Do we really need to add supplements?

[mike007]

If we do sceduled water changes do we really need to add supplements? It seems to me that all the vendors are trying to sell us all this stuff for us to buy that maybe causes more harm than benifit. Personally i used to rely on water changes only without adding anything else and now i have started adding supplements which seem to be causing problems. I think that keeping things simple may be the correct way to go without adding all these chemicals to our tanks. Can these people really match the parameters of natural seawater?

 

[Reefing Madness]

True, very true. But they sell that stuff to us peeps that don't do normal WC. :bigsmile:

 

[ritter6788]

Water changes won't keep up with my tank's demand. I dose daily with dosing pumps.

No amount of water changes could maintain a heavy hard coral tank. Maybe 100% per day. It's cheaper more reasonable to dose supplements that are needed.

 

[Mike J.]

Mike, if you have a heavily stocked coral tank, you would have to do water changes every day to keep up with the demand and that can get very costly. There are reasons to dose. I am a big believer in just using kalkwasser as long as possible. Having consistent parameters is extremely important and not having big sudden changes.

 

[RichieT]

Depending on what kind of coral you have at some point the uptake of calcium is going to outpace the amount you put in during water changes. Unless all you have is softies

 

[Mike J.]

Whoops, Ritter beat me to it.

 

[DSP]

If your tank is stalked with lots of sps coral then you would want to add suppliments to keep things stable.But with an lps and softie tank waterchanges is plenty imo.

 

[mike007]

My tank is a mixed reef with various corals and i don't have a big swing in parameters as many do. I do understand the demands of the the sps tanks. But my concern is are these supplements safe for our tanks?

 

[RichieT]

Supplements is a pretty general term. All of the supplements can be disastrous if used incorrectly. If you are worried about getting harmful impurities from some of the supplements then I'd stay away from newer products until they are proven safe by other reefers. From a chemical standpoint, the stuff that makes these supplements up is pretty standard and has mandatory requirements for purity. That doesn't mean that there won't be a bad batch here or there, but the same can be said from adding manmade salt to your tank.

 

[Wrx5803]

Its hard to say good are bad with the general term "suppliments". If you mean code a and b I think enough people use them to keep up alk. And cal. They are safe. Like everyone else said I could not sustain my tank on water changes alone. If your are talking about stuff like coral kolor or vn then its hard to say. My sps looks just as good without dosing as it did a year ago when I did. So I dont intend on using them.

Sent Via the R2R Forum APP

 

[jackson6745]

IMO calcium, magnesium, and magnesium additives are a must to keep up with calcification demands in a tank with lots of hard corals or clams. If you have mostly soft corals, water changes are enough. Trace mineral additives, "vitalizer" and "blackpowder type additives, purple up etc.......... These are not necessary. In most cases these supplements are added arbitrarily to systems. I find it hard to believe that someone can notice a difference in their reef specifically linked to a trace mineral additive, especially since there are so many other changing variables.

 

[mcarroll]

Simple rule if thumb will guide you safely down the supplement aisle:

Don't add anything you don't test for.*

You may eventually find an exception you want to make, but that one's usually good for a lot of miles.

-Matt

* And if you can't tell what's in it you certainly can't test for it, right?


Sent Via the R2R Forum APP

 

[shred5]

If we do sceduled water changes do we really need to add supplements? It seems to me that all the vendors are trying to sell us all this stuff for us to buy that maybe causes more harm than benifit. Personally i used to rely on water changes only without adding anything else and now i have started adding supplements which seem to be causing problems. I think that keeping things simple may be the correct way to go without adding all these chemicals to our tanks. Can these people really match the parameters of natural seawater?

Only calcium, buffer for kh and magnesium because we know corals use them and can be tested for..

Water changes are enough and all other elements should be kept near natural saltwater levels. Problem is we do not know at what rate most of these other things in seawater are used up by corals.. If they are not used up and you keep adding them at what point may they become toxic. This why I don't like most too part additives because they also contain these other elements like iron, strontium, copper etc. . Its also the reason I do not like all these amped up salt now adays. This is also why I like water changes to keep some of these levels down..

Kalkwasser and magnesium are pretty much it.

 

[AZDesertRat]

I run a calcium reactor for calcium and alkalinity then monitor and dose a two part magnesium supplement as indicated by the testing. Nothing else other than routine, often infrequent water changes.

 

[beaslbob]

One thing to consider is that water changes alone will limit but not prevent the build up/depletion of anything.

consider you are doing a certain fraction of water change (fracofwc), every number of days (nofds) with water with a certain amount of something (replacemnt something), and the tank is changing that something each day (daychange). Where will the tank wind up when the amount before (amtb4) a water change is always the same.

amtb4= (replacement something)+[{(daychange)*(nofds)}/(fracofwc)]

for instance assume you have 400ppm in the replacement water(replacement something), the tank is consuming 1ppm/day(daychange) and you change 1/10 (fracofwc)of the water every 10 days(nofds).

amtb4=(400ppm)+[{(-1ppm/day)*(10 days)}/(1/10)]= 400ppm-10/(1/10)=400ppm-100ppm=300ppm

Which is why we have to dose calcium in our reef tanks.

my .02

 

[Reefing Madness]

One thing to consider is that water changes alone will limit but not prevent the build up/depletion of anything.

consider you are doing a certain fraction of water change (fracofwc), every number of days (nofds) with water with a certain amount of something (replacemnt something), and the tank is changing that something each day (daychange). Where will the tank wind up when the amount before (amtb4) a water change is always the same.

amtb4= (replacement something)+[{(daychange)*(nofds)}/(fracofwc)]

for instance assume you have 400ppm in the replacement water(replacement something), the tank is consuming 1ppm/day(daychange) and you change 1/10 (fracofwc)of the water every 10 days(nofds).

amtb4=(400ppm)+[{(-1ppm/day)*(10 days)}/(1/10)]= 400ppm-10/(1/10)=400ppm-100ppm=300ppm

Which is why we have to dose calcium in our reef tanks.

my .02

 

[mike007]

Understand what you are saying but does that hold true for every tank? Some peoples tanks dependant on what bioload and type of corals they may have may not consume elements as say a full blown sps tank.

 

[Planedoc]

Mike, if you have a heavily stocked coral tank, you would have to do water changes every day to keep up with the demand and that can get very costly. There are reasons to dose. I am a big believer in just using kalkwasser as long as possible. Having consistent parameters is extremely important and not having big sudden changes.

+1 on this
There are many things we can test for that we can control. There are things we can't test for and can't control. It's important to do regular water changes to make sure the things we can not control maintain balance. With a quality salt mixture and frequent water changes the untestable things will be kept in check. A normal water change can not meet the demands of some tanks that eat up calcium and magnesium at large rates. It's more economical to supplement between water changes to meet the demands of the tank. This can only be done by testing. It is still important to do water changes to replace and balance the other many many compounds in natural sea water that we can not test for.

Tapatalk on Galaxy S3

 

[mike007]

I do test every week and my tank is a mixed reef. I am lucky because i only have to add very little to maintain my parameters between water changes. The reason i started this thread was to get opinions.

 

[Liquid360]

I'm all about water changes, good salt, good water. My dad raised a 500g reef in the 80's and not once added a thing except calcium through a reactor. Personally I believe additives are a scam. IMO!!!!!!!