Dr Tim One & Only - water parameter unchanged for 30 days

[provia]

Hi guys, I began my fishless cycle one month ago and during the month I observed absolutely no change in my water parameter. I'm quite frustrated and not sure what's the next action is. I am using aqua one 160L.

Here's the timeline:

Day 1: 120ml dr tim one and only with amonia dosing to 2ppm, skimmer off for the next 48 hours
Days 2-21: amonia 2ppm, nitrite 0.1-0.2, nitrate almost zero.
Day 21: 60ml dr tim one and only, skimmer off for the next 7 days.
Days 21 - 30: amonia 2ppm, nitrite 0.1-0.2, nitrate almost zero.

The test kit is from sera BTW.

The top of the skimmer (where the bubbles come out) turned green on day 14 but I am not expecting algae since there's no live rock.

Thanks in advance.

 

[glency]

Same bottle of One and Only? Check expiration date? That would be my only guess. Or, a bad test kit.

 

[Rovert]

No reason to not also try Microbacter7. It's only money.

Another option might be a bad test kit - expired reagents.

 

[Spare time]

The bottle could have been dead if it was exposed to extreme heat or cold (I know extreme cold will but I'd imagine heat would too if it got too hot).

Was the skimmer on when you added the bacteria?

 

[Reef.]

No need for the skimmer at all whilst cycling.

Ammonina tests are not great, even if you never used dr Tim’s p, after 30days you are likely cycled.

I would either buy salifert nitrate test kit to check or take a sample to your LFS and get them to check.

 

[provia]

Same bottle of One and Only? Check expiration date? That would be my only guess. Or, a bad test kit.

No they are two different bottles from the same LFS, before pouring the second bottle in I was suspecting that as well, but now either the store sold me two bad bottles in a row or I am just very unlucky.

The bottle could have been dead if it was exposed to extreme heat or cold (I know extreme cold will but I'd imagine heat would too if it got too hot).

Was the skimmer on when you added the bacteria?

The skimmers were off when I added them. 48 hours after I poured the first bottled in I turned on the skimmer according to the instructions (huge mistake I know) and the skimmer spit out 35L of water, it's almost like a 20% water change. I realised the skimmer probably killed the bateria to soon and did not turned on the skimmer for 7 days at the second time I used dr tim. I guess I just shouldn't turned that on at all when cycling.

No reason to not also try Microbacter7. It's only money.

Another option might be a bad test kit - expired reagents.

I still haven't ruled out the damage of using tap water. But if the tap water turned out to be OK I'll definitely switch to other brands.

No need for the skimmer at all whilst cycling.

Ammonina tests are not great, even if you never used dr Tim’s p, after 30days you are likely cycled.

I would either buy salifert nitrate test kit to check or take a sample to your LFS and get them to check.

Yeah big mistake I know, had I known better I wouldn't follow dr tim's instructions. I'll definitely bring water to my LFS tomorrow. I know cycling is a waiting game but 30 days of zero progress is just frustrating..

 

[brandon429]

This cycle is done. 100% no cycle at 30 days with green water isn't cycled. You have a cheap misreading non digital test kit like all other false stalls. If you had seneye: you'd see cycled. Trust you are cycled because all cycling charts say you are by day 30

There's no dead animals that your tank couldn't carry as proof, your only proof is a single misreading test kit. When this happens to one million api kit owners, the false stall, their peers send them to a pet store for confirmation and the pet store uses cheap non digital kits just the same.


Cycle umps: watch out for simply accepting any stated param as fact. You've never seen a stalled cycle in your entire life, this won't be the first one. You've only seen and reacted to levels approximated from non digital kits reported to you as nh4 not nh3 which isn't a stall.
You added way too much ammonia as we are trained to do unnecessarily, and that's fouled the kit reading but the ammonia has cleared just fine.

 

[brandon429]

Algae hitches into the tank via air and by prep water contamination...you didn't need live rock to bring it in, new algae growth is an absolute confirmation of ammonia control ability because it takes days/weeks to establish new visual growth and by then you've passed the dates of param control from a cycling chart. It's a direct visual verifier that isn't commonly known in forums


You don't have an ammonia problem you have added too much, it's being converted into algae fuel soon to be a real headache when lights and feed begin full time, this is why we should never dose to 2 ppm. We should provide far less initial dose, .5 ppm is plenty and cheap test kits deal with that level better

Over dosing ammonia at the start is what wrecks lots of cycling tanks a few weeks after startup, they pump algae fuel into the water out of trained fear of an incomplete cycle.

You need a huge water change now that could have been avoided with a different cycling approach.

The rules that forums and Dr Tim promotes online will specifically rob you of cycling trust and cause you to concern over false stalls while 100% ignoring and not prepping for fish disease. You will be tricked by false old cycling science claims into buying more bottle bac thinking yours is dead. Api owners here in the states go through this daily we see.

It didn't matter that your ammonia kit isn't api. You're getting the exact same consequences either way, by not owning a digital nh3 meter. You'll need to apply and trust a new set of cycling rules since you don't have a way to test correctly.

Here's the new rules

How to unstick any seemingly stuck cycle

Updated Cycling Science in Action This is a testless reef tank cycling thread, the only one from any board. If you ever had trouble with reef tank cycling in the past, you won't any longer after working some jobs with us. chances are you are using/about to use a method of reef tank cycling...

www.reef2reef.com

- we don't add 2 ppm ammonia there, we add a fraction of that amount and we wait a mere ten days to be completed. We prefer fish food to ammonia cycling actually. A timeline system vs a testing system is shown for 30 pages, we don't care what cheap kits say there

- all pages are false stalls fixed, like your tank.

- all new fish live fine so will yours
- aim all your concerns now at disease preps, your cycle was ready two weeks ago.

- people don't read big links it's scary and tldr. Post #2 there above directly shows a non digital kit misreading for two weeks straight as a seneye in the same home same tank read .04 ammonia. The non digital reading was 'stuck' at 1 ppm, which was a misread

Your cycle directly meets all rules from that thread of being ready, not stalled.

 

[Dr. Reef Verified Sponsor]

put some food in the tank every 3 days and you will see the ammonia goto 0. These bacteria in bottle are not used like you did. they are dosed and fish are added right away.

 

[Garf]

No they are two different bottles from the same LFS, before pouring the second bottle in I was suspecting that as well, but now either the store sold me two bad bottles in a row or I am just very unlucky.

The skimmers were off when I added them. 48 hours after I poured the first bottled in I turned on the skimmer according to the instructions (huge mistake I know) and the skimmer spit out 35L of water, it's almost like a 20% water change. I realised the skimmer probably killed the bateria to soon and did not turned on the skimmer for 7 days at the second time I used dr tim. I guess I just shouldn't turned that on at all when cycling.

I still haven't ruled out the damage of using tap water. But if the tap water turned out to be OK I'll definitely switch to other brands.


Yeah big mistake I know, had I known better I wouldn't follow dr tim's instructions. I'll definitely bring water to my LFS tomorrow. I know cycling is a waiting game but 30 days of zero progress is just frustrating..

You didn’t dechlorinate the tapwater?

 

[Dburr1014]

You didn’t dechlorinate the tapwater?

Or was it well water which is dechlorinated

 

[provia]

Hi guys, so I went to the LFS a few days ago and talked to them. Yes my water is treated with chloramine from tap and not dechlorinated. As a result my LFS thinks the chloramine is killing all the bacteria instantly. I dechlorinated my water isung seachem prime and poured in another bother of dr tim. Let's see how it goes.

 

[provia]

Did a test today and saw amonia decreased, great! but nitrite and nitrates are still zero. Where's the nitrogen gone??

 

[melbournedan]

This cycle is done. 100% no cycle at 30 days with green water isn't cycled. You have a cheap misreading non digital test kit like all other false stalls. If you had seneye: you'd see cycled. Trust you are cycled because all cycling charts say you are by day 30

There's no dead animals that your tank couldn't carry as proof, your only proof is a single misreading test kit. When this happens to one million api kit owners, the false stall, their peers send them to a pet store for confirmation and the pet store uses cheap non digital kits just the same.


Cycle umps: watch out for simply accepting any stated param as fact. You've never seen a stalled cycle in your entire life, this won't be the first one. You've only seen and reacted to levels approximated from non digital kits reported to you as nh4 not nh3 which isn't a stall.
You added way too much ammonia as we are trained to do unnecessarily, and that's fouled the kit reading but the ammonia has cleared just fine.

do you work for seneye?

 

[brandon429]

No I work for folks so helplessly confused by old cycling rules they couldn't proceed forward if given a half million dollar incentive to do so. You can tell by the number of jobs done in the link there's a fair demand for knowing when someone can plop fish in a tank with zero disease preps, it's the number one thing people want to know at the start of their setup

 

[gbroadbridge]

Hi guys, I began my fishless cycle one month ago and during the month I observed absolutely no change in my water parameter. I'm quite frustrated and not sure what's the next action is. I am using aqua one 160L.

Here's the timeline:

Day 1: 120ml dr tim one and only with amonia dosing to 2ppm, skimmer off for the next 48 hours
Days 2-21: amonia 2ppm, nitrite 0.1-0.2, nitrate almost zero.
Day 21: 60ml dr tim one and only, skimmer off for the next 7 days.
Days 21 - 30: amonia 2ppm, nitrite 0.1-0.2, nitrate almost zero.

The test kit is from sera BTW.

The top of the skimmer (where the bubbles come out) turned green on day 14 but I am not expecting algae since there's no live rock.

Thanks in advance.

If your cycle is 30 days old, you are completely cycled.

Just add a single fish

 

[melbournedan]

No I work for folks so helplessly confused by old cycling rules they couldn't proceed forward if given a half million dollar incentive to do so.

hahaha. there is a lot of confusing/misinformed info on the net. so it does make sense when there are literally hundreds of posts about a stuck cycle.

i have also read through your hundreds of post trying to work out what sort of situation i am in and i can’t really narrow it down.

bare bottom, dry caribsea life rock (minimal), dr tim’s one and only and ammonium chloride, using maxspect nano tech bio spheres as the main biological filtration (half a kilo). does this cycle fall under the same rules, running time is more important than test results ?

 

[gbroadbridge]

Hi guys, so I went to the LFS a few days ago and talked to them. Yes my water is treated with chloramine from tap and not dechlorinated. As a result my LFS thinks the chloramine is killing all the bacteria instantly. I dechlorinated my water isung seachem prime and poured in another bother of dr tim. Let's see how it goes.

Your LFS is just selling you stuff.

A bucket of water lefft outside will cycle in 30 days.

 

[melbournedan]

Your LFS is just selling you stuff.

A bucket of water lefft outside will cycle in 30 days.

“A bucket of water left outside will cycle in 30 days.”

now this is something i’m interested to hear more about.

 

[gbroadbridge]

“A bucket of water left outside will cycle in 30 days.”

now this is something i’m interested to hear more about.

The bacteria that cycle a tank are everywhere.

If you put a bucket of seawater outside and leave it alone with a pinch of food to create ammonia it will cycle.
Guaranteed.

You can add some bio media to speed things up.

Normally it will take 30-90 days.

You can speed the whole thing with a bottle of bac, which will work in 14 days.

The biggest con is the sale of Ammonia and Nitrite test kits. They are quite simply a ploy to watch a cycle that will happen anyway.