Dr Tim’s one and only

[moorjames]

Hey everyone,

so I have a new tank and been trying to get the nitrogen cycle going- I was sold the dr Tim’s one and only bottle but not the ammonia bottle. I put the bottle in a couple days ago and been testing the ammonia levels and nothing has really showed up. After doing a little research- I realize I didn’t have an ammonia source. So I go back to the pet store that sold me the dr time one and only and asked “shouldn’t I buy the ammonia bottle too?” And was told I didn’t need it. They said the bacteria in the tank will die and start the ammonia cycle. I don’t have fish or food in there and just wondering if that is correct? Or should I go back and buy the dr Tim’s ammonia.

 

[scott11106]

if you have no fish then yes
dr tims brs

 

[dherman15]

I had the same problem. I added food and within a couple days parameters changed

 

[arking_mark]

So you need an ammonia source. You have three choices:
1. Fishless with ammonium chloride
2. Fishless with food
3. Using a hardy fish

If you want a short controlled cycle you need #1 and to follow Dr Tim's guide which doses specific amounts of ammonia to the tank over a 10 day period to optimize the cycle speed.

2 & 3 are likely to take longer to stabilized the nitrogen cycle.

 

[moorjames]

Just to add- I did buy the wet live sand (caribsea) and the wet live rock that my local pet shop had cooking. So do I have enough bacteria in there that would start the process? Or should I still add an ammonia source?

my next question is- when would you HAVE to use the dr Tim’s ammonia chloride?

 

[arking_mark]

Just to add- I did buy the wet live sand (caribsea) and the wet live rock that my local pet shop had cooking. So do I have enough bacteria in there that would start the process? Or should I still add an ammonia source?

my next question is- when would you HAVE to use the dr Tim’s ammonia chloride?

Fishless Cycling | DrTim's Aquatics

 

[Reefman71]

Hey everyone,

so I have a new tank and been trying to get the nitrogen cycle going- I was sold the dr Tim’s one and only bottle but not the ammonia bottle. I put the bottle in a couple days ago and been testing the ammonia levels and nothing has really showed up. After doing a little research- I realize I didn’t have an ammonia source. So I go back to the pet store that sold me the dr time one and only and asked “shouldn’t I buy the ammonia bottle too?” And was told I didn’t need it. They said the bacteria in the tank will die and start the ammonia cycle. I don’t have fish or food in there and just wondering if that is correct? Or should I go back and buy the dr Tim’s ammonia.

I’ve been doing their email support, told two different things? The video tells you another thing? I’m going to call BRS Monday. Don’t plan on getting any help out of Dr. Tim’s

 

[DWill]

I’ve been doing their email support, told two different things? The video tells you another thing? I’m going to call BRS Monday. Don’t plan on getting any help out of Dr. Tim’s

Just print the fishless cycle info on Dr. Tim’s site follow that, it will work. You can also just add 4 drops per gallon of ammonium chloride and sit back and wait. that will also work.

just make sure you heat the tank and whatever salt you use has a a pH of at least 8.0 preferably a little height. Pretty much any salt made for reefing will have that. Also top the tank with fresh water when water evaporates, just as you will when it up and running.

If you don’t follow the Dr. Tim’s info and just use ammonium chloride after a couple days test for ammonia every two to three days. Depending on the size of the tank and the amount of One and Only you use, you may not ever see ammonia, though likely you will.

After you see ammonia is decreasing or see it gone start testing for nitrate. When you see nitrate your basically cycled at that point. At that point you can do a water change. Your done.

If you want to “test” that your tank is cycled, though it’s not really necessary; add enough ammonium chloride to bring the tank to 1 ppm ( 4 drops per gallon of Dr. Tim’s ammonium chloride). Wait here a half our or so. Test for ammonia, you will see it. Within a day, maybe a little longer (24-36 hrs) test for ammonia again. You should be back at zero. Test nitrate again, it should be slightly higher.

A couple things to be aware of no matter how you cycle your tank.

Some tests kits are difficult to tell when ammonia is at at zero. Salifert for instance will generally always look cloudy and you’ll think you’re stuck at .5 PPM. No matter what test kit you use test for nitrate. When you see nitrate your tank is basically cycled. Keep testing for nitrate it will stop increasing when the tank is completely cycled, assuming you don’t feed it any more ammonia. I always do the cycle test I mentioned above that will cause a decrease in ammonia and increase in nitrate quickly. Then you’ll know you’re cycled. At that point do a water change and your ready to go.

In my opinion buying a nitrite test kit is a waste of money. All testing for nitrite really does is tell you the tank is cycling. Nitrite will increase as ammonia starts to decrease. Nitrite will start to decrease when Nitrate starts to form. It will decrease rapidly and drop zero rapidly as Nitrate builds. It a indicator the tank is cycled, but really not critical. You accomplish the same thing by test for a peak in nitrate and/or testing the cycle.

Last, if you see ammonia hit 2 PPM ( you shouldn’t if you don’t add too much ammonium chloride ) do water change to bring it down.

Really if you just download the Dr. Tim’s info and follow it you shouldn’t have any problems. Your timing may not match exactly, each tank is different. Just don’t move to the next step until you see the result of the step your on.

 

[moorjames]

I ended up going back and buying the Dr Tim’s Ammonia Chloride and adding it. I kept getting 2 different things- most online said I need an ammonia source while the locals said I didn’t- the bacteria I added will start the ammonia process on its own. I didn’t want to be 2 weeks into and find out nothing started- so figured for $3 (small bottle) it would cure my curiosity

 

[Reefman71]

Just print the fishless cycle info on Dr. Tim’s site follow that, it will work. You can also just add 4 drops per gallon of ammonium chloride and sit back and wait. that will also work.

just make sure you heat the tank and whatever salt you use has a a pH of at least 8.0 preferably a little height. Pretty much any salt made for reefing will have that. Also top the tank with fresh water when water evaporates, just as you will when it up and running.

If you don’t follow the Dr. Tim’s info and just use ammonium chloride after a couple days test for ammonia every two to three days. Depending on the size of the tank and the amount of One and Only you use, you may not ever see ammonia, though likely you will.

After you see ammonia is decreasing or see it gone start testing for nitrate. When you see nitrate your basically cycled at that point. At that point you can do a water change. Your done.

If you want to “test” that your tank is cycled, though it’s not really necessary; add enough ammonium chloride to bring the tank to 1 ppm ( 4 drops per gallon of Dr. Tim’s ammonium chloride). Wait here a half our or so. Test for ammonia, you will see it. Within a day, maybe a little longer (24-36 hrs) test for ammonia again. You should be back at zero. Test nitrate again, it should be slightly higher.

A couple things to be aware of no matter how you cycle your tank.

Some tests kits are difficult to tell when ammonia is at at zero. Salifert for instance will generally always look cloudy and you’ll think you’re stuck at .5 PPM. No matter what test kit you use test for nitrate. When you see nitrate your tank is basically cycled. Keep testing for nitrate it will stop increasing when the tank is completely cycled, assuming you don’t feed it any more ammonia. I always do the cycle test I mentioned above that will cause a decrease in ammonia and increase in nitrate quickly. Then you’ll know you’re cycled. At that point do a water change and your ready to go.

In my opinion buying a nitrite test kit is a waste of money. All testing for nitrite really does is tell you the tank is cycling. Nitrite will increase as ammonia starts to decrease. Nitrite will start to decrease when Nitrate starts to form. It will decrease rapidly and drop zero rapidly as Nitrate builds. It a indicator the tank is cycled, but really not critical. You accomplish the same thing by test for a peak in nitrate and/or testing the cycle.

Last, if you see ammonia hit 2 PPM ( you shouldn’t if you don’t add too much ammonium chloride ) do water change to bring it down.

Really if you just download the Dr. Tim’s info and follow it you shouldn’t have any problems. Your timing may not match exactly, each tank is different. Just don’t move to the next step until you see the result of the step your on.

Dr. Tims told me to continue to add ammonia? My ammonia is zero, nitrite barely noticeable and nitrate is through the roof. I’m totally confused. I thought my tank was cycled as well? They said it was not. I should add ammonia 3 times?

 

[DWill]

Dr. Tims told me to continue to add ammonia? My ammonia is zero, nitrite barely noticeable and nitrate is through the roof. I’m totally confused. I thought my tank was cycled as well? They said it was not. I should add ammonia 3 times?

Yeah, if I’m not mistaken their procedure for fishless cycle on their website has 3 ammonium chloride additions. When I cycled my 25 lagoon this summer I had to run the procedure twice. For whatever reason it took forever to cycle. Them o e day I checked I tatted and they were basically off the chart. I have to do nearly a 100% water change to get them down.

 

[iamacat]

You made the correct choice getting the ammonia.

the ammonia bottle is most effective because it is an immediate, calculated, and traceable food source for the bacteria. The bacteria reproduce and consume the ammonia. It is recommended to add ammonia again to encourage more reproduction and to also time your ammonia drop. More bacteria = heavier bio load can be introduced

 

[Dbichler]

If your nitrates are through the roof your almost done cycling. Now just wait until ammonia is at 0 or .25 you can hardly tell the difference if using api. Then do 100% water change and add one fish. Couple weeks later add another. I personally avoid a clean up crew until I see the start of algae because I feel it’s wrong to add something that most likely will starve to death because of a lack of food source.

 

[brandon429]

Why no pics


with tank pics we could have saved you from making the unneeded retail purchase


post pics of your rock

 

[brandon429]

Precisely why in order to give cycle rules we need to see rocks:

Day 8 of 32 gallon cycle. New creatures!

Evening. Day 8 of cycling my 32 gal Fluval Flex. very excited about some emerging life. No fish/cleanup crew yet but STUFF IS HAPPENING Looks like 1) mushroom 2) bristleworm 3) no idea 4) no idea 5) (Setup) Any guesses on the last two? Thx

www.reef2reef.com

there are polar opposite types of cycling is why


live rock- don’t add ammonia, don’t add bottle bac for the love of Pete it shows up ready to go. mailed rock from the ocean isn’t the same as pet store live rock. Mailed rock is technically a third type of cycle (awaiting die off cessation) but that doesn’t apply here.


dry rock- do add bottle bac, do add ammonia. Polar opposites

we have to see the rocks or be told of origins (post #5) before we can ump a cycle

if you have one tiny live rock piece among fifty pounds of dry rock then proceed as you have, pics will show ratios so our recommends are matched.

the link above is a 100% skip cycle reef tank. There is literally nothing to be gained by any wait time now that days have passed and we can see from pictures no die off is happening. That above is pet store or reef tank cycled rock, it’s not mailed. We can see that in pics, even before they tell us where it came from.

 

[Reefman71]

I’ve got live rock in mine, put more ammonia in yesterday, third time. Nitrites high last. I’ll check it again tonight. I was uncertain on whether to do the third dose of ammonia or not because everything but nitrate what at zero nitrate was high hopefully I get back to that point and be done. My PH has been 7.8 to 7.9 throughout this process, it’s been almost 2 weeks. I appreciate everyone’s feedback back on here. Been very helpful. If I can’t get everything back to where it was before I added more ammonia. Zero ammonia barely any nitrite and nitrate blowing up I guess I’ll start over. This is the last time I’m using Dr. Tim’s.

 

[brandon429]

is your live rock like the ones from the thread I linked above, or different

blue pic levels make it hard to tell unlike the white light examples that showed living attachments from the example link

True live rock does not care if you want to recycle it over and over, it eats up the ammonia just fine (although you won’t see that with entry level test kits we discussed) but we pay for live rock to be able to opt out of additional purchases, and wait time.

this is how they start reef conventions on time for decades, nobody shows up thirty days early to set up the displays. They skip cycle, using...

cycling is for adding bacteria. Curious if your live rock had no bacteria when they were installed vs being 100% full of bacteria, the way you know is by living animals or coralline attached and whether it was wet vs dry when you installed it

an important working thesis in the thread: live rocks don’t require more bacteria to be added when we transport them. They carry it all, to save us from having to buy extra supports.

Dr Tim’s bacteria is for dry rock cycling. You won’t know if it worked or not if the rocks are already live and without seneye, nobody will get to see what their ammonia is really doing anyway. You might if lucky get to see dosed ammonia go up, then down in a ready system but getting to true zero is the classic issue with api we can see from search results.

 

[Reefman71]

The rock came out of my 125 gallon. The bulk of it came it. 10+ years old. It’s definitely “live” a few smaller pieces are new dry rock. So basically I didn’t need to use the One and only? Sorry the picture is so bad. It came from this tank

 

[Reefman71]

is your live rock like the ones from the thread I linked above, or different

blue pic levels make it hard to tell unlike the white light examples that showed living attachments from the example link

True live rock does not care if you want to recycle it over and over, it eats up the ammonia just fine (although you won’t see that with entry level test kits we discussed) but we pay for live rock to be able to opt out of additional purchases, and wait time.

this is how they start reef conventions on time for decades, nobody shows up thirty days early to set up the displays. They skip cycle, using...

cycling is for adding bacteria. Curious if your live rock had no bacteria when they were installed vs being 100% full of bacteria, the way you know is by living animals or coralline attached and whether it was wet vs dry when you installed it

an important working thesis in the thread: live rocks don’t require more bacteria to be added when we transport them. They carry it all, to save us from having to buy extra supports.

Dr Tim’s bacteria is for dry rock cycling. You won’t know if it worked or not if the rocks are already live and without seneye, nobody will get to see what their ammonia is really doing anyway. You might if lucky get to see dosed ammonia go up, then down in a ready system but getting to true zero is the classic issue with api we can see from search results.

@brandon429, thank you for your help! Much appreciated. I think I have a idea of what’s happening and what to do next.