Guys will my plumbing design work.. Help needed

[Freenow54]

For the OP.

Your 3/4 inch drain for a 55 DT is fine. I use a 1 inch on my 180 and it is silent, safe and even with three 90 degree elbows it flows just fine.

In a herbie overflow it is desirable to have the primary (full syphon) drain at least 6 inches below the emergency drain. Don't sweat it if you can't pull this off. It just makes that initial tank start up quicker and quieter because the primary is able to obtain a full syphon faster.

You can use whatever kind of valve you want for the main drain. However, ball valves are not designed for flow regulation, whereas gate valves are. My personal recommendation is that you buy the best gate valve you can afford.

Again a globe valve is the valve designed for flow regulation neither ball or gates are

 

[twentyleagues]

I do regular maintenance as well about every 2 weeks. I have no idea why it overflowed. It has been stated on this site that they all eventually do. It must have to do with the motor ie impeller speed. Anyway I came home to about half my 40 gallon on the floor. I had enough space behind the tank to put a garbage can with an oval shape and ran the cup overflow into it. Don't know if that little outlet will handle the flow. Maybe I should put another directly under it. What scares me if the in sump ones overflow what happens. One time I removed the cup on the 40 and spilled it into the tank. Immediate death of all fish except clown

Mine doesnt have a "cup" what is this "cup"? I have never seen a tidal 110 with a cup can you post a pic?

 

[KStatefan]

Again a globe valve is the valve designed for flow regulation neither ball or gates are

How many people are using globe valves? A good gate valve works fine in this application

 

[twentyleagues]

Again a globe valve is the valve designed for flow regulation neither ball or gates are

Again Gate valves are used in reefing. It is not the same as any other plumbing.

 

[Bxr126]

Again a globe valve is the valve designed for flow regulation neither ball or gates are

As a matter of engineering design you are correct. Globe valves are the ideal method of flow regulation. However, in the aquarium hobby where flow rates and pressures are minimal, damage to the valve seat and valve disc (trim components) are not a concern. I stand by my recommendation.

 

[Reefing_addiction]

So this entire debate about valves I went and googled what each one is good for

And guess what
Gate valves cannot handle a strong flow of media while in a partially open position, and thus are not used for regulating flow.

BUT it’s not like we are talking about strong flow really just gravity fed flow - but maybe that’s strong flow?

Ball valves are only really meant for on or off since they are quarter-turn valves.
EDIT: One characteristic of ball valves is their exponential flow rate, which means that the volume of media flowing through the valve increases or decreases at an exponential rate when the valve is opened or closed.


Really the ONLY valve that is meant for flow regulation is those globe valves

Learn something new everyday

 

[Reefing_addiction]

So we should definitely not recommend ball valves

 

[twentyleagues]

So this entire debate about valves I went and googled what each one is good for

And guess what
Gate valves cannot handle a strong flow of media while in a partially open position, and thus are not used for regulating flow.

BUT it’s not like we are talking about strong flow really just gravity fed flow - but maybe that’s strong flow?

Ball valves are only really meant for on or off since they are quarter-turn valves.
EDIT: One characteristic of ball valves is their exponential flow rate, which means that the volume of media flowing through the valve increases or decreases at an exponential rate when the valve is opened or closed.


Really the ONLY valve that is meant for flow regulation is those globe valves

Learn something new everyday

I guess if one want to spend even more money a globe valve would be the way to go......
About double the cost of a gate valve which is 2 to 3 times as much as a ball valve. Ball valve is a no go though. Only benefit I see would be if total shut off of that pipe was required which I dont see it ever needing to be.

 

[Reefing_addiction]

I guess if one want to spend even more money a globe valve would be the way to go......
About double the cost of a gate valve which is 2 to 3 times as much as a ball valve. Ball valve is a no go though. Only benefit I see would be if total shut off of that pipe was required which I dont see it ever needing to be.

Well if you were to need to change out your sump? But a gate valve would close it just as well as globe.
It might be handy to look more into the different type of gate valves…because of course there are different versions - I think a parallel gate valve is the most similar to a globe. Gate valves when fully open do not restrict water flow at all unlike a ball valve.

Yeah price wise on valve the middle ground seems to be where I’ll stick. Even when I go to plumb my new tank. Though I may look into a better union than current since that seems to be my issue

 

[Freenow54]

As a matter of engineering design you are correct. Globe valves are the ideal method of flow regulation. However, in the aquarium hobby where flow rates and pressures are minimal, damage to the valve seat and valve disc (trim components) are not a concern. I stand by my recommendation.

Just to point out my OCT in the sump skimmer uses a globe, and very touchy

 

[Freenow54]

So this entire debate about valves I went and googled what each one is good for

And guess what
Gate valves cannot handle a strong flow of media while in a partially open position, and thus are not used for regulating flow.

BUT it’s not like we are talking about strong flow really just gravity fed flow - but maybe that’s strong flow?

Ball valves are only really meant for on or off since they are quarter-turn valves.
EDIT: One characteristic of ball valves is their exponential flow rate, which means that the volume of media flowing through the valve increases or decreases at an exponential rate when the valve is opened or closed.


Really the ONLY valve that is meant for flow regulation is those globe valves

Learn something new everyday

I did not mean for my comment to cause an issue or recommendation on flow control. I just noticed that my ball valves pick up salt creep, and or maybe leaking through the stem. I do not know. What I do know is they were not in service long, and they did not want to turn. I assumed a gate valve would be worse since salt is so corrosive. If you set a flow rate once of course it would not matter . But would not depend on them for total shut off down the road

 

[threebuoys]

I do regular maintenance as well about every 2 weeks. I have no idea why it overflowed. It has been stated on this site that they all eventually do. It must have to do with the motor ie impeller speed. Anyway I came home to about half my 40 gallon on the floor. I had enough space behind the tank to put a garbage can with an oval shape and ran the cup overflow into it. Don't know if that little outlet will handle the flow. Maybe I should put another directly under it. What scares me if the in sump ones overflow what happens. One time I removed the cup on the 40 and spilled it into the tank. Immediate death of all fish except clown

I'm a bit confused. What happens if you have a power failure? Surely you don't have an over flow then? I assume the capacity of your sump is adequate to hold all gravity fed water from the DT until the siphon is broken? Maybe I'm just not understanding your setup.

 

[Freenow54]

I'm a bit confused. What happens if you have a power failure? Surely you don't have an over flow then? I assume the capacity of your sump is adequate to hold all gravity fed water from the DT until the siphon is broken? Maybe I'm just not understanding your setup.

Sorry No I was talking about my hang on the back skimmer going berserk. Not because of power failure

 

[Reefing_addiction]

I did not mean for my comment to cause an issue or recommendation on flow control. I just noticed that my ball valves pick up salt creep, and or maybe leaking through the stem. I do not know. What I do know is they were not in service long, and they did not want to turn. I assumed a gate valve would be worse since salt is so corrosive. If you set a flow rate once of course it would not matter . But would not depend on them for total shut off down the road

So I don’t think you caused an issue. There was another guy though who got stuck in a 3/4 inch drain line. And he was a professional plumber. But as someone so kindly pointed out I don’t think tank plumbing and real world plumbing match up. We’re talking gravity drain from a 55. Flow rate of a 3/4 inch pipe is 660 gph (to low pressure). 1 inch would probably be overkill and he would definitely need a valve to throttle it. But I digress.

I think we all just use what everyone tells us to use because they said it’s the way to go. There is so much I don’t know compared to what I do. I’m glad you made me go down a small rabbit hole to figure things out.

I’ve heard more people have issues with ball valves. I am assuming we all throttle our drain lines a bit. I’ve had the same gate valve on my tank since it went up 4 years ago. I’m 99% I over tightened the union before my gate valve…oops…because it’s leaking. Good news the way my current set up is plumbed the leak happens to go into the sump. So I’m not stressed, especially when I have a new tank on the way and a new sump - well when every they get it built!

It’s good for us to listen and learn from EVERYONE! I will probably look more into different gate valves. A parallel valve might be better.

I think salt really only becomes an issue if the line wasn’t fully siphoned?? Seals may go bad after a bit but not quickly. Anywho won’t go back down that train of thought or I’ll be here all night.


The point is, as long as we all share information and we are receptive to it cool. People need to stop telling people they are wrong without digging down and doing their homework.

At the end we are all right and wrong.
Each tank and reefer is right for their own reasons.

I’m just always open to learning and making decisions based on actual knowledge and not “because everyone says so” or even “because so and so said so”

Thanks for reading! And responding!

 

[Freenow54]

I went to my local LFS Not a single gate valve in sight. But I have listened and re

piping my sump