Ep12: Finally the 4-month cycle explained! | BRS/WWC System

Do you use bacteria sources for your tank cycle, if so which one?

  • Don't use any, just let them come naturally.

    Votes: 21 16.5%
  • Bio-Spira

    Votes: 21 16.5%
  • Dr. Tim's One and Only

    Votes: 34 26.8%
  • Brightwell Microbacter7

    Votes: 37 29.1%
  • Prodibio

    Votes: 6 4.7%
  • AquaForest Bio S

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Red Sea Nitro Bac

    Votes: 6 4.7%
  • TLF BioPronto

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • BioZyme

    Votes: 2 1.6%

  • Total voters
    127
OK, but you aren’t off the hook just yet :)

Aren’t you guys keeping the stats on the sucesses and failures? Bases on balls? Number of first downs in a quarter? Points per shot on goal? If you did, the credibility of your claims could be enhanced. Of course, the downside is the stats might show that your aporoach has a fifty fifty chance of working but that’s OK it if you are really trying to innovate. Innovators in this hobby are needed.

I have seen you guys do some interesting things. You are soooo close to going beyond creating great PR.

Dan

Got to share your thoughts inspired this portion of today’s live episode. (Minute 43) Thanks for keeping it real :) we will do our best to keep learning and sharing!

 
can state something about BRS videos I think really reflects on them as science participants / aside from being a vendor:


What they make videos on we have work threads already running five years, and the obersvations line up with no collab. On many subjects. I can’t count on one hand how many single posters here I agree with more often than brs posters as irony

If I wasn’t constantly agreeing with their science at the same time I’m not buying from them (lfs shopper mostly) it would be fun to tangle for sixteen pages over recommended procedure. But they keep getting it right where all I can do is agree.
 
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Hope you don't mind answering some newbie questions.
1. Where do the green hair algae, diatom, cyano come from if the rocks are dry and no contamination, salt is newly mixed? In the air around us and the light will just "activate" them?
2. If we do turn on the light (grow light to be exact) to promote growth of these unwanted algae (and keep the cycling more alive, tank getting more mature), will they eventually die down during the 4 months? Maybe that would lower the chance that they will come back when we actually have corals and fish in?
3. Coralline algae needs lighting? Maybe turning on the light earlier will promote their growth?
 
1. The air routinely brings in bacteria, fungi, cyano depending on location, and micro algae that we see in aquatic or marine setups. Easy confirm: take a cup of water and dose it with planted tank fertilizer, set it in your windowsill and keep it topped off. Give it a few months (winter=cold=slower) doing nothing but topped off, colors change / scums form and the above manifests in varying ratios.

A new reef cycled that has no animals at all, just rocks formerly dry and dry sand will mimic in its invasions much of what the windowsill cup reflects, but the reef is ready to express new invasions like diatoms and reef associated invaders the very instant we add a snail. Or a pod. Or a tiny chunk of lr from another tank— a vector for the more reef tank specific items. no windowsill cup can ever get invasive dinos for example, or valonia- direct cellular transfer required. Dry sand use is rare, the majority of sand using cyclers are on wet bagged stuff, that counts as instant vectoring. Diatoms are universally associated with reef substrates and fluid/ wet bagged sand is an often not considered source since it looks clean in the bag.

2. Subjective answer and no five posters will agree. It’s my opinion that cycling is for bacteria you can’t see but you can still measure, and purposefully seeding your tank at any time with invaders like cyano and green hair algae have nothing to do with nitrification. We get those invaders in nine year old tanks, invasions have nothing to do with cycling but in 1982 they were sure it did and nobody updated the manual. All tanks will develop uglies if they’re left unguided at the start; I merely advocate cleaning them out like a gardener tends for dandelions. Everyone else leaves them in, and hopes for a near takeover as a -good sign-

The fact so many cyclers think these two are requisite actions is why I have ten years of algae restoration threads handy, running to this day with new entrants, keep the practice going by all means we love the work and challenge of undoing purposeful invasions.

3. Coralline needs light but not much and too much early light causes algae, seek your balance. Coralline is a handy bio indicator agreed, but if it doesn’t grow for someone there are other timing methods that can be used to cycle a tank besides coralline.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/the-microbiology-of-reef-tank-cycling.214618/

That link shows why I like BRS work. We never collaborate on anything yet we use highly similar approaches on actions like cycling, sandbed maintenance etc.

the type of procedural advice that can be offered in large work threads or on production videos such that consistency in outcome can be measured across a thousand web poster attempts isn’t widely varying advice...it’s got some overlapping themes for sure.
 
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Super video on cycling! Matter of fact I am getting ready to start cycling my new Tank ones I get my sump from Synergy!! I will be cycling my SCA 150 with 30lbs of old School Tonga Branch that I had left over from my old my old 120 mixed reef tank. Also, I have added 2 very large pieces of Vida Rocks and Aquarocks for my center showpiece. I am currently cycling my Tonga branch right now in a brute garbage can. My new Build thread is coming soon...
SCA -150
SCA150.JPG

Old School Tonga Branch (32''x7''x10'')
Tongabranch showpcs#2.jpeg
 
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Are you ready?!?

It's finally time to reveal why/how the 4-month cycle may be the most stable and simple approach to getting an SPS dominant tank a leg up from the outset!

Today Ryan shares some thought processes into a longer than normal tank cycle, how WWC does it and how we plan to follow it on our BRS/WWC System tanks.

Starting the four month cycle in a brute container using microbacter7 and was wondering if I should follow the instruction on the bottle or just pour the whole thing in? My container has around 5o pounds of dry rock. Thanks!
 
Awesome video as always BRS! I have been a firm believer in a long slow cycle when starting a new reef tank for a long time. My current tank is 6 months old, started with live rock cured in the dark for 3 months, cycled with MB7 and frozen food for 2 months no fish and 3 months lights. After a few weeks I added a few snails and started the fuge, at 2 months I started adding fish. 3 months slowly started increasing lighting and adding hardly corals. Everything went great, all corals are doing very well, no uglies and no algea blooms at all. Take the cycle slow, have patients and you will have a much cleaner and healthier tank thais ready for fish and corals while avoiding many of the new tank issues.
How much MB7 did you use to start the cycle?
 
I’m new at REEF2REEF and still figuring out how to use the site. I’m starting my 4 month cycle in a brute container with about 50 pounds of dry rock and was was wondering how to use beneficial bacteria. I’m planing on using bacter7. Should I use the recommended dosing on the bottle or pour the whole thing in? Thanks!
 
Starting the four month cycle in a brute container using microbacter7 and was wondering if I should follow the instruction on the bottle or just pour the whole thing in? My container has around 5o pounds of dry rock. Thanks!


Welcome to R2R!

I would follow the directions on the bottle. While they say an overdose won't cause any ill effects, it's best to follow their given instructions. It's what most have done, using microbacter7, the 5ml per 25 gallons for 2 weeks.
 
I’m new at REEF2REEF and still figuring out how to use the site. I’m starting my 4 month cycle in a brute container with about 50 pounds of dry rock and was was wondering how to use beneficial bacteria. I’m planing on using bacter7. Should I use the recommended dosing on the bottle or pour the whole thing in? Thanks!

I agree with @WWIII . The directions on the bottle are a great place to start and should be more than enough to get the cycle going. :)
 
Thanks guys! Will follow the recommended amount. The reefing community makes me feel confident going forward with my builds. Thanks a lot!
 
Hey Ryan, I hope you can answer a question that is troubling me i just finished watching BRS/WWC Hybrid 4-month SPS tank cycle and the question I have is where Josh talks about dosing Microbacter7 and you talk about the 5 steps of cycling the tank and you say to add bacteria boost ( microbacter7 what i will be using) at start then at the 2 months mark another bacteria boost then a last bacteria boost at the 2.5 - months mark. Is this correct? just 3 dose of Microbacter7 and what size of dosage each time? As i read on the bottle and it says to dose everyday could you shine some light on this if you can this would be awesome i would like to do it right also you say to start doing 10-15% WC from the start weekly but do i re-add Microbacter after the WC?

Really hope you can answer my questions.

Thanks for your time and keep up the awesome work you guys do at BRS
 
Hey Ryan, I hope you can answer a question that is troubling me i just finished watching BRS/WWC Hybrid 4-month SPS tank cycle and the question I have is where Josh talks about dosing Microbacter7 and you talk about the 5 steps of cycling the tank and you say to add bacteria boost ( microbacter7 what i will be using) at start then at the 2 months mark another bacteria boost then a last bacteria boost at the 2.5 - months mark. Is this correct? just 3 dose of Microbacter7 and what size of dosage each time? As i read on the bottle and it says to dose everyday could you shine some light on this if you can this would be awesome i would like to do it right also you say to start doing 10-15% WC from the start weekly but do i re-add Microbacter after the WC?
Really hope you can answer my questions.Thanks for your time and keep up the awesome work you guys do at BRS

I hope you don't mind me copying/pasting my response to your same question from our #AskBRStv Facebook Group? ;)

I personally wouldn't be concerned with the specific details of how/when/frequency of dosing bacterial supplements, but rather just add some to the tank to help give a leg up to the bacterial colony in a freshly started tank. I'm sure there is not enough data currently out there that says "dosing xx-strain of bacteria at xx-times per week will result in xxxx". Perhaps there are some benefits to certain strains above others and maybe even more benefits from how frequently or how much you add, but in the end the value to the average reefer is that you at least dose SOMETHING to help get the cycle going.

That said, you can certainly follow the instructions on the bottle or follow how we did it for the BRS/WWC 750. Either way, I'm pretty sure you won't notice an apparent difference between each approach.

As for the water changes, here's a couple of my thoughts.
1) Water changes will likely not affect the bacterial colony or bacterial population in a noticeable capacity, due to the majority of the bacteria living on the surfaces of the rock, substrate, glass, bottom, filter media, etc. I wouldn't suspect any major amount of beneficial bacteria being free floating in the actual water column. (So, do water changes without fear of diminishing the bacteria.)

2) Regardless of whether you plan to do water changes or some other method to a regular maintenance rhythm, the reason behind us suggesting to start that maintenance early is to simply get into the habit of doing it throughout the life of your tank. 10% water changes during the tank cycle has probably a pretty low impact on the cycle altogether and it's just good to work the kinks out of your own process in the early parts of the tank's life when the system is less forgiving about swinging parameters.
 
Hi @randyBRS do you have any info on how much rock you used in the final scape or atleast a rough estimate of the dry weight?
 
Hi @randyBRS do you have any info on how much rock you used in the final scape or atleast a rough estimate of the dry weight?

I don't think we weighed it all before scaping, but my guess would be somewhere around 150lbs or so.
 
if I’m cycling my rock using the 4 month cycle in a brute trash can, and I’m also planning on putting a few boxes of bio-lux in the refugium, should I throw in the bio-lux with the rocks to allow them to cycle with and establish the beneficial bacteria in the bio-lux?
 
I started my cycle on Oct 15th (almost 1 month now) in the following order.

  1. Day 1: Add dry rock, bare bottom, and a cube of frozen mysis shrimp.
  2. Day 5: Saw an ammonia spike (1ppm), added Fritz TurboStart.
  3. Week 1: Added my first fish (chalk bass)
  4. Week 3: Added 2 clownfish at the 3-week mark.
Filteration methods:
  1. Chaeto with a Kessil H80.
  2. Change filter socks twice weekly.
Display tank: 29g standard.
Sump: 10g

Other info:
  1. I have my lights (AI Hydra 32HD) running a 9-hour peak photoperiod from Day 1.
  2. Chaeto from Day 1.

I have not seen an ammonia spike after Day 5.

Is it fine to continue the cycle like this? Should I modify anything?
 
Edit I misread question seems like your current balance will build up the support network nicely.

fritz had you quick cycled all set
 

IF YOU HAD TO TAKE A REEFING EXAM, WOULD YOU PASS?

  • Yes!

    Votes: 32 45.7%
  • Not yet, but I have one that I want to buy in mind!

    Votes: 9 12.9%
  • No.

    Votes: 26 37.1%
  • Other (please explain).

    Votes: 3 4.3%

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