Generator

[DIYreefer]

We bought a generac 16,000 generator - plumbed with natural gas. The cost - about $5000 installed. Luckily we had easy location to a gas line (near our grill). It powers most of the important circuits in the house that are important (like refrigerators, stove, freezers, and of course the tanks) - and also starts automatically (which is important when one is on vacation, etc).

I would consider, though - considering the purchase of a battery which uses your home electricity to charge - then provides power when the power goes off - they can be pricey - but if I had it to do over again - thats the route I would go.

Wow, that seems like a REALLY good deal. I've always been under the impression that those generators were in the 15-20k range. I'm going to have to do some research now.

 

[MnFish1]

Wow, that seems like a REALLY good deal. I've always been under the impression that those generators were in the 15-20k range. I'm going to have to do some research now.

they are not now if you're in the middle of a hurricane. maybe

 

[Reefering1]

they are not now if you're in the middle of a hurricane. maybe

Too bad natural gas isn't a option here... I think(wild guess) its 15-20k when they have to bury and fill a tank to run it

 

[DIYreefer]

Too bad natural gas isn't a option here... I think(wild guess) its 15-20k when they have to bury and fill a tank to run it

Makes sense. Fortunately, my house has a gas stove and water heater. Shouldn't be too hard to plumb in a generator.

 

[Reefering1]

Makes sense. Fortunately, my house has a gas stove and water heater. Shouldn't be too hard to plumb in a generator.

I wish... added benefit is stove/oven water heater without loading the generator. The 2 things that make my generator struggle. The burners work but generator sounds like it doesn't like it. Maybe I should get a hot plate, or bigger generator

 

[ca1ore]

Used various gasoline powered gennys for years. Rigid 6500/8500 was the best of the lot. I’m sure somebody has mentioned the importance of ‘exercising’ these things occasionally so that when you need it …..

Problem with a manual system is somebody has to be home to get it up and running. But, it’s a relatively inexpensive system. About 5 years ago I decided to get a 20K standby. I have no gas service, so three 125 gallon propane tanks now enhance the look of my yard. Enhanced the cost of the system also. About $12K. System will run for about 5 days intil a gas refill is required. If roads are Not clear out will come the old Rigid. Backup for the backup.

 

[olonmv]

We bought a generac 16,000 generator - plumbed with natural gas. The cost - about $5000 installed. Luckily we had easy location to a gas line (near our grill). It powers most of the important circuits in the house that are important (like refrigerators, stove, freezers, and of course the tanks) - and also starts automatically (which is important when one is on vacation, etc).

I would consider, though - considering the purchase of a battery which uses your home electricity to charge - then provides power when the power goes off - they can be pricey - but if I had it to do over again - thats the route I would go.

With all due respect, it’s difficult to see how you’d pay 5k for this set up. The genny and ATS alone are in the 5k range, set aside cost of labor and material needed to plumb and wire to install the genny. That setup is easily in the 10K plus range after all materials are factored in, even before all the supply chain issues of todays age.

 

[DIYreefer]

Used various gasoline powered gennys for years. Rigid 6500/8500 was the best of the lot.

Good to know, that's the one that I have. It has been flawless for the few times that I have used it.

 

[olonmv]

What, does it need to hold the trigger to keep cranking until generator starts? Or more complicated than that?

It’s involved. Needs triggers/timer relays for choke, start/stop etc etc etc. or I can go the ATS route which already has all that.

 

[MartinM]

I am not (at all) a fan of battery storage. I have pretty extensive background in power backup systems, both small scale (home, servers, small business) as well as large (data center).

Batteries are big, heavy, costly, have a limited lifespan and extremely dangerous in high current configurations and have a finite runtime based on load . Good inverters and charging systems are very expensive. Most setups don’t due well with square wave or inductive loads and don’t do well with high inrush current switching.

FWIW we only use battery backup in most situations to hold the load for the few seconds it takes the generator to start and come up to speed.

Even at small scale, I would take a small lightweight Honda.

If batteries work for you that is great. Certainly not my first choice or what I would advise in most situations.

Good points, but 1) it’s a difficult option in a high rise and 2) it requires being home if one lives in a high rise. I went with whole home battery backup, aquarium battery backups, and a portable generator. The latter requires me to be at home though, but the former two don’t, and will run the tanks for days before needing a generator. But you’re right, it’s a lot of batteries: 120kg of batteries actually. I would have preferred to do natural gas switchover, but they don’t have low pressure natural gas generator options for high rises here that I could get approved. I tried. (Japan doesn’t operate on high pressure gas for residential).

Most Japanese that do not live in the tidal zone

I have lived in several areas of the US, not in tidal zones. Electricity was out at least once per month no matter where I was. I’ve never once lost power here in typhoons or during earthquakes. In a typhoon strong enough to throw a cargo ship into an airport, the power flickered a few times. Japan is to the US what the US is to India, the infrastructure here is just in an entirely different class. But I’m taking absolutely zero chances, so I have the capability to run my tanks for weeks if need be!

 

[Reefering1]

It’s involved. Needs triggers/timer relays for choke, start/stop etc etc etc. or I can go the ATS route which already has all that.

Sounds like the ats is the way to go

 

[olonmv]

Sounds like the ats is the way to go

It makes life easier but at upwards of $700 USD is what makes me cringe. Especially since I rarely lose power. Aside from that, I love a DIY challenge. I could piece a setup together for about $250. Just takes some thought, luckily commercial electrical is my trade so it shouldn't be too difficult.

 

[snorklr]

Not if you put premium gas in, you only need to treat the blended gasolines, ethanol blends etc.

not true...gasoline has been going bad in storage long before ethanol was added to to its share of problems...any old mechanic recognizes the smell of stale gas... thats why products like Sta-bil were developed in the first place...companies now have newer products to try to deal with the additional ethanol issues...leaded gas would leave a coating that resisted corrosion, while ethanol is a better solvent and leaves parts "cleaner" and more prone to corrode...in addition water mixes with ethanol so theres usually a certain amount of water dissolved in the gas...but as the gas evaporates it can leave the water behind to cause corrosion...oh yeah and ethanol dissolves rubber compounds that werent specifically designed to resist them

 

[jerl77]

Whole house generator
Best thing I bought for my house ……

 

[Reefering1]

It makes life easier but at upwards of $700 USD is what makes me cringe. Especially since I rarely lose power. Aside from that, I love a DIY challenge. I could piece a setup together for about $250. Just takes some thought, luckily commercial electrical is my trade so it shouldn't be too difficult.

What's the plan for the choke control, a solenoid? How would you be sure it stays long enough when its cold and not too long when its hot?

 

[MnFish1]

Good points, but 1) it’s a difficult option in a high rise and 2) it requires being home if one lives in a high rise. I went with whole home battery backup, aquarium battery backups, and a portable generator. The latter requires me to be at home though, but the former two don’t, and will run the tanks for days before needing a generator. But you’re right, it’s a lot of batteries: 120kg of batteries actually. I would have preferred to do natural gas switchover, but they don’t have low pressure natural gas generator options for high rises here that I could get approved. I tried. (Japan doesn’t operate on high pressure gas for residential).




I have lived in several areas of the US, not in tidal zones. Electricity was out at least once per month no matter where I was. I’ve never once lost power here in typhoons or during earthquakes. In a typhoon strong enough to throw a cargo ship into an airport, the power flickered a few times. Japan is to the US what the US is to India, the infrastructure here is just in an entirely different class. But I’m taking absolutely zero chances, so I have the capability to run my tanks for weeks if need be!

Yes - there are at least 1-2 power outages per month in the spring storm season - sometimes lasting multiple hours. .

The Japan comment related to the person saying they had never had a power outage - I was remembering the Tsunami's/ problems with Fukushima. Of course - if you have a tsunami flowing through your house, you have bigger problems than a generator

 

[olonmv]

What's the plan for the choke control, a solenoid? How would you be sure it stays long enough when its cold and not too long when its hot?

For the choke, there are actuators that can drive it. With regular exercise and regular keep up of genny I don’t see choke a being an issue in hot or cold weather ( I’m in texas) with a minute delay or so for engine warm up before transfer. I haven’t really priced any components so at the end of the day it may be cheaper to go with a generator controller to work the ATS I’m looking at. The actuator for choke on most portables is something that has to be installed despite ATS route taken.

 

[Reefering1]

For the choke, there are actuators that can drive it. With regular exercise and regular keep up of genny I don’t see choke a being an issue in hot or cold weather ( I’m in texas) with a minute delay or so for engine warm up before transfer. I haven’t really priced any components so at the end of the day it may be cheaper to go with a generator controller to work the ATS I’m looking at. The actuator for choke on most portables is something that has to be installed despite ATS route taken.

Im always looking to improve my system/ backups. I will really like to see how you implement this... do you have knowledge of how current whole home standby generators manage all of this? Is natural gas/propane service available in your area? Rod you have a on site tank? Any preference or opinion on gasoline vs propane/ natural gas?

 

[olonmv]

Im always looking to improve my system/ backups. I will really like to see how you implement this... do you have knowledge of how current whole home standby generators manage all of this? Is natural gas/propane service available in your area? Rod you have a on site tank? Any preference or opinion on gasoline vs propane/ natural gas?

My home is on a 150a breaker but draws 25ish per leg when loaded down. My generator is capable of running about 36a peak for a short amount of time. I clamped 25ish (I really can’t remember) max around peak heat in texas and ran the generator for a little over an hour, several tv’s, internet modem, all lights and the kids playing PS with the ac intermittently kicking on and off along with 2 fridges, And the generator never flinched going into and out of eco mode with ease. Under emergency situations I can manage power usage better and more conservatively. As for fuel, They sell a conversion kit for generators to convert for natural gas and gasoline. I’m lucky enough to have natural gas connections at my place so that’ll be next step depending on usage. As for preference, I have none but be aware that natural gas produces less wattage than its gasoline counterpart. Gas burns stronger. But it doesn’t lose a whole lot.

 

[BeanAnimal]

Good points, but 1) it’s a difficult option in a high rise and 2) it requires being home if one lives in a high rise. I went with whole home battery backup, aquarium battery backups, and a portable generator. The latter requires me to be at home though, but the former two don’t, and will run the tanks for days before needing a generator. But you’re right, it’s a lot of batteries: 120kg of batteries actually. I would have preferred to do natural gas switchover, but they don’t have low pressure natural gas generator options for high rises here that I could get approved. I tried. (Japan doesn’t operate on high pressure gas for residential).




I have lived in several areas of the US, not in tidal zones. Electricity was out at least once per month no matter where I was. I’ve never once lost power here in typhoons or during earthquakes. In a typhoon strong enough to throw a cargo ship into an airport, the power flickered a few times. Japan is to the US what the US is to India, the infrastructure here is just in an entirely different class. But I’m taking absolutely zero chances, so I have the capability to run my tanks for weeks if need be!

Yes battery systems have a place when a generator is not an option.