Fish dying off, no idea why!

citymouse

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Hi,
I set up a new 215 g tank months ago, I used Reef Mature pro to cycle the tank, struggled a little with Nitrates, but nothing major.

In early December I moved my very small cleaning crew into the tank, followed by my 2 clowns that I've had for 7 years, a goby (1 year) and a Bangaii Cardinal (at least 2 years) about week or 2 later I added 11 young blue/green Chromis who have been in quarantine for about 4 months while I was setting up the new tank, they were in perfect health. When I added them, one of them separated from the group and hid at the bottom corner of the tank, around Christmas a 2nd one went off it's own but it was still occasionally joining the group and was eating fine. The Goby jumped ship and died in my filter recently :(.

Since New Years the Chromis have been dying off, they looked healthy, they were schooling together, eating etc. Everything seemed fine, a day later I find 2 in the sump filter dead and another stuck in the Wav pump, not sure if it got sucked in before or after if died. The rest separated and were hanging around the bottom of the tank, one spent the whole day following around a large hermit crab... Each day I've found another dead Chromis, as of today I only see 2 in there, but they are excellent at hiding when they want to, so I'm not entirely sure if there are more. Only 2 have been eating from what I've seen.

Today, my Cardinal was swimming around the front of the tank, which I was happy about because since adding him, he has been staying in the back near the bottom, I don't think he likes the flow of the water. BUT today, his fins are a mess, the longer fins are now short, he looks awful! My male Clown was acting weird, skittish I guess? But since has been completely normal, swimming together with the female as they always do.

I struggled with some minor/low ammonia but for the past few days it's been fine.

As of today, Ammonia is 0.
Nitrates are 5 to less than 10 (2 different tests, 2 different results)
Salt according to the Apex probe is 32.7 but it was 28 yesterday, I have 2 hydrometer-one says 1.023 and the other 1.021 -which I think is fine, I don't have any corals.
PH - 7.9
KH -8 (according to the test)

ORP is foreign to me, my previous tank was a freshwater converted to salt, I used canister filters for the last 7 years (so much easier than now!). The Apex Fusion has an ORP probe, it's fluctuates constantly and drastically all the time, no idea if it's working properly or what it even means, never worried about it before now!
Current ORP reading is 258. I'll tell you the past weeks readings, maybe this will help, maybe it's just not working... on Jan. 3rd it was 449 at peak and fluctuated thru the day. On Jan 4th -319. Jan 5th -329. Jan 6th -268 and Jan 7th 336. I've seen these numbers do this every week since set up.

I may have given too much info here, but I figured if you had all of the facts, maybe someone could help me figure this out. I fear my Bangaii isn't going to make it the way he's looking today, other than the fin issue which is new, he seems fine, swimming normal...no idea when he eats, I have never seen him eat, but obviously he does, since he's alive.
 
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I didn't test them because they've consistently been 0 for a long time, do you think I should test?

I haven't checked them in a couple weeks.
If all parameters are normal, I'd then check for Chlorine, Chloramine, and metals.. I'm against chemicals for the most part, but in emergency situations a water conditioner should help.
 
I'm kinda amazed you made it through 4 months of quarantine with 11 chromis. There's plenty of people who have tried to keep them in a large school, without much success. Of course that doesn't explain the cardinal looking so poor, but that may be unrelated? How many chromis are left currently?
 
What is your water change schedule?
Do you run carbon?
What kind of flow do you run?
Do you have a protein skimmer?
I ask about the flow and skimmer because your fish need oxygen dissolved in the water. Orp is complicated but the fluctuations could be because of this.
 
I'm kinda amazed you made it through 4 months of quarantine with 11 chromis. There's plenty of people who have tried to keep them in a large school, without much success. Of course that doesn't explain the cardinal looking so poor, but that may be unrelated? How many chromis are left currently?

Really? I bought them online :), every one of them survived. I read that having more is better than less? They were babies and are still small. I can only find 2 swimming in the tank right now. The cardinal didn't like the move, he's been a little off since putting him in there, staying near the bottom when he used to be middle of the tank fish. I was thinking he didn't like the heavy flow in the tank coming from the Wav's, I have one on each side and only recently moved them up higher, they were centered for a while. He pretty much stayed in the back close to the bottom since the move.
The Chomis never looked bad until they were dead, they were eating, schooling etc. totally normal with the exception of the 2 that went off by themselves, separately.
 
What is your water change schedule?
Do you run carbon?
What kind of flow do you run?
Do you have a protein skimmer?
I ask about the flow and skimmer because your fish need oxygen dissolved in the water. Orp is complicated but the fluctuations could be because of this.

I did a 40g water change on New Years Eve, I had been doing them weekly to try and get an handle on the nitrates and ammonia, the first few were only 30 gal. because I had smaller barrels.
 
What is your water change schedule?
Do you run carbon?
What kind of flow do you run?
Do you have a protein skimmer?
I ask about the flow and skimmer because your fish need oxygen dissolved in the water. Orp is complicated but the fluctuations could be because of this.

Just realized I didn't answer all of this.
I don't run carbon, do you think I should? I've been thinking of getting a carbon reactor, not sure where I'd put it though or how it works/what it's for.
I do have a skimmer, still breaking it in I think...it's all the way open and it's still foaming out of the top! It's a Reef Octopus Regal 250 (it's a beast).
There is a ton of water flow in my tank.
 
If all parameters are normal, I'd then check for Chlorine, Chloramine, and metals.. I'm against chemicals for the most part, but in emergency situations a water conditioner should help.

I use RO/DI water, we have a set up here, there is no chance of chlorine in this water. How do I test for metals and what kind? This is new to me. I've had a saltwater tank for 7 years but using a sump and everything else is all new to me.
 
I should also mention I had still been adding NO3 PO4 -X to the tank as instructed in the Red Sea Reef Mature kit I used, it says to keep adding until the Nitrate levels are 1 to 2ppm.

I've had 1 crab die too, not sure if he was killed by another though, never know with these guys, I've seen their fights.
 
I'm kinda amazed you made it through 4 months of quarantine with 11 chromis. There's plenty of people who have tried to keep them in a large school, without much success. Of course that doesn't explain the cardinal looking so poor, but that may be unrelated? How many chromis are left currently?
Also, now curious why people haven't been successful with them? Do they fight? Mine have always been peaceful. I have a 20g quarantine tank, they were always together in there and in the new one (except the 2 that left the group).
 
I wouldn't worry about chromis dying, they normally pick each other apart till there are only handful left. If these are the only fish you have lost (besides the jumper) I'd ride it out for a bit longer.
 
I use RO/DI water, we have a set up here, there is no chance of chlorine in this water. How do I test for metals and what kind? This is new to me. I've had a saltwater tank for 7 years but using a sump and everything else is all new to me.
if your running an ro/di setup in your house, it should be taking the heavy metals out. Heavy metals in water are more detrimental to inverts and corals, but in high quantities can be toxic to fish as well.. just another thing to rule out I guess, sounds like you're on top of it
 
I wouldn't worry about chromis dying, they normally pick each other apart till there are only handful left. If these are the only fish you have lost (besides the jumper) I'd ride it out for a bit longer.

They've been living together just fine for months, they were in a 20g quarantine tank for a long time because my tank wasn't ready and I didn't want to bother adding them to my previous 75g tank, only to move them again. They never fought or picked at each other, always schooled together and were peaceful. Same thing in the new tank, they've stayed together in a school, I've never seen any fighting issues.

I was wondering if there were issues as the school became smaller.
 
They've been living together just fine for months, they were in a 20g quarantine tank for a long time because my tank wasn't ready and I didn't want to bother adding them to my previous 75g tank, only to move them again. They never fought or picked at each other, always schooled together and were peaceful. Same thing in the new tank, they've stayed together in a school, I've never seen any fighting issues.

I was wondering if there were issues as the school became smaller.
In the small tanks at the LFS the damsels normally seem fine too, they dont seem to kill each other until you buy them lol. I've taken home 20 at one time and only 5 ended up making it. Same problem as you, every day one would hide, another would look sick until I was left with all bullies.
 
Also, now curious why people haven't been successful with them? Do they fight? Mine have always been peaceful. I have a 20g quarantine tank, they were always together in there and in the new one (except the 2 that left the group).


Sometimes they pick on eachother, other times disease is to blame, and other times it seems unexplainable? I've heard also within the past year some fish stores that have gotten in hundreds of these fish with few surviving the long run? I'm not really sure what is to blame, it may be several factors. What I do know, is this is not a rare occurrence unfortunately! There's some ladies and gentlemen here on R2R that have a lot of knowledge about these fish, hopefully some more will chime in!

Are the clowns and the cardinal the only other fish in the tank? Sorry if I missed it.
 

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