Flame Angel with ICK

[jamesbog283]

Hello everyone! I hope everyone had a great holiday and Merry Christmas! I'm going to start another post tonight with details and looking for advice on setting up an new 65 gallon tank I got for Christmas. However for this post I'm looking for advice on how to treat ick on a flame angel I bought yesterday. It was the only one left at my lfs and it seems to have a few minor white spots which I am assuming is ick. I purchased some cupramine, a 10 gallon tank and I'm using a HOB filter, and heater that I had. I haven't got a powerhead that I can put in and I purchased a few 2" pieces of PVC pipe to put in the tank. The fish seems healthy and active and is eating seaweed that I put on a clip in the tank. I added cupramine to a level of about 0.3. Tested with the seachem copper test. I have since read that flame angels are sensitive to copper :/. This is my first attempt at a quarantine and it seems like I'm already screwing up . I can't afford to kill this fish it was $100! I'm in Canada. Lol. I have done alot of reading last night and this morning and people are giving mixed reviews on cupramine and angels. Some say yes and some say no. I have also read that powedered ginger is a good ick treatment? Any and all advice is needed and welcomed. Please help!

 

[jenreefer]

The best and safest treatment if it is ich is CP(Chloroquine Phosphate).

How about some closeup pics of this little guy to help with the ID.

Cupramine is a bit harsh. If you have to use copper, you might want to switch to Coppersafe. If he continues to eat, in the .3 of Cupramine, you can try to up it to .5 slowly and see how he does. Make sure you are using the right test kit for cupramine (salifert) which is more accurate for low levels.

Most natural remedies are ineffective for parasites IMO.

 

[jamesbog283]

I'm at work right now i will try to get some better pics tonight but he seems a little camera shy and keeps swimming away...lol

 

[jamesbog283]

The best and safest treatment if it is ich is CP(Chloroquine Phosphate).

How about some closeup pics of this little guy to help with the ID.

Cupramine is a bit harsh. If you have to use copper, you might want to switch to Coppersafe. If he continues to eat, in the .3 of Cupramine, you can try to up it to .5 slowly and see how he does. Make sure you are using the right test kit for cupramine (salifert) which is more accurate for low levels.

Most natural remedies are ineffective for parasites IMO.

My girlfriend took some pics for me, she says she can't see any white spots on him today . I guess it's a waiting game now? Should I do a 50% water change to get the cupramin to a lower level or just watch and see?

 

[jenreefer]

I cannot tell from the pics if he has lesions. As long as he is eating, get cupramine to .5 so that you are at therapeutic level. If he is not eating, remove the cupramine and determine next step depending on his lesions or need for treatment.

Ich is common and can fall off the fish, only to return in a few days to weeks even worse than before.

Read up in fish disease forum for information on the parasite and its life cycle.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/fish-disease-index.247600/

 

[4FordFamily]

I can assure you ginger won't do anything to help you. I've treated dozens of angels in cupramine and it seems to work well with them if increased slowly.

They need to be at the full therapeutic dose for 30 days. Good luck and beautiful fish!

 

[jamesbog283]

I can assure you ginger won't do anything to help you. I've treated dozens of angels in cupramine and it seems to work well with them if increased slowly.

They need to be at the full therapeutic dose for 30 days. Good luck and beautiful fish!

Thank you, we loves the coloration of him and in 5 months this is only the 3rd or 4th one we've seen at any of our lfs's that's why we bought him even with a few spots on him. We figured we could cure that in the quarantine. I just want to make sure we get it cured before we put him in the DT.

 

[jamesbog283]

I cannot tell from the pics if he has lesions. As long as he is eating, get cupramine to .5 so that you are at therapeutic level. If he is not eating, remove the cupramine and determine next step depending on his lesions or need for treatment.

Ich is common and can fall off the fish, only to return in a few days to weeks even worse than before.

Read up in fish disease forum for information on the parasite and its life cycle.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/fish-disease-index.247600/

Thank you for the help hopefully we get it cured so we can enjoy this gorgeous fish!

 

[Brew12]

Thank you for the help hopefully we get it cured so we can enjoy this gorgeous fish!

I used coppersafe on my flame angel with no issues at all.

I don't see a Seachem ammonia alert badge on your QT, are you using one?

 

[jamesbog283]

I used coppersafe on my flame angel with no issues at all.

I don't see a Seachem ammonia alert badge on your QT, are you using one?

Yes it is on the side wall that is more visible the the more used side of the room. Thank you for noticing and mentioning it!

 

[Brew12]

Yes it is on the side wall that is more visible the the more used side of the room. Thank you for noticing and mentioning it!

Fantastic! And I'm guessing you know that they are best read by shining a flashlight at the back side of the badge, right?

You really are off to a good start with this fish. Well other than the sales price! I thought fish were expensive in the US, but we have nothing on you Canadians!

I'm pretty convinced that just about every fish you can buy comes with an assorted amount of parasites like ich. Some just have less stress and are fed higher quality foods so they are better able to fight the parasites off and don't show the symptoms.

 

[jamesbog283]

Fantastic! And I'm guessing you know that they are best read by shining a flashlight at the back side of the badge, right?

You really are off to a good start with this fish. Well other than the sales price! I thought fish were expensive in the US, but we have nothing on you Canadians!

I'm pretty convinced that just about every fish you can buy comes with an assorted amount of parasites like ich. Some just have less stress and are fed higher quality foods so they are better able to fight the parasites off and don't show the symptoms.

I was not aware of the flashlight to view the badge? Do I take the badge out? Or get a waterproof flashlight? Why would they do that, seems very strange to me.... lol.

 

[Brew12]

I was not aware of the flashlight to view the badge? Do I take the badge out? Or get a waterproof flashlight? Why would they do that, seems very strange to me.... lol.

Nope, just shine the light in through the water. You might not need to if you have a very bright light on your tank. Many people don't use lights on their QT's or just use very cheap lights since bright lights can stress new fish. The coloration on the badges needs to be backlit for it to show properly.

 

[jamesbog283]

It seems coral here are not as brilliant as the ones in the U.S and the fish here seem to be almost double what I've seen on your side of the border. I'll be posting a new thread tonight asking for advice on upgrading my current 29 gallon tank to a 65 I got for Christmas . That's the tank the angel will go into. I'm also planning on getting a copperband butterfly.

 

[jamesbog283]

Nope, just shine the light in through the water. You might not need to if you have a very bright light on your tank. Many people don't use lights on their QT's or just use very cheap lights since bright lights can stress new fish. The coloration on the badges needs to be backlit for it to show properly.

Cool I will do that! Thanks for the heads up! Should I be doing frequent water changes in the QT? Or only when parameters require?

 

[Brew12]

Cool I will do that! Thanks for the heads up! Should I be doing frequent water changes in the QT? Or only when parameters require?

Just like most things in this hobby, everyone tends to have a different opinion.
I like stability so I try to minimize the number of water changes I do. I only do a water change if I get above 0.25ppm ammonia or over 100ppm nitrate. Or if I have cloudy water or some other odd event that would dictate a water change.
If you decide to do them regularly, that is fine and many people do it that way. Just make sure you match the copper level of your new water to your QT prior to doing the change.

 

[melypr1985]

You've gotten some good advice here already! I don't see any spots in the pictures, but it's still a good idea to treat him as if he has it anyway. Cupramine is a fine product and will work. Just keep an eye on him and raise the level the rest of the way to .5 slowly. Make sure he keeps eating and keep the copper level at .5 for a full 30 days. Watch the ammonia and do water changes any time the badge shows anything but yellow. Add the copper to the new water before adding it to the tank so the levels don't get diluted at all.

Ginger and Garlic won't do anything for ick on your fish. It might make the taste better if you're wanting a stir fry though

 

[jamesbog283]

Just like most things in this hobby, everyone tends to have a different opinion.
I like stability so I try to minimize the number of water changes I do. I only do a water change if I get above 0.25ppm ammonia or over 100ppm nitrate. Or if I have cloudy water or some other odd event that would dictate a water change.
If you decide to do them regularly, that is fine and many people do it that way. Just make sure you match the copper level of your new water to your QT prior to doing the change.

Okay thank you! I was planning on trying to keep wc to a minimum anyway so I'll just do regular water tests and change only when required.

 

[jamesbog283]

.....mmmm stir fry! Theres an idea! You're sure going to .5 with the cupramine will be safe for this fish? I don't mean to seem ignorant I've seen so much info you have shared with others on here and I believe u, just nervous.

 

[melypr1985]

.....mmmm stir fry! Theres an idea! You're sure going to .5 with the cupramine will be safe for this fish? I don't mean to seem ignorant I've seen so much info you have shared with others on here and I believe u, just nervous.

All fish are different and not every flame angel will have trouble with cupramine. I've kept more than a few in both cupramine and coppersafe and find coppersafe better.... but if you go slow with ramping up the levels he should be ok. If you ramped it to .3 that quick and he's still doing fine, then I wouldn't worry overmuch. Just take it slow from here and keep us posted