Heaters!!

[Kenneth's Tropical Fish]

Hello everyone,
I wanted to ask a question about heaters and how many I need in order to heat 100gal with an atmosphere temperature of -5°F. I was looking at the Aquatop 800 watt heaters and uaing the controller with it....how many heaters would I need to heat the water to roughly mid 60's °F.

 

[DirtDiggler2823]

Hello everyone,
I wanted to ask a question about heaters and how many I need in order to heat 100gal with an atmosphere temperature of -5°F. I was looking at the Aquatop 800 watt heaters and uaing the controller with it....how many heaters would I need to heat the water to roughly mid 60's °F.

So the ambient temperature is -5f?

 

[Kenneth's Tropical Fish]

So the ambient temperature is -5f?

Yes I'd figure I need 1000w worth of heaters

 

[miPapareef]

Yes I'd figure I need 1000w worth of heaters

What’s the insolation you will use between the water and the -5F. We could calculate the heat load and then needed wattage if you knew the R factor.

 

[norfolkgarden]

Either build a building or follow the thread about heating your large tank with your hot water system in the house.

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink?ur...&share_tid=338018&share_fid=1020&share_type=t

Seriously.

Electro resistive heating (your average tank heater) is the most horribly inefficient forms heating you can find.

Space heaters in rooms and Tank heaters are used because unfortunately it's the most practical way to do it all things considered.

This absolutely does not apply to your application.
[emoji50]

 

[Kenneth's Tropical Fish]

What’s the insolation you will use between the water and the -5F. We could calculate the heat load and then needed wattage if you knew the R factor.

Nothing but a clear plastic as the "aquarium cover". I have some Halleri rays and I was experimenting with the idea of a above ground pond liner outside and I needed to know if heaters can keep water warm with worst of winter nights being -5 and average low 10s. Halleri Stingray I know can tolerate a min temp of 54°F so I have some leway

 

[dantimdad]

I this honestly the best thing for the animals?

There comes a point where we have to ask ourselves if, even if we can afford it, is it good for them?

I would say don't do it. That being said, you would almost have to construct some form of green house to even think about getting the temperatures up that much let alone keep them stable.

I don't want to be a wet blanket, but, lately I keep reading these threads where folks are killing many, many animals and just taking the attitude "I will get back on the horse and try again" Instead of stopping whatever it is they are doing and judging themselves. Really look at your situation and judge whether or not you SHOULD be doing it, not IF.

Off my soapbox now.

 

[miPapareef]

Ok brushing up the thermodynamics!

You are in a maintain temp problem. (If you expect to need to heat the water, raise its temp, we need other considerations not include here)

For maintaining temp the need:
kW = (A * 1/R * deltaT * SF)/3412

• A = area of the tank in feet
• R = insulation R-factor = ( material thickness/ material k-factor)
• deltaT = (desired water temp - ambient temp)
• SF is some safety factor like 1.2 times
• The 3412 is just to convert BTU to watts

For each different surface or material we just add up the heat loads
Total kW = kW(liner) + kW(top) + kW(Evap)

 

[Kenneth's Tropical Fish]

I this honestly the best thing for the animals?

There comes a point where we have to ask ourselves if, even if we can afford it, is it good for them?

I would say don't do it. That being said, you would almost have to construct some form of green house to even think about getting the temperatures up that much let alone keep them stable.

I don't want to be a wet blanket, but, lately I keep reading these threads where folks are killing many, many animals and just taking the attitude "I will get back on the horse and try again" Instead of stopping whatever it is they are doing and judging themselves. Really look at your situation and judge whether or not you SHOULD be doing it, not IF.

Off my soapbox now.

Its just an experimental though...I might just have it run with water and monitor and track temps for several months but heaters with a controller should be able to keep temp stable if I have enough wattage to spare. I really wanna use it as a summer outdoor enclosure with sea grass. Id figure if it can withstand winter temps it should be able to handle summer temps.

 

[Kenneth's Tropical Fish]

Ok brushing up the thermodynamics!

You are in a maintain temp problem. (If you expect to need to heat the water, raise its temp, we need other considerations not include here)

For maintaining temp the need:
kW = (A * 1/R * deltaT * SF)/3412

• A = area of the tank in feet
• R = insulation R-factor = ( material thickness/ material k-factor)
• deltaT = (desired water temp - ambient temp)
• SF is some safety factor like 1.2 times
• The 3412 is just to convert BTU to watts

For each different surface or material we just add up the heat loads
Total kW = kW(liner) + kW(top) + kW(Evap)

Okay seeing as I dont know any thermodynamics I was wondering if you could plug some numbers for me. Pond is 60x24x18 all in inches. Raised about 8 in off the ground on cinderbocks. Working on insulation but atm none. Just a clear plastic cover for the top of the pond. Desired water temp ideally 65°F but minimum 58°F. Ambient temp ranges from -5°F to 20°F.

 

[miPapareef]

Ok here goes my attempt at the problem. I’m locked in a airplane over the ocean atm so might as well noodle on something.

Assumptions

• Pond liner and sheet are HDPE with R - factor of 3.33 / inch
• Pond liner is 3/4” thick
• Pond liner area is 31 sqft
• Top is clear film sheet 6 mil thick
• Top is 10 sqft
• deltaT is 70F
• Top is sealed and zero evaporation occurs.

kW(liner) = (31*1/(3.33/.75)*70*1.2)/3412)= 172 watts
kW(top) = (10*1/(3.33/.006)*70*1.2/3412)= 1514 watts

So I think you’d need ~1700 watts to maintain temp.
Obviously the top is the largest heat load and with better insulation you could reduce.

 

[Kenneth's Tropical Fish]

Ok here goes my attempt at the problem. I’m locked in a airplane over the ocean atm so might as well noodle on something.

Assumptions

• Pond liner and sheet are HDPE with R - factor of 3.33 / inch
• Pond liner is 3/4” thick
• Pond liner area is 31 sqft
• Top is clear film sheet 6 mil thick
• Top is 10 sqft
• deltaT is 70F
• Top is sealed and zero evaporation occurs.

kW(liner) = (31*1/(3.33/.75)*70*1.2)/3412)= 172 watts
kW(top) = (10*1/(3.33/.006)*70*1.2/3412)= 1514 watts

So I think you’d need ~1700 watts to maintain temp.
Obviously the top is the largest heat load and with better insulation you could reduce.

[emoji44] now thats science lol. Yea Im gonna look into it but maybe a top cover that is meant for green housing outdoors to maybe better insulate and trap heat