Do pinapple sponges require silica for survival?

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I got a lot of them and they soooo adorable. I literally want to have them in my tank forever.

Question, will these guys only survive with silica?
 
I got a lot of them and they soooo adorable. I literally want to have them in my tank forever.

Question, will these guys only survive with silica?
I’m also interested in this as I have a ton and they’ve never died since appearing 2 years ago.
 
@Randy Holmes-Farley

I remember reading an article/post of your about a test we can do to know if a sponge contains silica to make the spicules or calcium carbonate, or organics.

I know the test involves muriatic acid, and I think bleach? Not mixed together of course.

I remember reading something like if the sponge doesn’t fully dissolve in muriatic acid than it’s made of silica, and thus requires silica for survival.

Do you have the information to do that testing? I want to find out what my pineapple sponge is made from. That article would be great if you can find it for me.
 
@Randy Holmes-Farley

I remember reading an article/post of your about a test we can do to know if a sponge contains silica to make the spicules or calcium carbonate, or organics.

I know the test involves muriatic acid, and I think bleach? Not mixed together of course.

I remember reading something like if the sponge doesn’t fully dissolve in muriatic acid than it’s made of silica, and thus requires silica for survival.

Do you have the information to do that testing? I want to find out what my pineapple sponge is made from. That article would be great if you can find it for me.
Pineapple Sponges (genus Sycon) are in the taxonomic class of Calcarea. Sponges in this class are characterized by having spicules made of calcium carbonate, and Sycon is in the order Leucosolenoida (whose skeletons are composed entirely of their spicules), so I can’t imagine them needing the silica for their structure. However, from all of the anecdotal reports I’ve read, these sponges are silica limited, so I’m curious if they really are, and what they would need the silica for.
 
Interesting. My last tank used to have lots of them but for the most part all disappeared over time. Recently I’d dosed a tiny bit of guillards f2 fertilizer which I think is known to have silica. phosphates got a bit too low and I couldn’t find my mono potassium phosphate solution I’d made so I used a tiny bit of guillards initially in the meantime.

It could be a coincidence but since adding the guillards id been seeing the pineapple sponges popping up here and there again. right up until I took the tank down to upgrade to a new one.
 
not sure if this is the article your referring to........?

by Randy Holmes-Farley | Jan 15, 2003

Marine Organisms that Use Silica: Sponges​

Sponges are the second largest consumer of dissolved silica in the ocean, after diatoms.14 Many sponges use silica to form internal structures, called spicules, which help them retain their shape. In the case of the sponge Tethya aurantia, these spicules are needles of amorphous silica that comprise 75% of its dry weight. These spicules are 2 mm long and 30 mm wide.15

Most frequently, the spicules in sponges are hydrated amorphous silica, and also contain collagen, an organic material (although sometimes they are calcium carbonate). In order to direct the formation of these silica spicules, sponges produce enzymes that help control the silica deposition process. In the case of the sponges Suberites domuncula and Tethya auranita, an enzyme called silicatein is produced. When the silicate concentration is increased in the surrounding water from 1 mM (0.06 ppm SiO2) to 60 mM (3.6 ppm SiO2), the gene responsible for silicatein is strongly up- regulated, along with that for collagen.16 These experiments suggest that the sponge may be able to take advantage of silica concentrations as high as 60 mM, or alternatively, may be restricted in it’s growth, at levels below 60 mM.

It has been shown that in the sponge Halichondria panicea there is a correlation between the dissolved SiO2 in the seawater, and SiO2 content of the sponge.17 Moreover, it has been shown that silica uptake appears to require energy expenditure by the sponge, and that after conditions of starvation, uptake rates were greatly reduced. The ability of these sponges to remove SiO2 from the water column is sufficient so that in the summer they may actually compete with diatoms for available silicate.

In this same sponge, the rate of silica uptake is a function of the dissolved silica concentration in the seawater, with higher silica concentrations resulting in higher rates of uptake. The concentration at which the sponges take up silica at half of their maximal rate is 46 mM (2.8 ppm SiO2).14 Further, in certain waters it is believed that the growth of these sponges is limited by soluble silica, rather than by the availability of food. These sponges are capable of taking up 19 mmol/h per gram of tissue (maximally), so at 46 mM dissolved SiO2, they theoretically could take up 9.5 mmol/h per gram of tissue (though there is no evidence that the do take up silica that fast under normal growth conditions). A 50-gram sponge would then be able to take up 475 mmol/h, or 11.4 mmol (0.7 g) of silica in a day. A 100-gallon (378 L) aquarium with a high level of silica (30 mM or 1.9 ppm SiO2) only contains that much to begin with. Consequently, the potential
silica depletion in reef tanks with actively growing sponges could be substantial. Of course, if your sponges are not growing rapidly, then they likely are not using much silica. Likewise, if there is not much silica, then they may not be able to grow rapidly, even if other conditions are good.

This reason is, in fact, why I initiated dosing of silica (0.33 mM/day or 0.02 ppm SiO2/day) to my reef tank several years ago. I had a large sponge that I wanted to survive, and I had hoped that silica additions might alter the usual course of slow death for such sponges in most reef tanks. When I initiated that study, Julian Sprung told me that he had tried the same thing. In both of our cases the sponges eventually died, in my case lasting about 18 months. Perhaps we did not dose enough silica (0.33 mM/day is a small amount relative to the uptake numbers described above, and the concentration in the water column of my tank never rose above 0.8 mM (0.05 ppm SiO2) where it could be detected with a Hach kit). Alternatively, perhaps the food sources were not right or something else was wrong.
 
I got a lot of them and they soooo adorable. I literally want to have them in my tank forever.

Question, will these guys only survive with silica?
In general, sponges need silica. They are also filter feeders. I have an older system with no pineapple sponges or little fan worms. When my Ulva stopped growing, I started dosing ChaetoGro (trace elements) and within a couple weeks there was a explosion of growth of both. I can only think that the trace elements spurred microorganism growth that fed these life forms. Both are still around a year later.
 
Update:

I found the article. It was NOT written by Randy, it was written by Ronald L. Shimek, PhD: http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-07/rs/index.php

Pineapple sponges are calcium based. They do NOT require silica. Most sponges, like Dan mentioned, do require silica for their spicules.
 
With silica should Come diatoms ?

I have Enough sponge for 100 tanks and never have dosed silicate

following along .

if sponges are calcium based , do they consume calcium and alkalinity ?
 
With silica should Come diatoms ?

I have Enough sponge for 100 tanks and never have dosed silicate

following along .

if sponges are calcium based , do they consume calcium and alkalinity ?
To my understanding, yes - The calcareous sponges are calcium carbonate based just like stony coral skeletons (in fact, some calcareous sponges produce spicules of aragonite).
 
With silica should Come diatoms ?

I have Enough sponge for 100 tanks and never have dosed silicate

following along .

if sponges are calcium based , do they consume calcium and alkalinity ?
Most sponges in the world contain silica.

Most of the sponges in our reef tanks are calcium based. Some calcium based also may contain silica, while others don’t have any silica.

With silica you may encourage diatoms.
 

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