DSB Maintenance - a bit confused...

rocknut

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To give a little background on this, I have been running various reef tanks over the past ten years, so I have a basic understanding of most things reef, but every once in a while I realize that there are some basic, foundational subjects that I have probably never had a firm grasp on. Sand beds are one of those things, and I'm hoping to take a step back and better understand some of the basic elements of the how's, and why's, of sand beds, specifically the maintenance of a DSB.

When I set my first tank up about ten years ago, the majority of the tanks out there were running Deep Sand Bed setups, and the popular opinion was: don't put anything in the tank to disrupt the sand, no sifters, no fish that can stir things up, don't LOOK at the sand bed for too long. It was my understanding anyway that by adding a DSB, and cycling the tank with good live rock that the necessary creatures to populate the sand bed would migrate off of the rock, into the sand bed, and you would be on your way. I have also run a tank bare bottom, and my last sand bed was a shallow sand bed (the reason I have had so many different setups is because we rented for quite a few years, and inevitably the tanks had to come down every year or two for a move). My current tank has been up and running for 13 months, and is about 95% SPS corals. It is a 150 gallon with 10 square feet of floor space, and I have lots of flow, and a large Bubble King skimmer. Because of the high flow requirements of the tank, my sand bed ranges from about 4" in the middle of the tank to bare bottom at the edges. My tank was going great thru the spring, so good in fact that coupled with my biopellets, I ended up dosing KZ Pohl's Xtra (aminos), and noticed that after a few weeks the sand grains towards the middle of the tank started to turn a strange lime green color. I'm assuming that I was over dosing the aminos, and stopped, but not before a bloom of dinoflagellates. I have been dealing with the dinos for about four months now, and although I can't seem to totally get rid of them, they haven't taken over the tank either. Just enough to irritate me every time I look at the tank. :)

All this background (sorry) leads up to my actual questions. Basically, I have removed the biopellets, and am in the process of plumbing in an external frag tank that I will use as a macro algae refugium with as much additional live rock as I can fit in there. The goal being to provide a more balanced approach to processing nutrients in the tank. Not trying to start a discussion about biopellets - I know that they work - somehow in my tank I just feel like things got out of whack (user error I'm sure). This leads me to my sand bed...I am trying to address everything in the tank so that I can get the tank moving in the right direction again, so that I can then just let the tank run without changing anything else, and let it find its balance again. I realized last night that for all I know, the sand bed is the source of the extra nutrients in the tank, and that is fueling the dinoflagellate bloom? I did add a fighting conch a week ago, but haven't seen him do much yet. I guess I figure that these are my options:

1. add a sand sifting fish like a goby to constantly sift and move around the top layer of the sand bed? Again, from what I have read, opinions on this are EXTREMELY mixed.

2. pick a section of the sand bed to totally vacuum/clean each month, cycling thru the tank so about 1/6th of the sand bed is vacuumed every six months, leaving the majority undisturbed?

3. slowly start removing the majority of the sand bed until I am down to a 1" layer, and then just stir/vacuum the whole things regularly?

I have tried to do as much reading as possible on this subject, and am always surprised at how much opinions on this vary. I do run across a lot of statements like: the reefer has to be willing to accept the responsibility of additional regular maintenance if they are using a sand bed that is greater than an inch. I have no problem doing extra maintenance, but am confused as to what this maintenance is? Like I said, my understanding has always been to absolutely leave the sand bed alone.

Like I said, the sand bed is only about 13 months old, but I suppose that if I haven't been maintaining it correctly, it could have collected enough nutrients over this time to be a problem? Here is a photo of the deepest section of my sand bed for reference:



Appreciate everyone's feedback, and experience/opinions on this. Again, just want to get things running in the right direction again.

Thanks,

Rocky
 
Put in a good cuc. Algae eaters and sand sifters. These will help with algae, detritus, uneaten food. Combo of snails, hermits, lawnmower blenny, urchins and such. Need the sand sifters to turn over the sand.
 
Put in a good cuc. Algae eaters and sand sifters. These will help with algae, detritus, uneaten food. Combo of snails, hermits, lawnmower blenny, urchins and such. Need the sand sifters to turn over the sand.

Thanks, tigerdragon. I have a fair number of snails (mostly Astrea and Turbos), and some small hermits now. Might need to add some more however. When I was running biopellets, I was getting so little algae on the rocks that I was worried about having too large a CUC, but since I have removed them, might be a good time to beef things up. Didn't think about a blenny - will they help turn over the sand bed as well? The ones I have had in the past seemed to only stick to the rock? Also hadn't considered an urchin. Thanks again!
 
Are you running a fuge? I have a fuge with rock rubble chaeto and an algae scrubber that is plumbed off my rtn
ImageUploadedByREEF2REEF1408034816.634184.jpg
ImageUploadedByREEF2REEF1408034839.535092.jpg
 
I have never kept a DSB so hopefully those that do can chime in. I am in agreement with others in that adding a mixed CUC with sand sifters will help and shouldn't be a problem. I would be hesitant to disturb (meaning you doing something) your existing bed in those deep areas.
 
Are you running a fuge? I have a fuge with rock rubble chaeto and an algae scrubber that is plumbed off my rtn
ImageUploadedByREEF2REEF1408034816.634184.jpg
ImageUploadedByREEF2REEF1408034839.535092.jpg

Nice, that ATS looks really good! I don't have a fuge at the moment, as I had originally built this system planning on using the biopellets and a big skimmer as my primary nutrient export. However, I have had to rethink some things with this dinoflagellate bloom, and I can't help but think that the pellets caused some sort of imbalance with the water chemistry, or maybe stripped the tank so clean that the absence of any other algae gave the dinos a foothold to start. Anyway, I just picked up a 20" x 20" frag tank yesterday from Advanced Acrylics, and I am going to plumb that into my sump. My plan is to pack this frag tank full of live rock, and some assorted macro algae. I also have a small-ish compartment in my sump that previously held my biopellet reactor (holds about 7 gallons), and I'm planning on returning the water from the frag/refugium into this chamber, and then add some chaeto to this sump chamber with a separate fuge light, before the water gets moved to the return pump chamber. I also added one a MarinePure 8" x 8" x 4" block to the sump, hoping this will pick up the slack reducing NO3 now that the biopellets are offline. I feel like I am addressing the major issues, but the sand bed was really bothering me, as all this work would be for nothing if the sandbed is pumping nutrients back into the tank faster than I can skim them out.
 
So, thinking that adding a Diamond Watchman Goby to address the sifting job might be a good choice? Additional Conch as well?
 
Goby is good how many conch's do you have? Might need 10 or more

Well, right now I only have the one conch I added last week. Seriously, I had it so drilled into my head "don't EVER add anything that will disturb the sand bed" that it never occurred to me to add anything to maintain it. :) Well, this is how we learn I guess...
Out of curiosity, why did you remove your biopellets and go with an ATS instead?
 
Bio pellets can strip all the trates you need for the scrubber and i wanted to go more natural. Did you look at liveaquaria? They have pkg recommendations based on tank size. As far as dsb when they said dont mess with they meant you dont vac it let cuc crew do work
 
Look some things up like Deep sand beds and Hydrogen sulfide or Hydrogen Sulfide and the reef aquarium. Some interesting stuff.
 
Looks like you have disturbed the bed at some point almost to me. I run a dsb is 4" minimum in places and 5 to 6" in other places. Cuc is good just be aware you don't want anything that will eat the natural bacteria or disturb the sand to much. I would say not to get a goby. Nassarius are good, conch may be a bit big and go a bit deep in the sand bed. You only want to mix up the top layer. There is some good info out there on them just do some research.
 
New York Steelo

New York Steelo has many education videos on Deep Sand Beds: Just google New York Steelo and visit his you-tube channel
 
Hi there Rocknut.

So I am in the process of setting up a tank with multiple nutrient export systems. BioPellets, Skimmer, Macro, DSB. I want to try and balance everything so they work together so I've bought a recirculating BioPellet reactor to tune the through flow. Might be worth looking into one if you want to run Macro also.
Also with regards to the DSB it certainly is one of the polarising topics amongst reefers. Everything I have read, including Dr Ron Shimek's book - Sandbed Secrets - seems to indicate that if a DSB is done properly it becomes the 'landfill' for organic matter ready to be broken down for the last time. Makes sense that detritus would settle in the DSB but I believe that's the point. The question I believe is "Will your sand bed deal with it or not?"
Most of what I have read about DSBs says that grain size is absolutely crucial. Have you looked into grain size? By the look of the picture you posted it almost looks like the grain size in your bed is too large? Have you measured your grain size?
 
Hi there Rocknut.

So I am in the process of setting up a tank with multiple nutrient export systems. BioPellets, Skimmer, Macro, DSB. I want to try and balance everything so they work together so I've bought a recirculating BioPellet reactor to tune the through flow. Might be worth looking into one if you want to run Macro also.
Also with regards to the DSB it certainly is one of the polarising topics amongst reefers. Everything I have read, including Dr Ron Shimek's book - Sandbed Secrets - seems to indicate that if a DSB is done properly it becomes the 'landfill' for organic matter ready to be broken down for the last time. Makes sense that detritus would settle in the DSB but I believe that's the point. The question I believe is "Will your sand bed deal with it or not?"
Most of what I have read about DSBs says that grain size is absolutely crucial. Have you looked into grain size? By the look of the picture you posted it almost looks like the grain size in your bed is too large? Have you measured your grain size?

Hello Pagey - thanks for your response.

I actually was using a recirculating biopellet reactor, and can definitely say that they work great. For whatever reason my tank's chemistry just got out of whack, I think. Biopellets, or any carbon dosing isn't to be taken lightly that's for sure. I think dealing with that much bacteria is much more of a balancing act than I anticipated. Seems like they either work great for people, or cause lots of problems.

I also agree that the grain size of my sand is certainly larger that the "sugar size" Dr. Shimek recommends. After spending the last few days reading a lot about this, I'm considering slowly removing the DSB and going to a SSB instead. I like the idea of adding sifters to the SSB and being able to vacuum with water changes so I KNOW I'm removing the nutrients. I think the combination of the wrong grain size, and the fact that my Wrasse dives down to the bottom in a different spot each night has probably disturbed the bed enough that it hasn't functioned correctly anyway. I am aware of the possibility of hitting sulfide pockets, but it might be worth the risk at this point because I am really wondering if the sand bed NOT functioning as it should (my fault) has basically just been storing waste and this is fueling, at least in part, my dinoglagellates.

Definitely need to give these options some more thought...
 

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