First dish both dead - don’t know why

[Thrillik]

Hello,

I’ve had my tank running for 2 months now. Used TBS live rock to get it started. Have about 8 corals, 2 anemone, 2 peppermint shrimp, and a host of typical CUC (snails, hermits). I have a 26g Red Sea nano max and a hang-on-back refugium.

All of my other living creatures have been doing fine, I’ve been dosing phytoplankton every day, don’t have ammonia, etc.

Both clownfish had been in the tank for a total of 5 days prior to dying. They were very active and constantly swimming until I found them dead.

I never saw them fighting or any sort of aggression. I can’t see any signs of disease on the first. The second one has some blue on it and the top portion of it was black. It is a phantom clownfish so was supposed to be darker - not sure if that was normal and being masked by the blue light. I ordered both clownfish from Dr Reefs, so they should have gone through a lengthy quarantine period. There are no other fish in my tank, and never have been.

Does anyone have any ideas what could have killed them?

Stats:
Temp: 77
Ph: 8.1
Nitrate: 5
Ammonia: 0
Salinity: 1.026
KH: 8.1 dKH
Ca: 380 ppm
Mg: 1280 ppm

 

[Thrillik]

Fish, not dish. Sorry. I blame it on autocorrect.

 

[Someshmuk]

What was your acclimation protocol?

 

[Troylee]

O2 levels maybe… how’s your surface agitation? Any skimmer or lids on the tank etc?

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

what do you mean by "swimming up", you mean up to the surface? Do you have good agitation on the water surface? Or do you have a skimmer? These are the 2 methods of oxiginating the water.

It always helps if you can post a pic of your tank?

 

[Cell]

Can't diagnose dead fish out of water. The fins on both look beat up though. The other healthy livestock rules out water quality issues.

 

[Cell]

Can you post a full tank shot? What kind of flow do you have going on?

 

[Thrillik]

what do you mean by "swimming up", you mean up to the surface? Do you have good agitation on the water surface? Or do you have a skimmer? These are the 2 methods of oxiginating the water.

It always helps if you can post a pic of your tank?

 

[Thrillik]

Can you post a full tank shot? What kind of flow do you have going on?

I have a return pump, a hang on back refugium, and 2 hygger wave makers. The return pump from the back part of my AIO is pointed up at the surface. The protein skimmer and HOB refugium also cause lots of surface agitation. I posted a video above but not sure if it’s actually working or not.

 

[Thrillik]

What was your acclimation protocol?

I followed one of the stickied threads I found on this board.

Edit - this one: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/how-to-acclimate.192300/

 

[Thrillik]

what do you mean by "swimming up", you mean up to the surface? Do you have good agitation on the water surface? Or do you have a skimmer? These are the 2 methods of oxiginating the water.

It always helps if you can post a pic of your tank?

The “Up” portion was a bad sentence. I meant they were constantly swimming. Right up until the time I found them dead.

 

[Cell]

You have plenty of O2 exchange. Absent any other observed symptoms, this may be hard to identify.

#fishmedic

 

[Thrillik]

Do their tail fins look like they’ve been bit? It was just pointed out to me that it seems like they’ve had some nibbles taken out of them on both fish

 

[Someshmuk]

I followed one of the stickied threads I found on this board.

Edit - this one: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/how-to-acclimate.192300/

Which one of the processes in the thread? Drip acclimation or temp equalization then drop into tank?

I put any new fish/corals into a small container over the sump, do drip acclimation over 1-2 hours and have the cup overflow into the sump. That way i know the fish is in 100% of my tank water before transferring it over to my tank. I think for AIO systems you would put the container in a much bigger container and let it overflow. Put all that water back into the tank provided the water the fish were shipped in isn't treated with anything.

 

[Someshmuk]

Do their tail fins look like they’ve been bit? It was just pointed out to me that it seems like they’ve had some nibbles taken out of them on both fish

It could be that they died and were getting eaten postmortum by any of your current inhabitants. None of your present tank stocking will try and kill a fish for food but the peppermints for sure will go after a free snack.

 

[Thrillik]

It could be that they died and were getting eaten postmortum by any of your current inhabitants. None of your present tank stocking will try and kill a fish for food but the peppermints for sure will go after a free snack.

I pulled the second one out of the tank within minutes of it dying.

 

[Thrillik]

Which one of the processes in the thread? Drip acclimation or temp equalization then drop into tank?

I put any new fish/corals into a small container over the sump, do drip acclimation over 1-2 hours and have the cup overflow into the sump. That way i know the fish is in 100% of my tank water before transferring it over to my tank. I think for AIO systems you would put the container in a much bigger container and let it overflow. Put all that water back into the tank provided the water the fish were shipped in isn't treated with anything.

I did temp acclimation first then drip acclimation.

 

[Someshmuk]

I did temp acclimation first then drip acclimation.

Hmm, that took care of my user related conditions....
Water parameter issues would have killed your corals quicker than your fish.

Primarily my thought process goes to these potential areas.
1. Fish health coming to you was low enough that they perished regardless of the fact. (shipping does a number on stress and health)
2. Rapid instability in the water (heater stays on or off)
3. Potential person or child may have messed with your fish or tank and killed them.
4. You actually have something in your tank that killed your fish.

I'm leaning more towards 1 at this point as my experience with shipping any live animals has been neutral to bad. Had fedex hold an overnight package on some acros during winter and all the acros ended up half cold and half baked to a crisp due to the heat pack used in the styrofoam packing.

Oh! Are you doing any dosing? And did you water change in the 5 days they were there?

 

[Thrillik]

Hmm, that took care of my user related conditions....
Water parameter issues would have killed your corals quicker than your fish.

Primarily my thought process goes to these potential areas.
1. Fish health coming to you was low enough that they perished regardless of the fact. (shipping does a number on stress and health)
2. Rapid instability in the water (heater stays on or off)
3. Potential person or child may have messed with your fish or tank and killed them.
4. You actually have something in your tank that killed your fish.

I'm leaning more towards 1 at this point as my experience with shipping any live animals has been neutral to bad. Had fedex hold an overnight package on some acros during winter and all the acros ended up half cold and half baked to a crisp due to the heat pack used in the styrofoam packing.

Oh! Are you doing any dosing? And did you water change in the 5 days they were there?

I dose phytoplankton (every day) and Red Sea coral nutrition (very small doses every 4 days). I did do a 10% water change on their third day in the tank - hadn’t thought about that until now.

 

[Someshmuk]

I dose phytoplankton (every day) and Red Sea coral nutrition (very small doses every 4 days). I did do a 10% water change on their third day in the tank - hadn’t thought about that until now.

That should be fine, no none of that should affect ph or water quality significantly tbh.

Honestly i cant see anything but bad initial fish health, equipment malfunction, or external actor (person/child, animal, or tank animal) being the cause. Everything else checks out.

Anyways, only way to find out is to put another fish in, preferably locally sourced and has been in their tanks for while (maybe 2 weeks+) so you can get it into your tank in the shortest amount of travel and know its not going to die from things that have happened to it during international shipping.

Also check in to your tank at night, you might see the culprit.