to be helping so far so i’ll carry on with it and add the UV too.
Im gunna have to mess around with this microscope a bit more too, it says it shows between 40x-1000x magnification but i need to read the instructions properly and get my head around it! I would have liked to identify which dino for sure so i know how to deal with it if i get the same one again.