Does this fish have something?

[diablo243]

Hey all, a friend recently rescued a biocube 28 that had a blue tang (Dory) a pair of large clowns and some other fish. The tang is only a couple inches long and I have a lightly stocked 90 so he asked me to take it and then once he grows some more move him in in a year or two. Ever since getting him into WT he has acted strange, laying on his side sitting with fave in corner. In my research I have read this is normal and they tend to be "weird" fish. He is starting to move around more and has some markings on his face around his eyes that I can't tell if it's just coloring and normal or some sort of disease and I need to start treatment. If anyone can please help identify I would appreciate it. Should be noted in the BC he was an active swimmer and eater and did not show signs of sickness there, however I never saw his face close enough to see if these markings were there or not. Thanks all!

Oh yeah sorry you have to zoom into pic as he would not stay on the side of the tank I was one to take pic.

 

[melypr1985]

He looks pretty good. Most of these guys will have what I call "freckles" on the face but not pock marks. Like this:

They can be weird fish, but as long as he's eating well, then you should be able to get some good vitamins (selcon or vitachem for example) into him to help out.

 

[diablo243]

Yeah so far I haven't seen him eat, put a price of Nori in and looks like it's been picked at. Tried to spot feed with baster but he's like a frigging fainting goat lol put the baster in and he falls on his side and just lays there until I go away for a couple mins. Thanks for the feedback, I saw pics with similar marks but they were all on photo sites with no commentary so wasn't 100% sure.

 

[Humblefish]

Could have the very early stages of HLLE:

Head & Lateral Line Erosion "HLLE":

Symptoms - HLLE literally looks as though the skin is rotting or peeling off the fish. Affected areas usually include the face and lateral line, and may be white in color.

Treatment options - This is more of a condition than an actual disease. Since no one can agree on the exact cause, all you can do is address all of the following theories regarding HLLE:

1) Stray voltage - Use a titanium ground probe & test your tank for stray voltage.
2) Running carbon - Don’t use it, or use only premium grade carbon.
3) Nutritional deficiency - Feed high quality nutritional foods. Some have had success reversing the effects of HLLE by soaking food in “fish vitamins” and also feeding nori.

 

[Paul B]

That fish definitely has HLLE like many, or most hippo tangs get. Merideth is correct some of them have "freckles" but freckles are normally rounder and not blending together. HLLE is not deadly and not contagious. No one knows the cause or cure although you will find numerous theories. I have my own theory but I don't want to get into that. (It does come from captivity as wild fish don't get it) Hippo tangs also should not be in a quarantine tank or any tank without tight hiding places. They are not a PVC fish. If you ever dove with them you will see they are very skittish and need to dive into a tight place in a coral head every few minutes or whenever they see something even remotely scary like a shadow of a larger fish.
They were built to enter tight places and don't feel secure unless they can. That is why yours is laying on his side and acting weird. He is trying desperately to hide and is very stressed. Stress will probably cause his HLLE to progress faster. He will eventually lose the pigment on his entire face then it progresses down his sides. You can slow it down or even stop it if you give him the living conditions he needs. It is very hard to reverse once it progresses to far.

 

[diablo243]

He's the only guy in that tank and I want what's best for him, what can I add to the QT tank for him to help him?

 

[Humblefish]

He's the only guy in that tank and I want what's best for him, what can I add to the QT tank for him to help him?

A couple pieces of LR that you don't mind sterilizing afterwards.

 

[diablo243]

Does it have to be LR? Can it be just dried rock? I have some pieces of that around but not much LR to spare

 

[Humblefish]

Does it have to be LR? Can it be just dried rock? I have some pieces of that around but not much LR to spare

I've seen ammonia spikes when using dry rock - even with a HOB present utilizing a "seeded" sponge inside of it. I do not fully understand why this happens, except perhaps bacteria begin colonizing the rock and that causes a mini-cycle.

 

[4FordFamily]

Does it have to be LR? Can it be just dried rock? I have some pieces of that around but not much LR to spare

Dried is fine typically but live better. For what it's worth I've had many hippo tangs through pvc quarantine without issue. They are going to be happier when they graduate though, most definitely.

 

[diablo243]

So here is a thought, I have a well established 30L tank that I picked up cheap and has no fish in it except a tiny clown goby that is moving to my pico 4 as soon as my table gets here. It has plenty of rock and space, is it more stress to move him again to another tank to give him better habitat or add dry rock to QT and just watch parameters carefully to make sure I don't get any spikes? Just snuck downs stairs with no lights on and watched tank from across the room and he was actively swimming around and actually saw him eat too which is good.

 

[Humblefish]

So here is a thought, I have a well established 30L tank that I picked up cheap and has no fish in it except a tiny clown goby that is moving to my pico 4 as soon as my table gets here. It has plenty of rock and space, is it more stress to move him again to another tank to give him better habitat or add dry rock to QT and just watch parameters carefully to make sure I don't get any spikes? Just snuck downs stairs with no lights on and watched tank from across the room and he was actively swimming around and actually saw him eat too which is good.

Since you're already seeing behavioral improvement, I would just leave him right where he is. Fish don't necessarily "like" being in a bare bottom QT with "PVC caves", but most will adapt to it in time. It probably does stress them, but fish (like humans) don't die from stress. They die from disease, starvation, injury, get killed by another animal, and only if they're really lucky old age. The same things that take us down.

Stress may be the most overused word in this hobby.

 

[Paul B]

I feel "stress" is the biggest "killer" in this hobby. Humblefish is correct, stress won't kill a fish, but it may allow it to succumb to all diseases mentioned and a few more. We have stress if we lose our nose ring, break our thumb so we can't text. Discover cellulite or our girlfriend breaks up with us, especially if she is a Supermodel. (If she was homely, she probably had a nice personality) But our stress will not cause any disease. Most of us are not fish. A fish, especially a tang that normally never lives alone and never sees any PVC unless it dies and gets flushed is severely stressed all the time. That is the "main" reason fish such as tangs are considered ich magnets. It is also the main reason tangs get HLLE.
We, for some reason, try to keep fish in the furthest conditions we can from the sea and wonder why they get sick. More fish (especially tangs) die in quarantine than any place else. If you want to quarantine a tang, at least put something in there that remotely resembles the ocean. Get some cheap rock, not shot glasses, ashtrays, brake shoes from a 1955 Oldsmobile or anything else. Find some rocks and put them in there so the fish can hide from all sides. I bet that fish goes right into that and stays there. If you look at him close you may see a little smile start to form. He still won't like being there and his HLLE will probably get worse but in a quarantine tank, there is not much else you can do. Your tang will hate you no matter what you do. Later (asap) get him into a real tank with places to hide as tangs, especially Hippo's "need" that to survive. I have kept them for 40 years and have some hippo tangs as friends.
"Supermodel" may be the most overused word in this hobby.

 

[diablo243]

So I did add 3 pieces of dried rock yesterday and made a nice little structure with a cave for him and well he choose to hang out next to the foam filter lol. I take it to heart that fish are pets and want what's best and I also try to follow the advice of experienced hobbiests as well. I felt like I was helping this guy getting him out of a 28 cube but wanted to listen to the tried and true advice of QT your fish, admittedly though I have never read in detail what modifications should be accounted for with this particular breed. He looks much better, is swimming, eating and does not shy away when I get near tank so hope he is on the upswing. Ordered some vitamins to add to water and food and did my best to add more natural rock to QT for him. Fingers crossed he will come out healthy and hardy and if he doesn't I will take it to heart and feel really bad that I may have caused it.

 

[diablo243]

Just a quick update, direct fed him today for the first time and while the baster scared him a bit the second the food was out and baster removed he CHOWED!!! Makes me happy and appears to be on the upside on things

 

[Paul B]

He may like you yet.

 

[diablo243]

So I'll be dammed if I didn't go downstairs to the QT tank this morn and found him nestled away inside the PVC!!!!!! lol nutty fish

 

[Paul B]

 

[diablo243]

So still eating well and started with Vitachem vitamins today. Got a closer look and sadly looks like HLLE for sure.

Not sure how fast it can come on but guessing it started while living in a BC28 with a bunch of rock in it (little swim room). Hopefully it will not progress and with any luck the vitamins will help with that. Overall he looks healthy and so badly want to just get him into the main tank so he can socialize and stretch his fins a bit, but given the delicate nature of these guys to get or be sick I have to exercise patience [emoji19]

Thanks again for all the feedback and help, this community has been such a great lifeline as I get back into this hobby from a long absence.

 

[Humblefish]

@diablo243 It is in the very early stages. Very reversible at this point.