Filtration without Live Rock: How are you getting more with less?

[revhtree Verified Admin]

Simple question today regarding filtration. LIVE ROCK is the number one way most of us "filter" our reef tanks but the trend in aquariums these days is less is more when it comes to aquascaping. But less aquascaping means less rock and less rock means less filtration so we have to make up for it somewhere. Let's talk about it today!

1. In what ways are you filtering your water besides live rock?

2. What ways of "non-liverock" filtration have you found to be most successful?


image via @Ricardo Prata

 

[Bleigh]

My initial thought was no, but then the more I thought about it, there's a good chance that it's doing most of the filtration. I have a filter sock and a skimmer and a refugium. But none of them are really pulling much and the fuge has slowed it's growth tremendously and my nutrients are super low.

 

[Dkmoo]

i always thought whatever you reduce in the DT for the sake of aethetics, you compensate in your sump.

surface area is a tricky variable when you think of "total surface area available" for the entire system, adding/removing rocks may not cause too much fluctuation if you have a sump.

 

[X-37B]

50% live 50% caribsea in my 120.
After 1.5 years they all look the same.
Caribsea is not as porous as live but some live rock nowadays is not very porous either.
I have only 35lbs of live in my 120.
I do not think you need a full tank of live like we used to run.
I have many sps, 14 fish, snails, shrimp, britle stars, 2 urchins, and a few crabs that are slowly being relocated.

Other filtration.
7" filter sock
1 cup carbon in a small reactor 24/7
3 liters of eheim substrate pro in a bag
Properly sized skimmer
Oh, and bare bottom
Thats about it for 20 months now.

 

[fade2black]

I use live rock along with filter floss in my overflow that is changed out at least weekly. Nutrient export and trace element replacement is done through water changes only. No skimmer is used. As I increase the number of corals in the tank I am ready to start dosing 2 part to help between water changes.

 

[Dkmoo]

50% live 50% caribsea in my 120.
After 1.5 years they all look the same.
Caribsea is not as porous as live but some live rock nowadays is not very porous either.
I have only 35lbs of live in my 120.
I do not think you need a full tank of live like we used to run.
I have many sps, 14 fish, snails, shrimp, britle stars, 2 urchins, and a few crabs that are slowly being relocated.

Other filtration.
7" filter sock
1 cup carbon in a small reactor 24/7
3 liters of eheim substrate pro in a bag properly sized skimmer
Oh, and bare bottom
Thats about it for 20 months now.

what is your light setting and what do you feed for those amazing acro colors?

 

[brandon429]

my answer is:
do you have to make up for it?

what if the most minimal amount of live rock still runs the whole bioload, are we getting retailed again with a refreshed new demand for unneeded surface area in marine biosystems?

the 90s:
buy these bioballs and the flushing system for them, you need it even though you have sand and 200 pounds of rock.

today: you need the bioballs and flush system because you've removed sand and have little rock

there's always a deficit we're being sold.

calibrated seneye machine owners are excellent commenters in regards to surface area needs. our hobby's eyes are barely opening to the carry ability of common live rock In the post-api era of cycling assessment.

The reef above at the top requires no extra surface area to run the exact same measures as it would with only the display carrying the load. great thread.
even the surface area from coral antlers counts bigtime.

 

[X-37B]

what is your light setting and what do you feed for those amazing acro colors?

I feed the fish not the corals.
14 total at 8 cubes a day plus nori.
Lighting is 2 250 watt de 14K phoenix MH's.

 

[Dvanlier05]

I have a AquaRocks aqua scape so technically 0lbs of live rock in my 120. I have 2 Marine Pure bricks, and A LOT of the spheres in the sump. Also run a Nyos 160 and small fuge.

 

[threebuoys]

I have a lot of live rocks I picked up off the beach when they washed ashore.

I also use 30 ppi poret foam in my sump. It seems very few marine aquarists use foam and rely on live rock alone or live rock with bio balls or some similar media. I use foam because studies have show it has the highest surface area per cubic inch of all of the commercial media other than a fluid K1 chamber, It is easy to place in the sump in a way that all water must flow through it before reaching the skimmer, refugium or return to the display tank. It only attracts detritus and bacteria and will not absorb medications or heavy metals making it very efficient in a quarantine tank with no rock. And it is CHEAP relative to purchased live rock. You can get enough to filter a 125 gallon tank for less than $75.

 

[LittleFidel]

Macro algae.

 

[Vette67]

I guess old habits die hard. Being in this hobby forever has me brainwashed into believing we need tons of live rock. Most of my live rock was trans shipped Fiji live rock from over 20 years ago. I have over 200 pounds in my 180 DT, probably around 50 pounds in my 75 and another 200 pounds of rock in my 150 gallon sump (all just guesstimates). My nutrients are difficult to raise, so I'm probably over-doing it with the rock. But corals grow, the fish are happy and if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

As far as non live rock filtration, I only use a big skimmer and a 40 gallon refugium full of chaeto. Rock is probably 50-75% of my filtration. I haven't used any other porous media other than live rock. I don't use socks, or any mechanical filtration other than skimming. I view those floating particles in your water column as coral food. Why deprive corals of the chance to eat naturally?

 

[PicassoClown04]

I have a lot of live rocks I picked up off the beach when they washed ashore.

I also use 30 ppi poret foam in my sump. It seems very few marine aquarists use foam and rely on live rock alone or live rock with bio balls or some similar media. I use foam because studies have show it has the highest surface area per cubic inch of all of the commercial media other than a fluid K1 chamber, It is easy to place in the sump in a way that all water must flow through it before reaching the skimmer, refugium or return to the display tank. It only attracts detritus and bacteria and will not absorb medications or heavy metals making it very efficient in a quarantine tank with no rock. And it is CHEAP relative to purchased live rock. You can get enough to filter a 125 gallon tank for less than $75.

Can you post a pic of your tank? I have the chance to gather natural rocks like this and I was thinking about trying to do something like what you have

 

[ca1ore]

less aquascaping means less rock and less rock means less filtration so we have to make up for it somewhere.

Minimalist aquascapes (an awesome trend, BTW) certainly do mean less rock and therefore less available surface area for the bacteria to colonize; doesn't necessarily translate to insufficient nitrogen processing though. I have been using FAR less than the old pound-per-gallon rule of thumb for years and have never noticed that less rock equated to elevated ammonia levels. I am sure the point could be reached where bio-load exceeds the biofiltration capacity - 100 fish and one small rock would do it I am sure LOL - but I think the vast majority of tanks are not at that point. Add bio-media to your sump if you want, but I think it is unnecessary.

 

[Mical]

I said "other". Both of my tanks have actual live rock, but that's not my primary filtration. The both also have fuges and skimmers. I don't use filter socks nor do I do water changes (maybe 10% annually) and for me it's a pretty good balance.

 

[lapin]

I have buku filtering.
Rock for bacteria to break down ammonia. Has a lot of filtering worms too. Corals to eat fish poo and extra food. Filter socks to catch the big stuff thats missed. Skimmer to help with what slipped thru the socks. A rock nem /nps tank, that has its walls covered in algae, to take up some nutrients missed by everything else. The sand. and "One more thing". The cryptic fuge sponges and other weird stuff in those baskets under the tank.
Not sure what portion each takes up and they are not telling

 

[Dennis Cartier]

My current build will have the minimal dead rock needed just for placing corals. I had planned to get some cultured rock and livesand from Florida, but with the Canada / US border closed, that may be difficult. I only wanted the live cultured rock for the injection of life that would come with it rather than it's filtration.

My primary filtration will be a DyMico style filter built in to my sump. The sump is 8 ft long and 5 ft of it is devoted to the media bed and processing chambers of the DyMiCo.

Here is my sump standing on it's end (still at the builders). The top 3 chambers in the photo are the DyMiCo inspired filter.

Using this filter, I do not expect to need any other filtration.

Dennis

 

[RocketEngineer]

What is meant by “filtration”? Is it removing waste before it can break down (mechanical)? Or what about removing molecules from the water column (skimmer, fuge, coral growth)? Then how about converting harmful chemicals into less harmful variants (nitrogen cycle bacteria)? To me the word “filtration” doesn’t work because there is so much going on in our systems. Every surface is biologically active. It’s an ecosystem in miniature with all the complexities and feedbacks.

 

[G Santana]

At what point does dead rock become live rock?
And what about, skimmers, socks, and other filter media?

IMO it's a combined effort if you use all of the above.

 

[Dennis Cartier]

At what point does dead rock become live rock?
And what about, skimmers, socks, and other filter media?

IMO it's a combined effort if you use all of the above.

I think deadrock becomes live rock when it is fully colonized by the bacteria and endemic life of the ocean/tank/culture facility or whatever is comprising the foundations of the food web in that environment.

That is why I am interested in getting ocean cultured rock. Easiest way to get a slice of the ocean in your home is to grab a hunk of the food web (in a sustainable, environment friendly manner of course).

Dennis