Flame wrasse on side breathing heavy

Wildreefs · Jan 28, 2019

flame wrasse from live Aquaria came Friday. Went into 1.75 copper power quarantine. Added gc on Saturday, yesterday was laying in side, at times breathing heavy.

Was intermittent, the heavy breathing was not all the time, although laying down for most part , only getting up to swim every so often.

Lots of gas exchange, if this were parasite or lack of 02, wouldn’t the breathing part persist all the time? Could it be just stress?

Thanks

Frtdrmrose7 · Jan 28, 2019

Did you ramp up the copper to 1.75 over a few days? Did you do a FW dip before QT to check for flukes? Did you match salinity and temp? What was your acclimation process?

Wildreefs · Jan 28, 2019

Right to 1.75, no dip, and I dripped acclimated for 40 minutes after after floating for 15

dwest · Jan 28, 2019

Wildreefs said:
flame wrasse from live Aquaria came Friday. Went into 1.75 copper power quarantine. Added gc on Saturday, yesterday was laying in side, at times breathing heavy.

Was intermittent, the heavy breathing was not all the time, although laying down for most part , only getting up to swim every so often.

Lots of gas exchange, if this were parasite or lack of 02, wouldn’t the breathing part persist all the time? Could it be just stress?

Thanks

I’m not an expert here, but I would not add gc to copper power. I would do gc added foods with copper power, but not a gc treatment. Hopefully others will chime in here.

I do the following and have a flame wrasse in quarantine now.

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/my-current-qt-process.483371/

Liron Mishal · Jan 28, 2019

I would do a big WC, say 50% and see how she's doing.
if she's looking better, let it be for a while and then raise copper SLOWLY. I am now raising copper in my QT for 6 days ramp, currently at day 3.

dwest · Jan 28, 2019

Wildreefs said:
Right to 1.75, no dip, and I dripped acclimated for 40 minutes after after floating for 15

Even though wrasses are supposed to be ramped up with copper, I bet it is ok to go right to 1.75 if using the Hanna checker. I would be concerned about the salinity change though. My wrasses from LA came in at 24 ppt salinity, and I had to match that.

lilchris_357 · Jan 28, 2019

Fairy wrasses are extremely sensitive to copper. You have to raise the levels slowly. Agreed with Liron Mishal, with water change. Honestly, I would do a 100% and start over after a few days. Hopefully its not too late. Good Luck.

Frtdrmrose7 · Jan 28, 2019

Wildreefs said:
Right to 1.75, no dip, and I dripped acclimated for 40 minutes after after floating for 15

Wrasses are copper sensitive but copper power is better being chelated vs ionic. I would recommend ramping copper up with wrasses over a few days. Do you have strong aeration in the tank? I think I would do a WC get the copper down and ramp it up with a Hanna Checker over the next 4-5 days. I would also wait to do other treatments until the copper is complete except for feeding GC laced foods.

ngoodermuth · Jan 28, 2019

I never drip acclimate mail order fish. I’ll get the shipping salinity ahead of time via email, and match my QT accordingly. It’s easier to go down in salinity than come up. And If you drip while in the same water you shipped with, you have to worry about excessive ammonia.

Once the fish arrives, I’ll poke a small needle hole under the water level and confirm the salinity, then cover with a little piece of tape and leave it float to temp acclimate. Adjust your QT salinity to match if necessary.

After the bag is to temp, splash a little QT water into the bag and then just scoop him out and plop him in. No drip needed.

If you are not using a QT, have a 5-gallon bucket ready and match the salinity. Use an airline and keep a thermometer and little heater nearby for temperature control, and drip acclimate from the shipping salinity to target salinity over the longest period of time you are able/comfortable to do. The longer the better.

He might be in a bit of shock and need some time to recover. I would try to keep stress levels to a minimum and keep an eye on him.

ngoodermuth · Jan 28, 2019

An MB bath could possibly help if he starts looking rough. And keep an eye out for other symptoms of parasites. Good luck!

Methylene Blue
https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?sh...p?threads/Methylene-Blue.257467/&share_type=t

4FordFamily · Jan 28, 2019

@HotRocks and I don’t slowly increase copper we’ve surprisingly had better success acclimating immediately to 1.75 PPM copper. At a minimum, we do 1.0 on arrival and up to 1.75 within 48 hours.

I suspect the reason acclimating them to copper works better than removing it and re-adding because they are exposed to probably 1PPM copper or so (complete conjecture, no way for me to know for sure) at the wholesale level and perhaps elsewhere in the distribution system.

When we say “better success” we don’t mean it’s all sunshine and rainbows — wrasse are tough. We QT them almost solely to keep the parasites they harbor out of our display tanks with parasite-sensitive fish.

GC can be used in conjunction but I would have waited to add it until the fish was settled. Wrasse are sensitive to prazi, too.

Drip acclimating is dangerous, as soon as the bag is open their waste begins converting to deadly ammonia. We don’t acclimate at all. Match salinity to the source (LA is about 1.019) float for 15 and then add the fish.

Wildreefs · Jan 28, 2019

ngoodermuth said:
I never drip acclimate mail order fish. I’ll get the shipping salinity ahead of time via email, and match my QT accordingly. It’s easier to go down in salinity than come up. And If you drip while in the same water you shipped with, you have to worry about excessive ammonia.

Once the fish arrives, I’ll poke a small needle hole under the water level and confirm the salinity, then cover with a little piece of tape and leave it float to temp acclimate. Adjust your QT salinity to match if necessary.

After the bag is to temp, splash a little QT water into the bag and then just scoop him out and plop him in. No drip needed.

If you are not using a QT, have a 5-gallon bucket ready and match the salinity. Use an airline and keep a thermometer and little heater nearby for temperature control, and drip acclimate from the shipping salinity to target salinity over the longest period of time you are able/comfortable to do. The longer the better.

He might be in a bit of shock and need some time to recover. I would try to keep stress levels to a minimum and keep an eye on him.

Oh trust me, I don’t drip acclimate either, ever, however, with live aquaria I do what they instruct in order to stay eligible for their gaurantee .

YellowFinsReef · Jan 28, 2019

Honestly, the stress from hold facility to wholesale (LA) to you may be enough stress to kill the wrasse.

In my experience, I usually wait out a week or two for the fish to settle in and eating regularly before treating with copper. Most wrasses in healthy conditions aren't impacted similarly with ich and velvet as other fish. However, wrasses aren't like most fish that could take several QT beatings and still make it in the end. They're pretty delicate with freshwater dips and chemicals, thus they will need some patience.

If it's on its side already, it may not make a come back.

alton · Jan 28, 2019

I have two Flame Wrasses from LA and they are doing great. I placed them in a 29 gallon observation tank for several weeks before introducing them into my displays. My first one came in medium size 6 months ago, the second came in small two months ago. I did not introduce them to copper, and when I acclimate I run 1/4" hose/tubing at about 25% for 1/2 hour. One is now in my 180, and the other in my office tank. Hoping yours pulls through.