diy amino acid

[McMullen]

After reading the advanced aquarist article is seems the ULNS tanks may have the most benefit from adding AA's. Also, if our goal is to closely replicate a natural reef, regular zooplankton and phytoplankton feeding fits the bill.

The immediate PE extension may very well be the coral sensing the aminos. This however does not prove or demonstrate a deficiency, rather a feeding response. It seems likely for all tanks there is no AA deficiency and no proof of faster or enhanced growth/color, but some excellent marketing using real scientific data, but stretching, bending, and making conclusions/claims/ hypothesis to sell a product. A page right out of pharmaceutical companies playbook!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

It seems likely for all tanks there is no AA deficiency and no proof of faster or enhanced growth/color, but some excellent marketing using real scientific data, but stretching, bending, and making conclusions/claims/ hypothesis to sell a product. A page right out of pharmaceutical companies playbook!

I wont' take that personally, but this may not be the best forum to bash pharmaceutical products.

 

[McMullen]

Post removed-it detracted from the OP's subject!

 

[McMullen]

I have the upmost respect for the scientist and researchers, but when the goal of making money becomes a corporations focus, bias and monetary gain out weigh science. You don't have to be in the medical field to understand that Lets not detract from the subject of AA's, their utility, and the conclusion of the advanced aquarist article. My apologies for letting my personal feelings and bias creep into a great discussion!!!

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I have the upmost respect for the scientist and researchers, but when the goal of making money becomes a corporations focus, bias and monetary gain out weigh science. You don't have to be in the medical field to understand that Lets not detract from the subject of AA's, their utility, and the conclusion of the advanced aquarist article. My apologies for letting my personal feelings and bias creep into a great discussion!!!

OK, just bear in mind I am one of them, and products I have co-invented make a very large amount of money for companies, but that does not mean they are used inappropriately. Every patient who takes my drugs (there are three) takes frequent tests to ensure they are working and they are taking an optimal dose.

 

[diesel3443]

So getting back to Aminos in reef aquaria....

I'm really interested if dosing elicits a feeding response and you follow it up right with feeding.

Keep in mind, I am very nutrient deficient.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

So getting back to Aminos in reef aquaria....

I'm really interested if dosing elicits a feeding response and you follow it up right with feeding.

Keep in mind, I am very nutrient deficient.

What would you follow it with?

 

[McMullen]

I am not a scientist or chemist by any stretch but just reading the advanced aquarist article posted above in my mind questions the validity of dosing AA's at all. The article is like a meta analysis and I'm using the authors conclusions and opinions of scientific data to form my own conclusions so………I didn't really take anything away from the article suggesting benefit. I think "we're" basing polyp extension improvement as sign of success. It may very well be! It could also simply be the specialized chemical reaction of the coral recognizing a potential for food/absorption of something it wants. Dosing aminos to achieve a super concentration in the water stream may elicit the corals natural response but may be nothing more than the Pavlov's Dogs reaction, or the Mcmullen pizza reaction where my belly growls and I drool every time I see and smell pizza

That said, perhaps like the article suggested, feed phytoplankton and or zooplankton.

I am curious though what others thoughts are on the article. I want AA's to work, so much so that because of this post I ordered acropower to see if I notice a difference.

 

[diesel3443]

What would you follow it with?

I am thinking either a small micron food or even some skimmate

 

[dewboy1127]

I am not a scientist or chemist by any stretch but just reading the advanced aquarist article posted above in my mind questions the validity of dosing AA's at all. The article is like a meta analysis and I'm using the authors conclusions and opinions of scientific data to form my own conclusions so………I didn't really take anything away from the article suggesting benefit. I think "we're" basing polyp extension improvement as sign of success. It may very well be! It could also simply be the specialized chemical reaction of the coral recognizing a potential for food/absorption of something it wants. Dosing aminos to achieve a super concentration in the water stream may elicit the corals natural response but may be nothing more than the Pavlov's Dogs reaction, or the Mcmullen pizza reaction where my belly growls and I drool every time I see and smell pizza

That said, perhaps like the article suggested, feed phytoplankton and or zooplankton.

I am curious though what others thoughts are on the article. I want AA's to work, so much so that because of this post I ordered acropower to see if I notice a difference.

Should ordered elos aminos

 

[dewboy1127]

I am thinking either a small micron food or even some skimmate

I use roti feast ,oyster feast, dr g oyster magnifique,dr g sps max ....not all at once but something different most everytime than time before a lil after dosing elos aminos

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I am thinking either a small micron food or even some skimmate

So the idea would be dosing aminos just prior to get more of it consumed? That might be useful. I've never heard of anyone experimenting with that, and it may be hard to know if it was working or not.

 

[PeterErc]

ok, so if amino's break down into nitrogen, shooting in the dark here but what about this product
Guaranteed Analysis
Total Nitrogen (N) 0.5%
0.4% water soluble Nitrogen
0.1% water insoluble Nitrogen
Derived from kelp.
0.09% vitamin B1 from Thiamine Hydrochloride

sds shows isopropyl alcohol 1.80% and acetic acid 2.0%

https://www.hydrofarm.com/downloads/fc/SDS Superthrive 5.27.15_6886.pdf

here's a link to heavy metals, which from reading isn't looking promising

http://oda.state.or.us/dbs/heavy_metal/detail.lasso?-op=eq&product_id=27356

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I cannot tell what its actual chemical components are.

 

[diesel3443]

So the idea would be dosing aminos just prior to get more of it consumed? That might be useful. I've never heard of anyone experimenting with that, and it may be hard to know if it was working or not.

Precisely. However your right, I will have no idea if it's working or not.

I do hope that with dosing the aspartic/glutamic blend that it will provide enough nitrogen to bring my nitrates up to 2-5 ppm and I can stop dosing potassium nitrate or sodium nitrate

 

[scardall]

Acropower is a Julian Sprung product. Two Little Fishes. and the link for ME Amino extender. Is one of these better than the other????

http://mecoral.com/product/me-amino-polyp-extender/

 

[PeterErc]

I cannot tell what its actual chemical components are.

yea, that's the mystery? proprietary blend??, a buddy had me dosing KZ flat worm stop while I was watching his tank. I smelled the FWS and it reminded me of Super Thrive product, the odor is a little different though.

 

[PeterErc]

here's Mark's thread on his product

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/aspartic-acid-and-glutumic-acid-as-a-carbon-source.196162/

 

[McMullen]

I like the idea of dosing AA's to elicit the "feeding response," or better PE, then feeding the coral. In theory this seems like it should work. However, there is of course a limit to how much nutrition the coral and zooxanthellae absorb/digest. I guess thats the big mystery! Perhaps you'll notice an explosion of growth……that would be fantastic!!

 

[dewboy1127]

Not sure its relation to the aminos exactly but everytime i put aminos in my tank my cleaner shrimp always come out and look like trying get something out of water lol