Hawaii ban is official.

[BZOFIQ]

I was going to get a group of 7 to 9 yellows for my incoming 270 but I guess a change of plans. I'm going to miss access Kole's more than yellows. Yellow Eyed Kole has always been one of my favorites.

Timing really sucks for me.

 

[The Tang Police]

Yes please! Any companies that use Hawaii as a resource should have to send some percent of their revenue to build back the reefs. The money should also be used to fund a real “tang police” to protect against poaching.

Are they hiring?

 

[BZOFIQ]

How do the captive bred yellow tangs look these days? When they first came out they weren’t very appealing to the eye.

The ones I've seen a few years back looked washed out in color.

 

[Potatohead]

The ones I've seen a few years back looked washed out in color.

I think that's just because they are small. If they are deformed that is another story but I have seen lots that look normal, just pale. I think they darken as they get bigger.

 

[OrionN]

I think that pale color is not a problem, it is just because they are small, or poor diet that can be correct with age and possible better care. Deformity is another mater. Similar to a lot of the tank raise fish, like Court Jester goby, Orchid Dottyback and clown fish, these are just poor specimen and there is no cure for them.

 

[gafoley]

There is substantial evidence that the aquarium collection practice has detrimental effects. A studied on the issue concluded "There was a significant difference in the abundance of aquarium fishes between control and collection sites but no differences in the abundance of nonaquarium species between these sites." https://www.researchgate.net/public...ollectors_on_Coral_Reef_Fishes_in_Kona_Hawaii

You don't get denied by the state Senate, state House, and unanimously rejected in your appeal by the Hawai'i Supreme Court and Hawaii’s Environmental Council without strong evidence that mismanagement is occurring, especially when you are on the side of the industry, which loses relatively rarely, especially on environmental issues.

Getting denied by three branches of government in a liberal state like Hawaii is not surprising. These people are beholden to environmental groups. The studies I referred to were conducted by the state's own Dept. of Natural resources scientists. Also, the study you cite seems to focus only on one collecting area, not the other collecting sites in Hawaii. Not to be cynical, but I've seen other studies (namely Leopard Shark fishery in California) that cherry pick and massage evidence and methods to get the desired result. I think at this point it would be practical to have outside investigators look at the areas in question. Too many agendas at play here.

 

[hds4216]

Getting denied by three branches of government in a liberal state like Hawaii is not surprising. These people are beholden to environmental groups. The studies I referred to were conducted by the state's own Dept. of Natural resources scientists. Also, the study you cite seems to focus only on one collecting area, not the other collecting sites in Hawaii. Not to be cynical, but I've seen other studies (namely Leopard Shark fishery in California) that cherry pick and massage evidence and methods to get the desired result. I think at this point it would be practical to have outside investigators look at the areas in question. Too many agendas at play here.

You say it so nefariously, “beholden to environmental groups.” Maybe they just... care about the environment?


I agree about the independent investigators though.

 

[Brew12]

So I've been digging into this a little more. This most recent ban isn't related to any information contained in scientific studies. The issue is regarding having an Environmental Impact Study done on what effect the aquarium collection industry has. It looks like several were submitted but they have been rejected by the State.

And to fully elaborate, this full ban isn't even the result of new information. Hawaii fisheries responded to past court rulings by banning fine mesh net collection and not issuing new permits. An environment group sued saying that the previous court order should have banned all collection. The courts agreed and that is why the full ban is implemented. This ban is in place until the state approves an EIS on collection.

Here is the state report from 2020.
Microsoft Word - MASTER 2019 10 04_REPORT TO THE LEGISLATURE_final_formatting (hawaii.gov)

It clearly shows that Yellow Tangs are not over collected and their numbers continue to grow. However, you could make a solid case that Achilles Tangs should not be collected and that reductions in fishing of them is also necessary. I also found it interesting that they do not have enough information on Flame Wrasses to determine if sustainable collection is currently possible. They don't see enough on each dive to have data confidence.

 

[OceanDiver]

I think captive breeding programs are the reason Hawaii is going that route. Yellow tangs are a possibility through Biota and other captive breeders. You can thank the people on the Hawaiian islands that actively break the laws and illegally fish for the current ban and views on the aquarium trade there.

Hawaii County man arrested for illegal catch of aquarium fish

Officers spotted a vessel in the West Hawaii Regional Fisheries Management Area off South point and discovered 333 Yellow Tang and three Pakuikui (Achilles tang).

www.hawaiinewsnow.com

Kona men cited for illegal aquarium fish, gear - Hawaii Tribune-Herald

Kona men cited for illegal aquarium fish, gear - Hawaii News | Hawaii Tribune-Herald

www.hawaiitribune-herald.com

I have seen these. They look nothing like the real thing. They are usually pale yellow. It’s kinda like the yellow watchman goby that aren’t wild caught. Those are a yellowish gray

 

[OceanDiver]

Being a Navy diver, I have dove all over Hawaii. You literally can’t jump in the water without seeing a yellow tang .

 

[ThePurple12]

I have seen these. They look nothing like the real thing. They are usually pale yellow. It’s kinda like the yellow watchman goby that aren’t wild caught. Those are a yellowish gray

I think they are juvenile colors. Both of my watchman gobies, captive bred, started grayish and are now yellow.

 

[OceanDiver]

I think they are juvenile colors. Both of my watchman gobies, captive bred, started grayish and are now yellow.

That is positive news. I was hesitant to get the captive bred one and wanted for a wild caught

 

[Tamberav]

I have seen these. They look nothing like the real thing. They are usually pale yellow. It’s kinda like the yellow watchman goby that aren’t wild caught. Those are a yellowish gray

They start out transparent and get more yellow over time. I don't believe color is related to captive breeding as long as diet is good.

The same goes for the gobies.

 

[Dana Riddle]

@Dana Riddle you want to add something to this thread.
You probably know more about what is going in there than we do.
Are you still on the advisory board on collection there?

I'm not actively involved with the West Hawaii Fisheries Council any more, although I remain on their mailing list and get regular updates. However, when I was active there, it was my position that any fish being captive-bred on a commercially viable scale should be removed from collection in Hawaii. This idea didn't gain much traction, and the position of the Board was that the fishery was sustainable and any attempt to ban collection for aquaria was tantamount to admitting defeat. IMO, the ban sucks and ignores the science.

 

[hds4216]

I think that pale color is not a problem, it is just because they are small, or poor diet that can be correct with age and possible better care. Deformity is another mater. Similar to a lot of the tank raise fish, like Court Jester goby, Orchid Dottyback and clown fish, these are just poor specimen and there is no cure for them.

Aren't tank raised clowns basically industry standard at this point? I didn't know they suffered from high incidences of deformity.

 

[Potatohead]

Aren't tank raised clowns basically industry standard at this point? I didn't know they suffered from high incidences of deformity.

They do. They just call them designer clowns

 

[BZOFIQ]

I think they are juvenile colors. Both of my watchman gobies, captive bred, started grayish and are now yellow.

I always thought its a sex thing. I once bought two yellow watchmans that lived in the same burrow. Once they grew large one turned gray and I believe they even bred.

 

[ThePurple12]

I always thought its a sex thing. I once bought two yellow watchmans that lived in the same burrow. Once they grew large one turned gray and I believe they even bred.

I've seen pairs with one gray and one yellow, I guess it just depends.

 

[Tampa Reefer]

I have seen these. They look nothing like the real thing. They are usually pale yellow. It’s kinda like the yellow watchman goby that aren’t wild caught. Those are a yellowish gray

Wrong. Only pale when babies. Have both and no difference at all.

 

[Brittanyjo]

Would you guys take someone seriously if they ate dog meat but told you that keeping dogs as family pets is immoral?

OOOO good point. It seems so different, but I will take some time to consider.