Foxface died during acclimation

[kierstin1993]

Hello, so I bought a magnificent foxface today around 1pm. Took me a little over 2 hours to get it home. I began drip acclimating it and had to run to the store for some coppersafe as I noticed it had a couple spots when I got home. When I got back home it was dead.
Now, I need some reassurance because the shop owner is telling me he’s had this fish healthy and eating for months and that I kept it in the bag too long and shouldn’t have drip acclimated for an hour/hour and a half. I chose to go slow because the fish was breathing heavy and the salinity from the store read 1.016 and mine is reading 1.0265 (just a little higher than 1.026).
Is it just me or would a healthy fish have been fine? I usually do long (hour or so) drip acclimations with no isssues. Also they get shipped so how could a 2 hour drive and 1 1/2 hours acclimating be it’s cause of death?
it’s not the only fish I bought today and the other 2 are doing fine so far.
The store owner is right that I shouldn’t have taken the fish if I didn’t think it was healthy, as I did see one spot in the store but I figured, it’s one spot so I’ll just treat the fish and should be good. That was clearly a huge mistake.
Spots are small and hard to see but if anyone has any insight on what could have caused this fish to die that would be great. Thanks.

 

[kierstin1993]

Parameters:
Salinity: 1.026
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 30
ph: 8.2

 

[vetteguy53081]

Hello, so I bought a magnificent foxface today around 1pm. Took me a little over 2 hours to get it home. I began drip acclimating it and had to run to the store for some coppersafe as I noticed it had a couple spots when I got home. When I got back home it was dead.
Now, I need some reassurance because the shop owner is telling me he’s had this fish healthy and eating for months and that I kept it in the bag too long and shouldn’t have drip acclimated for an hour/hour and a half. I chose to go slow because the fish was breathing heavy and the salinity from the store read 1.016 and mine is reading 1.0265 (just a little higher than 1.026).
Is it just me or would a healthy fish have been fine? I usually do long (hour or so) drip acclimations with no isssues. Also they get shipped so how could a 2 hour drive and 1 1/2 hours acclimating be it’s cause of death?
it’s not the only fish I bought today and the other 2 are doing fine so far.
The store owner is right that I shouldn’t have taken the fish if I didn’t think it was healthy, as I did see one spot in the store but I figured, it’s one spot so I’ll just treat the fish and should be good. That was clearly a huge mistake.
Spots are small and hard to see but if anyone has any insight on what could have caused this fish to die that would be great. Thanks.

Sorry to hear. Often what happens and quickly without warning is first the netting which gets caught in its dorsal and stresses the fish. The with acclimation the carbon dioxide lowers the pH of the water in the bag, That in turn makes the ammonia non-toxic to the fish. When you acclimate them, if not done just right, you drive off the carbon dioxide faster than you are diluting the ammonia. That raises the pH of the water in the bag, and that in turn, makes the residual ammonia very toxic to the fish. Sometimes, the fish will die right in the bag

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Hello, so I bought a magnificent foxface today around 1pm. Took me a little over 2 hours to get it home. I began drip acclimating it and had to run to the store for some coppersafe as I noticed it had a couple spots when I got home. When I got back home it was dead.
Now, I need some reassurance because the shop owner is telling me he’s had this fish healthy and eating for months and that I kept it in the bag too long and shouldn’t have drip acclimated for an hour/hour and a half. I chose to go slow because the fish was breathing heavy and the salinity from the store read 1.016 and mine is reading 1.0265 (just a little higher than 1.026).
Is it just me or would a healthy fish have been fine? I usually do long (hour or so) drip acclimations with no isssues. Also they get shipped so how could a 2 hour drive and 1 1/2 hours acclimating be it’s cause of death?
it’s not the only fish I bought today and the other 2 are doing fine so far.
The store owner is right that I shouldn’t have taken the fish if I didn’t think it was healthy, as I did see one spot in the store but I figured, it’s one spot so I’ll just treat the fish and should be good. That was clearly a huge mistake.
Spots are small and hard to see but if anyone has any insight on what could have caused this fish to die that would be great. Thanks.

I always suggest packing fish with oxygen if they are going to be in the bag longer than an hour.
However, in this case the fish simply went from too low to too high of a specific gravity. You cannot safely drip acclimate for this large of a rise - instead, you need to adjust the receiving tank to within .004 SG units, so in this case to 1.0205 and then acclimate the fish. Long drip acclimation also requires aeration and temperature control.
IMO - your dealer should have warned you that the fish was in that low of a specific gravity.
Jay

 

[kierstin1993]

Sorry to hear. Often what happens and quickly without warning is first the netting which gets caught in its dorsal and stresses the fish. The with acclimation the carbon dioxide lowers the pH of the water in the bag, That in turn makes the ammonia non-toxic to the fish. When you acclimate them, if not done just right, you drive off the carbon dioxide faster than you are diluting the ammonia. That raises the pH of the water in the bag, and that in turn, makes the residual ammonia very toxic to the fish. Sometimes, the fish will die right in the bag

The dorsal fin did get stuck on the net and she shook it out of the net.
I’ve heard of the ammonia rising fast during an acclimation but have been told that’s only a concern when the fish is shipped due to the duration of time spent in the bag. I’ve always slow acclimated and never had a fish die in the bag before….first time shopping at this store so idk….

 

[kierstin1993]

I always suggest packing fish with oxygen if they are going to be in the bag longer than an hour.
However, in this case the fish simply went from too low to too high of a specific gravity. You cannot safely drip acclimate for this large of a rise - instead, you need to adjust the receiving tank to within .004 SG units, so in this case to 1.0205 and then acclimate the fish. Long drip acclimation also requires aeration and temperature control.
IMO - your dealer should have warned you that the fish was in that low of a specific gravity.
Jay

I did make sure I got oxygen in the bag, I used a petite to get air in the water and create some bubbles…maybe I didn’t get enough? I also kept the fish floating in the sump so it would stay the right temperature. I do feel the SG was too low but my usual store keeps theirs pretty low to (I’ve gotten readings from 1.018-1.020) and I’ve never had this happen before…this is my biggest fear with trying out new stores.

 

[kierstin1993]

Sorry to hear. Often what happens and quickly without warning is first the netting which gets caught in its dorsal and stresses the fish. The with acclimation the carbon dioxide lowers the pH of the water in the bag, That in turn makes the ammonia non-toxic to the fish. When you acclimate them, if not done just right, you drive off the carbon dioxide faster than you are diluting the ammonia. That raises the pH of the water in the bag, and that in turn, makes the residual ammonia very toxic to the fish. Sometimes, the fish will die right in the bag

Now I’m wondering if they had ammonia in their tanks and that’s what killed it….I didn’t think to test. Ugh I should have tested their water!

 

[Tamberav]

What you should do is take freshly mixed saltwater and add rodi to bring the salinity down to match the bag the add the fish directly to the new water. This eliminates ammonia being an issue.

At 1.016, I would have put it in a conditioning/temp tank and brought the fish up over days/week.

 

[((FORDTECH))]

This is a case of salinity being raised to fast. From 1.016 to 1.026 should have been done over days not 2 hours.

 

[MnFish1]

IMHO - if indeed the specific gravity in their tank is 1.015 - and(obviously) - the normal reef SG is 1.026 - the diagnostic approach would be:

1. It happened within a couple hours (the death0
2. What happened between hour 1 and lets say hour 4
3. You said the fish had spots on introduction to the tank

My opinion - 1. The fish was sick to begin with.
2. the salinity caused the problem (OR - your acclimation procedure) - (OR - their water was totally different from yours).
3. In any case - I would calmly and politely ask for a refund - UNLESS they told you to acclimate a different way

 

[Rick's Reviews]

Hello, so I bought a magnificent foxface today around 1pm. Took me a little over 2 hours to get it home. I began drip acclimating it and had to run to the store for some coppersafe as I noticed it had a couple spots when I got home. When I got back home it was dead.
Now, I need some reassurance because the shop owner is telling me he’s had this fish healthy and eating for months and that I kept it in the bag too long and shouldn’t have drip acclimated for an hour/hour and a half. I chose to go slow because the fish was breathing heavy and the salinity from the store read 1.016 and mine is reading 1.0265 (just a little higher than 1.026).
Is it just me or would a healthy fish have been fine? I usually do long (hour or so) drip acclimations with no isssues. Also they get shipped so how could a 2 hour drive and 1 1/2 hours acclimating be it’s cause of death?
it’s not the only fish I bought today and the other 2 are doing fine so far.
The store owner is right that I shouldn’t have taken the fish if I didn’t think it was healthy, as I did see one spot in the store but I figured, it’s one spot so I’ll just treat the fish and should be good. That was clearly a huge mistake.
Spots are small and hard to see but if anyone has any insight on what could have caused this fish to die that would be great. Thanks.

Well without your explanation of buying this fish let's dissect your post, you bought a fish and it died, appears like death was over a 2month period, I can ask loads of questions about your aquarium but I honestly don't have the time any more, a little back research, profiles etc,

 

[Lost in the Sauce]

If your shop is sending out fish at 1.016 SG, and not warning you it will take at least 2 Days to bring it up safely, they are a chop shop.

 

[kierstin1993]

Well without your explanation of buying this fish let's dissect your post, you bought a fish and it died, appears like death was over a 2month period, I can ask loads of questions about your aquarium but I honestly don't have the time any more, a little back research, profiles etc,

First, I feel like you misread my post (or I’m misunderstanding you). I bought the fish today. It died during acclimation.
second, why bother posting if you are only going to say you could ask questions but don’t have time? If you don’t have time, than it’s ok to not post at all.

 

[kierstin1993]

IMHO - if indeed the specific gravity in their tank is 1.015 - and(obviously) - the normal reef SG is 1.026 - the diagnostic approach would be:

1. It happened within a couple hours (the death0
2. What happened between hour 1 and lets say hour 4
3. You said the fish had spots on introduction to the tank

My opinion - 1. The fish was sick to begin with.
2. the salinity caused the problem (OR - your acclimation procedure) - (OR - their water was totally different from yours).
3. In any case - I would calmly and politely ask for a refund - UNLESS they told you to acclimate a different way

They offered me store credit if I bring in the fish and a water sample, but I can’t imagine buying a fish there again honestly.
He told me he was mad it died because he had it for months with no issues and I should have acclimated it much faster than I did.
Obviously he was wrong, and I probably should have done it over days, I’ve never had this issue before and the drip acclimation didn’t even get the water to 1.026 yet. It only got to 1.021 in the time I acclimated. I blew bubbles in the bag for some oxygen and kept it up to temp so I was really surprised it died.

 

[Rick's Reviews]

First, I feel like you misread my post (or I’m misunderstanding you). I bought the fish today. It died during acclimation.
second, why bother posting if you are only going to say you could ask questions but don’t have time? If you don’t have time, than it’s ok to not post at all.

Well for a response and reply.
I look forward to a delivery of any fish and crabs etc and I ensure I'm home and I really enjoy the experience, I do everything to ensure my aquarium matches the right requirements as for fish I purchased

 

[kierstin1993]

This is a case of salinity being raised to fast. From 1.016 to 1.026 should have been done over days not 2 hours.

I’ll remember this for next time I buy from somewhere with this low salinity but the water only got to 1.021 before the fish died, I hadn’t finished the acclimation and I used a petite to make bubbles to add oxygen and I kept the bag warm.

 

[((FORDTECH))]

They offered me store credit if I bring in the fish and a water sample, but I can’t imagine buying a fish there again honestly.
He told me he was mad it died because he had it for months with no issues and I should have acclimated it much faster than I did.
Obviously he was wrong, and I probably should have done it over days, I’ve never had this issue before and the drip acclimation didn’t even get the water to 1.026 yet. It only got to 1.021 in the time I acclimated. I blew bubbles in the bag for some oxygen and kept it up to temp so I was really surprised it died.

Honestly I dont think it was the stores fault besides the fact they didn’t say take days to acclimate. My guess is if you did take days fish would have been fine. Next time I would buy the fish but if that much of a difference in salinity I would do it over 2 days or so if not more

 

[kierstin1993]

Well for a response and reply.
I look forward to a delivery of any fish and crabs etc and I ensure I'm home and I really enjoy the experience, I do everything to ensure my aquarium matches the right requirements as for fish I purchased

I have no idea how this is relevant. Again if you read my post you’d know I watched the woman bag it and drove home for 2 hours, so clearly I bought it in store. What does you waiting for a fish delivery have to do with any of this? Nothing.

 

[((FORDTECH))]

I’ll remember this for next time I buy from somewhere with this low salinity but the water only got to 1.021 before the fish died, I hadn’t finished the acclimation and I used a petite to make bubbles to add oxygen and I kept the bag warm.

It does seem strange to me but even from 1.016 to 1.021 is a lot

 

[Rick's Reviews]

Well for a response and reply.
I look forward to a delivery of any fish and crabs etc and I ensure I'm home and I really enjoy the experience, I do everything to ensure my aquarium matches the right requirements as for fish I purchased

I have not lost any fish due to acclamating problems and unsure how to provide you any other assistance