Greater than 8ppm ammonia new tank

[BurtMacklin]

Hi everyone. New reefer here. First of all thank you to this amazing community. I custom drilled a 65 gallon tank to install a Modular Marine overflow and built my own sump, largely based on advice from this forum and BRS. Just ran into a problem after filling the tank and starting the cycle. I have 60lb of caribsea live sand and about 40lb of cured (reincarnated) rock. The rocks were bleached, given a muriatic acid bath, rinsed in RODI, then sat for a couple weeks. To start the cycle I added Microbacter7 according to the bottle and 80% of the recommended ammonia from Dr. Tim's ammonia last night. Checked the ammonia levels this morning and they're greater than 8ppm based on my API test kit. I'm in the process of doing a 50% water change, but I'm wondering if this level of ammonia will kill the nitrite oxidizing bacteria in the sand and Microbacter7 and if anyone has advice on how this could have gotten so high. I don't have another kit on hand, but I can order one or go out and get one tomorrow if anyone thinks I should double check it. I know API can have non-zero values for zero ammonia but >8ppm is concerning. I should have done a baseline test after filling it, but I didn't expect there to be any source of ammonia. Spec Grav=1.025, pH=8.0, nitrite=0, nitrate=0. Any help is appreciated.

 

[brandon429]

no it wont kill


despite rumors and the actual maker of the bac saying it will heh

proof:

100% Water Change

So in my previous thread, I had an ammonia issue that was out of hand. As suggested, I did a 100% WC and now i’m wondering when I should start adding fish back. If anyone has suggestions, let me know!

www.reef2reef.com

 

[Garf]

So the rocks were bleached in 14ph ish then acid nuked in ph 1 - 2 ish?

 

[KrisReef]

Hi everyone. New reefer here. First of all thank you to this amazing community. I custom drilled a 65 gallon tank to install a Modular Marine overflow and built my own sump, largely based on advice from this forum and BRS. Just ran into a problem after filling the tank and starting the cycle. I have 60lb of caribsea live sand and about 40lb of cured (reincarnated) rock. The rocks were bleached, given a muriatic acid bath, rinsed in RODI, then sat for a couple weeks. To start the cycle I added Microbacter7 according to the bottle and 80% of the recommended ammonia from Dr. Tim's ammonia last night. Checked the ammonia levels this morning and they're greater than 8ppm based on my API test kit. I'm in the process of doing a 50% water change, but I'm wondering if this level of ammonia will kill the nitrite oxidizing bacteria in the sand and Microbacter7 and if anyone has advice on how this could have gotten so high. I don't have another kit on hand, but I can order one or go out and get one tomorrow if anyone thinks I should double check it. I know API can have non-zero values for zero ammonia but >8ppm is concerning. I should have done a baseline test after filling it, but I didn't expect there to be any source of ammonia. Spec Grav=1.025, pH=8.0, nitrite=0, nitrate=0. Any help is appreciated.

Right about the baseline. do you have any, or can you make some new mixed saltwater that doesn't have any ammonia added? Mix up a waterglass full and test?

 

[BurtMacklin]

So the rocks were bleached in 14ph ish then acid nuked in ph 1 - 2 ish?

The bleach rocks were rinsed in RODI and sat for 24 hrs before the acid bath. Bleach dissipates quickly in light and I probably didn't need to let them sit for more than a few hours. Just need to have a lot of baking soda on hand to neutralize if necessary. See this thread.

 

[vetteguy53081]

the first 4-5 days it will be high and should slowly come down. You may add a couple ML of liquid bacteria each day to build your culture

 

[BurtMacklin]

Right about the baseline. do you have any, or can you make some new mixed saltwater that doesn't have any ammonia added? Mix up a waterglass full and tes

Just tested the new RODI and it was 0.25ppm, which seems to be the lowest the API tests will read. I'm heating the water and adding the salt now. I can update you after I get it up to 1.025.

the first 4-5 days it will be high and should slowly come down. You may add a couple ML of liquid bacteria each day to build your culture

Is that high normal? The bottle said 4 drops/gallon and 1 tsp for 100 drops to achieve 2ppm. I figured about 75-80 gallons between my tank and sump, so 75*4=300 drops or 3 tsp. I used 2 tsp which is 67% of the recommended dose (80% typed above was only considering my tank) and I ended up >8 ppm instead of 2ppm. Wondering how it got this high. I definitely did not use Tbs instead of tsp for anyone wondering.

 

[TrevorL]

It will take about a week for your ammonia to drop to 0ppm. I too use API test kits and they are not the most reliable. I had a frogspawn die a couple weeks ago and my API tests were showing numbers I didn’t like so I brought my water to a local fish store and everything was perfect with the water. My new lighting is what killed it.

 

[TrevorL]

Your ammonia being that high is normal for just starting a tank nothing to be worried about.

 

[KrisReef]

That test kit you have is only good to indicate that you added ammonia and that it is in the tank. Don't let the API test kit ruin your new start. Relax and let the bacteria eat, grow, and colonize the rock.

 

[dropoff729]

Yes, the ammonia will drop just give it some time. Nitrifying bacteria will convert it to nitrites and nitrates. Correct me if I’m wrong.

 

[BurtMacklin]

Great, thanks for all the advice (before I did a water change haha). I read that the very high ammonia levels can kill the nitrite oxidizing bacteria, preventing the nitrite from being converted to nitrate, so I got spooked. Should I plan on using considerably less ammonia the next time I dose then? And if we're concerned about the reliability of the API ammonia test, should I really be using it to track the ammonia trending down to schedule my next dosing? Thanks for the help everyone.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Just tested the new RODI and it was 0.25ppm, which seems to be the lowest the API tests will read. I'm heating the water and adding the salt now. I can update you after I get it up to 1.025.

Is that high normal? The bottle said 4 drops/gallon and 1 tsp for 100 drops to achieve 2ppm. I figured about 75-80 gallons between my tank and sump, so 75*4=300 drops or 3 tsp. I used 2 tsp which is 67% of the recommended dose (80% typed above was only considering my tank) and I ended up >8 ppm instead of 2ppm. Wondering how it got this high. I definitely did not use Tbs instead of tsp for anyone wondering.

TEST EVERY 2-3 days and see if the numbers begin to drop

 

[Garf]

With ammonia at 8, you’re going to end up with really high nitrate, assuming it cycles at all. You may as well ditch half now, and bring ammonia down to accepted levels. The ammo bottle said 4 drops per gallon? Sounds a bit odd.

 

[greetl01]

With ammonia at 8, you’re going to end up with really high nitrate, assuming it cycles at all. You may as well ditch half now, and bring ammonia down to accepted levels. The ammo bottle said 4 drops per gallon? Sounds a bit odd.

Probably QukCycl. That's what I used and it was definitely 4 drops per gallon. Maybe he didn't take into account the live rock and sand. That was my mistake when I started my cycle. Took it down from 29 gallons to 20 and 4 drops put me right at 2ppm. They ought to specify that TBH

 

[brandon429]

a neat takeaway from the work link above is that on the date the bottle bac says to be ready, if we change out the water, it is.

waiting X days for the wastewater to clear literally does not add more bacteria to activated surfaces. Most would assume it does.

The impact of the method is that you can make a cycled reef be ready on any day you want, this means you can start reef conventions on time or break normal cycling rules in your home...set up emergency tanks and never fail, or run online cycles all day and they all turn out the same way at the same time (longest time they'll take is what a cycling chart shows, and usually much less time reqd)

old rules simply said you had to wait for all the metabolites to clear out of the wastewater. Im very glad nobody at reef conventions adhere to those rules, we like seeing living reefs there all skipped cycle and transfer-ready for opening date. going off old rules, all reef convention entrants must show up 30-90 days early with bottle bac, shrimp, already cycled live rock lol, and begin the arbitration. 70% will not make the start date, they'll be stalled.

timed start dates= cycling rules that sellers use. nobody misses a start date or has a stall. ever.

wait for eighty days, then wait longer if needed= is buyer's rules. buyers buy things to unstick a not stuck cycle, that's the gradient at work. changing the water also works...

 

[Rubberfrog]

I put new water and rock/sand in my tank. Added some food. Added bacteria a few day later. These were my test results after about a week-

SG 1.026 refractometer
pH 8.1 redsea
Ammonia NH3/NH4 0 redsea
Nitrate 2-5 redsea
Phosphate .02 Hanna ULR
dKH 8.5 Hanna

 

[BurtMacklin]

With ammonia at 8, you’re going to end up with really high nitrate, assuming it cycles at all. You may as well ditch half now, and bring ammonia down to accepted levels. The ammo bottle said 4 drops per gallon? Sounds a bit odd.

 

[BurtMacklin]

Probably QukCycl. That's what I used and it was definitely 4 drops per gallon. Maybe he didn't take into account the live rock and sand. That was my mistake when I started my cycle. Took it down from 29 gallons to 20 and 4 drops put me right at 2ppm. They ought to specify that TBH

Posted a picture in another response. It was Dr. Tim's Ammonia. I only used 2/3 the recommended dose. I doubt the sand and rocks displaced >33% or 25 gallons.

 

[DiefsReef]

I went through this exact scenario recently and it was all due to the API test kit.
Get a Red Sea kit or at least a Salifert and test. I ended up getting both to compare and results where much better.
API said my ammonia was high and no Nitrates. Salifert and RedSea both said ammonia at 2 and nitrates at 10.
Dont use API!