First time using a SUMP

[jcosta98]

Hi,

Never used a SUMP before, So I was wondering which of the chamber I should use for my return pump? ( 3rd chamber to the right is the ATO one , so only 2 chambers available)
I Should run the Skimmer in the Drain chamber right? Because it will vary in the return chamber , and skimmers don't like that right?

I want to run in this sump :

--> Floss/Sock
--> Skimmer
--> Rock as Bio media
--> Carbon

Thanks a lot guys!

 

[Quietman]

Sorry correction - I think you could do either looking at it and the skimmer might fit better in the middle.

 

[Saltysav96]

looks like to small of a sump and not enough chambers for everything you are wanting.

 

[ying yang]

Chamber on left and middle where your tube is will be same level of water till reaches point i marked .
Skimmer in middle
Return pump and ato float valve/ sensor in chamber to left
And as you say you got ato reservoir at the right.
Im not sure how deep sump is but if put skimmer and some rocks in there then maybe chamber full? Could run reactors out of sump i believe but unsure as i never used one and im real new to all this also but if we put our minds to it its simple,only running equipment/pipes/valves then tune them in how we want them and hey presto.
Ive got 7 chambers in my sump but i got small rocks in about 4 chambers and even between baffles along with small plastic containers off some crushed coral to act as buffer,i even got bit of rock in return chamber but if ato ever fails then this chamber has less water in because displacement of water from the rocks but would still give me some days to notice that water evaporating and going past that point that marked on your sump then return pump would soon run dry and sump cut off from display tank.

 

[ying yang]

This my sump it very simple and no big gadgets like some have but doing its job so far.
Far back left corner water from dt comes and through some sponges to act as mechanical filter and to quieten water then goes down and back up through another sponge then over the top into small chamber where can have skimmer mounted externally if want but i put 2 heaters in there,one heater set at 26 degrees and one at 24 as back up,then water flows down through some rocks put not tightly packed and under first baffle then past some crushed coral then over the top then down as a waterfall to help with gas exchange and skimmer in this chamber raised up slightly on eggcrate and pump for skimmer and few rocks front and back then under and over next baffle into final chamber where got one small rock and return pump and ato float switch.
Im keeping rocks in there incase ever need put any critters down there and can swap with small rocks full off algae from dt or if want rocks for qt/observation/hospital tank etc and just to help with extra surface area for beneficial bacteria etc.
Some gunk does gather in and under and around rocks but on wc day i just use airline tubing and siphon sump out losing minimal water then use main hose/ pump to do proper wc etc.
But you can have sump simple or complicated as you like depending on your needs of your livestock or if you enjoy being real techy.
My myself i prefer simple ^_^ but that may change as my saltwater journey continues

 

[jcosta98]

Thanks everyone ,

Chamber on left and middle where your tube is will be same level of water till reaches point i marked .
Skimmer in middle
Return pump and ato float valve/ sensor in chamber to left
And as you say you got ato reservoir at the right.
Im not sure how deep sump is but if put skimmer and some rocks in there then maybe chamber full? Could run reactors out of sump i believe but unsure as i never used one and im real new to all this also but if we put our minds to it its simple,only running equipment/pipes/valves then tune them in how we want them and hey presto.
Ive got 7 chambers in my sump but i got small rocks in about 4 chambers and even between baffles along with small plastic containers off some crushed coral to act as buffer,i even got bit of rock in return chamber but if ato ever fails then this chamber has less water in because displacement of water from the rocks but would still give me some days to notice that water evaporating and going past that point that marked on your sump then return pump would soon run dry and sump cut off from display tank.

Thanks, I thought this would be the best layout too.

So, Skimmer in the Middle , with the rocks to keep more water in the return chamber , right? The middle one has plenty of space for a skimmer , it does not look like it but yes that chamber has enough space. It is a 45x45 cm sump , the middle chamber has 22/23 cm width and 45cm depth , So I'm guessing the skimmer will fill less then half of this chamber!

 

[jcosta98]

This my sump it very simple and no big gadgets like some have but doing its job so far.
Far back left corner water from dt comes and through some sponges to act as mechanical filter and to quieten water then goes down and back up through another sponge then over the top into small chamber where can have skimmer mounted externally if want but i put 2 heaters in there,one heater set at 26 degrees and one at 24 as back up,then water flows down through some rocks put not tightly packed and under first baffle then past some crushed coral then over the top then down as a waterfall to help with gas exchange and skimmer in this chamber raised up slightly on eggcrate and pump for skimmer and few rocks front and back then under and over next baffle into final chamber where got one small rock and return pump and ato float switch.
Im keeping rocks in there incase ever need put any critters down there and can swap with small rocks full off algae from dt or if want rocks for qt/observation/hospital tank etc and just to help with extra surface area for beneficial bacteria etc.
Some gunk does gather in and under and around rocks but on wc day i just use airline tubing and siphon sump out losing minimal water then use main hose/ pump to do proper wc etc.
But you can have sump simple or complicated as you like depending on your needs of your livestock or if you enjoy being real techy.
My myself i prefer simple ^_^ but that may change as my saltwater journey continues

That's a nice layout, wanted something like that but with less space hahaha

 

[ying yang]

Thanks everyone ,


Thanks, I thought this would be the best layout too.

So, Skimmer in the Middle , with the rocks to keep more water in the return chamber , right? The middle one has plenty of space for a skimmer , it does not look like it but yes that chamber has enough space. It is a 45x45 cm sump , the middle chamber has 22/23 cm width and 45cm depth , So I'm guessing the skimmer will fill less then half of this chamber!

If put rocks in you end up with less water as rocks taking place of the water ( displacement) but how you saying sounds more than adequate.
Most important thing is to leave enough space in sump if you ever lose power or return pump fails,to find out this turn return pump off and watch the water siphon back down into the sump and adjust sump water accordinly.and have return nozzle in main display not to deep facing down as this will dictate how much water gets siphoned back down into sump.
Depending what set up you have,you may have a little siphon break on return nozzle in dt or on top return pipe so air enters and breaks/ stops the siphon.

Good luck buddy and what your thinking looks and sounds ok to me.
But if depending how much equipment you want in sump you may have to get larger sump but i believe alot equipment can be hung on or ran outside of sump or even in a cabinet next to tank and can drill sump and add another smaller sump onto it if you want.possibilities are endless really.
Im only new to saltwater as i said and sumps but know how water works as plumbing and heating engineer but research research and more research never hurts nothing ^_^ goodluck

Edit: do yourself a favour and have some kund light in sump as gets dark sometimes,little led strip or battery operated or mains whichever

 

[jcosta98]

If put rocks in you end up with less water as rocks taking place of the water ( displacement) but how you saying sounds more than adequate.
Most important thing is to leave enough space in sump if you ever lose power or return pump fails,to find out this turn return pump off and watch the water siphon back down into the sump and adjust sump water accordinly.and have return nozzle in main display not to deep facing down as this will dictate how much water gets siphoned back down into sump.
Depending what set up you have,you may have a little siphon break on return nozzle in dt or on top return pipe so air enters and breaks/ stops the siphon.

Good luck buddy and what your thinking looks and sounds ok to me.
But if depending how much equipment you want in sump you may have to get larger sump but i believe alot equipment can be hung on or ran outside of sump or even in a cabinet next to tank and can drill sump and add another smaller sump onto it if you want.possibilities are endless really.
Im only new to saltwater as i said and sumps but know how water works as plumbing and heating engineer but research research and more research never hurts nothing ^_^ goodluck

Thanks a lot for your help in this topic, I will let you know when I set everything up hehe

 

[ying yang]

Goodluck and enjoy ^_^
Forgot to ask where water coming from display is going into as in my research and my logic says ato sensor/ float switch should be in chamber where water more settled/ by that i mean least water movement on surface sorry i ramble on to much lol so i choose return section as where skimmer is is more movement etc

 

[jcosta98]

Goodluck and enjoy ^_^
Forgot to ask where water coming from display is going into as in my research and my logic says ato sensor/ float switch should be in chamber where water more settled/ by that i mean least water movement on surface sorry i ramble on to much lol so i choose return section as where skimmer is is more movement etc

Hehehe Thank you,

Water coming from display will go into the middle chamber where the Skimmer is , both drains from display will be submerged and with a filter sock , so there will be little surface movement. Ato sensor will put on return section and will also fill on the return section so it doesn't mess with the skimmer on the middle chamber

 

[jcosta98]

Bad drawing , but this is what I'm imagining

Purple -- Drains bringing water from display
White -- Filter Sock
Green -- Rocks
Red -- Skimmer
Brown -- Carbon
Blue -- Return Pump

 

[ying yang]

Bad drawing , but this is what I'm imagining

Purple -- Drains bringing water from display
White -- Filter Sock
Green -- Rocks
Red -- Skimmer
Brown -- Carbon
Blue -- Return Pump

Looks more than good enough to me,^_^

 

[jcosta98]

Looks more than good enough to me,^_^

Hi again, do you know what Will be my Water level in the middle chamber? will it be in the baffle limit? what about the water level in the return chamber? Can it be higher then the middle one?


Thank you !

 

[ying yang]

I just drew a yellow line,
Aslong as your water level is above this yellow line then water level will be exactly same in left chamber and middle chamber.

Once water level goes below the yellow line then left and centre chamber are independant from each other till something changes ( if water level drops below yellow line,im taking it the system has no ato or the ato has failed or ato water chamber is empty etc,and if water level goes below the yellow line then left chamber where you plan on having your return pump will keep pumping water back to main tank and at risk of pump running dry so highly likely pump will fail and return pump in a sump like a heart in a human body pumping blood around body as sump holding alot of filtration like skimmer/carbon and more than likely heaters so very important keeps running.

If power heads for flow in dt and live rock then dt filtration will still function as the live rock is our greatest filtration and need flow,( always good to point power heads at surface for some surface agitation so promotes gas exchange,c02 out and oxygen in depending on c02 levels in room tank is in,but without a heater the temperature will ovbiously drop so depending what your ambient room temperature is will depend how much temp will drop and become big problem or not,your skimmer ovbiously takes organics out system before fully broken down so is very beneficial but not 100% essential,but also aerates your water adding more dissolved oxygen to your sysyem and therefore highers ph so beneficial,same as carbon unless trying remove something you dont want etc,so having 2 smaller return pumps connected and running is better than just 1 and often not much price difference and if one pump fails you still got one pump running keeping all equipment in sump in operation and have extra water volume so system stays more stable and say if a heater/s failed a higher water volume generally means water temp takes longer to drop.
Sorry for long winded reply,i got little carried away so had to stop before turns into an article lol ^_^

 

[jcosta98]

I just drew a yellow line,
Aslong as your water level is above this yellow line then water level will be exactly same in left chamber and middle chamber.

Once water level goes below the yellow line then left and centre chamber are independant from each other till something changes ( if water level drops below yellow line,im taking it the system has no ato or the ato has failed or ato water chamber is empty etc,and if water level goes below the yellow line then left chamber where you plan on having your return pump will keep pumping water back to main tank and at risk of pump running dry so highly likely pump will fail and return pump in a sump like a heart in a human body pumping blood around body as sump holding alot of filtration like skimmer/carbon and more than likely heaters so very important keeps running.

If power heads for flow in dt and live rock then dt filtration will still function as the live rock is our greatest filtration and need flow,( always good to point power heads at surface for some surface agitation so promotes gas exchange,c02 out and oxygen in depending on c02 levels in room tank is in,but without a heater the temperature will ovbiously drop so depending what your ambient room temperature is will depend how much temp will drop and become big problem or not,your skimmer ovbiously takes organics out system before fully broken down so is very beneficial but not 100% essential,but also aerates your water adding more dissolved oxygen to your sysyem and therefore highers ph so beneficial,same as carbon unless trying remove something you dont want etc,so having 2 smaller return pumps connected and running is better than just 1 and often not much price difference and if one pump fails you still got one pump running keeping all equipment in sump in operation and have extra water volume so system stays more stable and say if a heater/s failed a higher water volume generally means water temp takes longer to drop.
Sorry for long winded reply,i got little carried away so had to stop before turns into an article lol ^_^

hahahah no worrys , thanks for your advice and all the information you provided! If I keep my water level above that yellow line , will that be a problem regarding the "normal" flow of things (Obviously accounting for the water level when I turn off my return pump) ? I'm asking this because of the required water height for skimmers, as the middle chamber is not that tall until it hits the baffle ,

Thank you!

 

[ying yang]

Will have to keep water level above yellow line for water to actually flow through sump and allow return pump to pump water back to dt.regarding water level for skimmer,you will have to see in user manual of skimmer to see if manufacturer recommends what height should be.ony skimmer i got its a stock skimmer that come with tank and doesnt actually tell me in user manual the recommended height,so i just went on you tube and searched for my brand/ model and see others who own it and see what worked best for them.
You can buy skimmer stands for skimmer to sit on or diy a stand out off egg crate/ lighting diffuser and zip ties and make a box/ stand for skimmer,from my research i found out majority skimmers operate best in the 6- 9 inch range but ovbiously can vary.
But watching lots you tube videos on my skimmer and other equipment on ho2 to use to their best was very beneficial for me on how far to open valves for water inlet/outlet and the venturi on when breaking in and proper usage, so far so good on my stock skimmer and it taking lots green/ brown gunk out the water and emptying 3/4 cup once a week so seems to be working ok so far ^_^

 

[jcosta98]

Will have to keep water level above yellow line for water to actually flow through sump and allow return pump to pump water back to dt.regarding water level for skimmer,you will have to see in user manual of skimmer to see if manufacturer recommends what height should be.ony skimmer i got its a stock skimmer that come with tank and doesnt actually tell me in user manual the recommended height,so i just went on you tube and searched for my brand/ model and see others who own it and see what worked best for them.
You can buy skimmer stands for skimmer to sit on or diy a stand out off egg crate/ lighting diffuser and zip ties and make a box/ stand for skimmer,from my research i found out majority skimmers operate best in the 6- 9 inch range but ovbiously can vary.
But watching lots you tube videos on my skimmer and other equipment on ho2 to use to their best was very beneficial for me on how far to open valves for water inlet/outlet and the venturi on when breaking in and proper usage, so far so good on my stock skimmer and it taking lots green/ brown gunk out the water and emptying 3/4 cup once a week so seems to be working ok so far ^_^

Thanks once again hehehe

 

[ying yang]

Welcome and enjoy your tank ^_^