Ecotech radion apex control

John08007 · May 26, 2020

I have an apex, the slightly older black version, not the newest orange one. I am thinking about replacing my blackbox LED with a new gen 5 radion. Am i able to control this with the apex as is or do i need the wxm module?

SuncrestReef · May 26, 2020

The WXM cannot control the new Radion Gen 5's. Ecotech went their own direction for control apps and is not collaborating with Neptune for Apex support.

Older Radions (Gen 4, 3, etc.) can still be controlled with the WXM.

John08007 · May 26, 2020

Good to know, ive seen some mention of an app to control it. I just thought it could be done either way. Can i control a gen 4 without the wxm?

BighohoReef · May 26, 2020

John08007 said:
Good to know, ive seen some mention of an app to control it. I just thought it could be done either way. Can i control a gen 4 without the wxm?

Yes you can control the gen 4 lights with the WXM mod. The only ones that can't are the Gen5s because Ecotech is greedy. Don't get me wrong I have 3 MP10s 2 XR30s and planning on getting Versa dosers. I'm just mad because of them going proprietary corporate.

Bob Escher · May 26, 2020

BighohoReef said:
Yes you can control the gen 4 lights with the WXM mod. The only ones that can't are the Gen5s because Ecotech is greedy. Don't get me wrong I have 3 MP10s 2 XR30s and planning on getting Versa dosers. I'm just mad because of them going proprietary corporate.

Makes me mad too. There are several things I would love to have run under my APEX that won’t because of the propriety of them
i waited for the GEN5 but now I wont buy them.
i debated on the Kessil 360X too. Nope won’t buy that one either

SuncrestReef · May 26, 2020

John08007 said:
Good to know, ive seen some mention of an app to control it. I just thought it could be done either way. Can i control a gen 4 without the wxm?

Without a WXM, the only control you could have through the Apex would be to turn the lights on or off. You would not have any Apex control of color spectrum or intensity. You would need to control those through Ecotech's app.

BighohoReef · May 26, 2020

Bob Escher said:
Makes me mad too. There are several things I would love to have run under my APEX that won’t because of the propriety of them
i waited for the GEN5 but now I wont buy them.
i debated on the Kessil 360X too. Nope won’t buy that one either

The Gen4s are good lights, shoot I would go all the way back to the gen1s if I could. I'm currently running Gen4s and an Orphek OR3 LED over our tank. It looks amazing... sadly pictures don't do it justice

gcarroll · May 26, 2020

BighohoReef said:
Yes you can control the gen 4 lights with the WXM mod. The only ones that can't are the Gen5s because Ecotech is greedy. Don't get me wrong I have 3 MP10s 2 XR30s and planning on getting Versa dosers. I'm just mad because of them going proprietary corporate.

I’m lost on how this decision makes Ecotech greedy?

John08007 · May 26, 2020

Seems to be a lot.of complaints about the mobius not working. This worth.getting or stick to a gen4?

ca1ore · May 26, 2020

I used the launch of Gen5 as a great opportunity to get a couple more Gen4 pro lights at a good price. I concluded, after a brief dalliance with möbius and versa, that it’s not ready for me .... or I’m not ready for it. Quite happy for reeflink to run my radions and WXM to run my vortechs.

ca1ore · May 27, 2020

BighohoReef said:
Yes you can control the gen 4 lights with the WXM mod. The only ones that can't are the Gen5s because Ecotech is greedy. Don't get me wrong I have 3 MP10s 2 XR30s and planning on getting Versa dosers. I'm just mad because of them going proprietary corporate.

ETM has been moving away from apex for awhile now. I recall being a bit surprised that the gen4 radions retained WXM compatibility. Ironically, ETM is also moving away from their own reeflink product. Maybe it doesn’t sell all that well, but it is still a curious form of ‘greed’. In an era where point solution apps run on general hardware platforms, ETM may be on the right track with möbius. The free part is kind of nice. Wouldn’t it be ironic if, five years hence, mobius was recognized as the initial wave in a whole new breed of control.

DarthSimon · May 27, 2020

Interesting to see the New Apex Skylight. I’ve been running Radions for years and control via wxm has always been good.

I truly wonder why Eccotech wouldn’t adopt Apex Control???

John08007 · May 27, 2020

DarthSimon said:
Interesting to see the New Apex Skylight. I’ve been running Radions for years and control via wxm has always been good.

I truly wonder why Eccotech wouldn’t adopt Apex Control???

when is this suppose to come out, I've never heard anything about it

Reef man 89 · May 27, 2020

John08007 said:
when is this suppose to come out, I've never heard anything about it

Neptune dropped a little hit during a live stream a couple months back but said no more about to

BighohoReef · May 27, 2020

gcarroll said:
I’m lost on how this decision makes Ecotech greedy?

Ecotech is moving to a system that doesn't give you the option to use other company's products. It's good for the business but it ties you into one system, similar to the Apple ecosystem. I'm also a finance guy so when I look at some of the products I try to consider the cost to produce the good (designing, development manufacturing on and on), profit margins, and so on. Long story short the profit margin is high for all their products.

Ecotech makes some nice gear like I said I own a few pieces of equipment myself. I just get a little irritated when I read some of the product decisions, or have to order replacement parts like MP wetside's ($65 is pretty expensive especially when I only need to replace the ceramic in the middle). I do understand they have to run a business I just don't think LED/WiFi products really cost $840.

My argument isn't about not buying Ecotech products it's a mini rant at how expensive gear is for what you get.

In the end, I would still recommend the XR30/15 Gen 4's for the Neptune integration in addition to the money savings.

gcarroll · May 27, 2020

BighohoReef said:
Ecotech is moving to a system that doesn't give you the option to use other company's products. It's good for the business but it ties you into one system, similar to the Apple ecosystem. I'm also a finance guy so when I look at some of the products I try to consider the cost to produce the good (designing, development manufacturing on and on), profit margins, and so on. Long story short the profit margin is high for all their products.

Ecotech makes some nice gear like I said I own a few pieces of equipment myself. I just get a little irritated when I read some of the product decisions, or have to order replacement parts like MP wetside's ($65 is pretty expensive especially when I only need to replace the ceramic in the middle). I do understand they have to run a business I just don't think LED/WiFi products really cost $840.

My argument isn't about not buying Ecotech products it's a mini rant at how expensive gear is for what you get.

In the end, I would still recommend the XR30/15 Gen 4's for the Neptune integration in addition to the money savings.

Im just failing to understand how they are greedy. The price of the G5 is the exact same price of the G4. And mobius control is free so you don’t have to buy the Reef link. Mobius will control the vortech pumps, lights, Vectra pumps, and Versa dosing pumps. We know from interviews that there will also be wireless powerbars, and probes that will mobius compatible. That sounds like a low cost controller to me? Hell the majority of control is free on the app.

ca1ore · May 27, 2020

BighohoReef said:
Long story short the profit margin is high for all their products.

I seriously doubt profit margins are high for ANY aquarium business .... they wouldn’t be going out of business with such frequency if it were. Gross margins might be 50%, but they could also be a lot lower. Factor in all the other stuff and I’d doubt they’re much above 5% profit margin.

BighohoReef · May 27, 2020

@John08007 Sorry to take over your post... I would recommend the XR G4 Apex w/WXM if that is the route you're planning on going. I don't need to go into the bugs with the G5 and Mobius there are plenty of threads out there about that. Long term you can't really go wrong with Ecotech I still have a pair of XR30 Gen1s (I can't tell you how old they are), MP10s have been with me in this order 4yrs, 2yrs, less than a year. I sold my MP40s to get gyres which I love, the only downside is that they don't work with the Apex outside of turning it on and off.

John08007 · May 27, 2020

BighohoReef said:
@John08007 Sorry to take over your post... I would recommend the XR G4 Apex w/WXM if that is the route you're planning on going. I don't need to go into the bugs with the G5 and Mobius there are plenty of threads out there about that. Long term you can't really go wrong with Ecotech I still have a pair of XR30 Gen1s (I can't tell you how old they are), MP10s have been with me in this order 4yrs, 2yrs, less than a year. I sold my MP40s to get gyres which I love, the only downside is that they don't work with the Apex outside of turning it on and off.

This is kind of what I was thinking, I really like the idea of controlling it with my apex and I have seen a ton of negativity regarding the G5 and Mobius. I don't know too much about Ecotech, seems like there is a pro and non-pro? Whats the difference?

BighohoReef · May 28, 2020

John08007 said:
This is kind of what I was thinking, I really like the idea of controlling it with my apex and I have seen a ton of negativity regarding the G5 and Mobius. I don't know too much about Ecotech, seems like there is a pro and non-pro? Whats the difference?

Pulled from the Ecotech site: