Heating with gas

[AfaceInTheCrowd]

Can anyone point me to a good link or explain how to heating a large aquarium (500) with a gas boiler works?
Or even if it’s a good idea/cheaper than 2000w of aquarium heaters

thanks

 

[radsdad]

Heat Pumps. Better than gas. https://www.aquacal.com/aquariums/#1452783570331-a99ca024-d621

 

[AfaceInTheCrowd]

It may be an option, but I’m in UK so outside temps do get below 50F for fair few months of the year.
I have no idea about how they work, but know people use them on koi ponds here.

Heating this tank really is one of the final hurdles I have to work out..total volume is going to be around 1000+ G, with frag tanks and sump.

 

[radsdad]

Heat pumps generally work well down to 32 deg. F.

 

[Kazumi]

If you already have a boiler, I would think that you would just need to plumb in a water to water heat exchanger along with a temp. controller.

 

[AfaceInTheCrowd]

The problem I have is I have no understanding of how either option really work so it’s difficult to decide..
In UK we have gas boiler heating systems I have also seen koi ponds here heated using these which is what gave me the idea... I was originally going to just heat the room using the radiator as it’s not in the room I would view the tank so wouldn’t matter being 26C in there too much but just exploring all options..
I think with the heat pump the other poster suggested I can also cool the tank but they do have quite an upfront cost..
I’ve tried looking through 500 gallon+ build threads but can’t see anyone using anything but aquarium heaters..

 

[ca1ore]

There are a couple of threads on the topic. Maybe in the DIY section? One of them is mine, so I probably ought to remember where it is LOL. It’s not a trivial undertaking, and adds a lot of potential complexity. My ‘journey’ to do it was ultimately unsuccessful.

 

[AfaceInTheCrowd]

I’ll have a read ..thank you

 

[Blue Spot Octopus]

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/tankless-hot-water-heating.669357/. Check this thread out, great ino.

 

[Ocelaris]

Yeah, you would just need a loop off of your boiler system; it would function as a "zone" essentially, just like you'd have a separate zone for each area of the house and/or domestic hot water system. That's literally what a hot water tank that runs off your boiler does. Assuming your system can handle another zone, you'd just need a thermostat to kick it off. I know that titanium heat exchanges are the way to go, but loops of pex will work if you have enough room in the sump, albeit pex will break down in UV light, so take that into consideration. That's what Than from Tidal Gardens did, albeit on a much larger scale, and I am not 100% sure if it was put in saltwater or just buried. You'd use your controller or some simple on/off switch to turn the zone on, which would pass the 24v AC to your relays on your boiler to kick on the zone.

 

[Crashnt24]

Heat pumps are a very nice way to heat and cool the water to maintain a constant water temp. Being in the UK though, I doubt you need cooling. So the cheapest route would be either a small boiler or a upgraded water heater with a recirculating loop piped to a heat exchanger. If you don't have a boiler already, I recommend using the water heater route, that way you wouldn't need to take up extra space with a boiler if you don't already have one.

 

[AfaceInTheCrowd]

Thank you for the link that detailed it well, at I sort of understn It now.

I follow Than on YT and did see his solution which got me thinking of using gas, albeit not the most elegant solution for a home aquarium..which then led me to the heat exchanger..

Heat pumps does seem a cheap way to “electrically” heat it, the smaller models don’t seem to have the cooling also anyway (3k ish models) but yes you’re right UK only has about 20 days (non consecutive) a year that would require cooling..so in most cases a large fan would do it..for 3 or 4 days a year a portable air conditioner would be useful.

(Can’t get quotes to work on phone :/ )

 

[ca1ore]

Part of the reason that I ultimately decided against a HW loop was the potential to cook the tank. Runaway heating is a very common cause of tank crashes. I've built redundancy into my current heating approach with multiple heaters and dual controllers, but the HW loop would have been much less secure. Since the amount of heat from my HW heaters is essentially infinite, a major failure of the control mechanisms would quickly spiral things out of control. OK, I get that there are folks that have done this without any problems but I just felt the benefits did not sufficiently outweigh the drawbacks. Also, when I converted my system from a 12mm glass tank to a 1 inch acrylic tank, heat wattage required dropped singificantly.

 

[AfaceInTheCrowd]

Ye I think I’m swaying away from it tbf.for the reason you have detailed plus should the exchanger break or whatever fresh water pumping into the tank plus the installation cost etc etc

I think I may insulate the 3 non viewable sides of the tank as frankly it can’t hurt.

im still toying with the heat pump idea but I think ultimately I’ll maintain room at 22C ish and let the heaters do the rest.

I image with that volume of waterit will kinda heat the room itself anyway.

 

[Dr. Dendrostein]

Can anyone point me to a good link or explain how to heating a large aquarium (500) with a gas boiler works?
Or even if it’s a good idea/cheaper than 2000w of aquarium heaters

thanks

My electric bill shows cost of a kilowatt. Then I'm able to determine cost of electricity. Also kil a watt device add to your heater ( if heater already operating). Then you get EXACT usage of your heater to first determine cost of it per month. If your kilo watt per hour less than .10 cent. That cheap....

 

[Crashnt24]

Part of the reason that I ultimately decided against a HW loop was the potential to cook the tank. Runaway heating is a very common cause of tank crashes. I've built redundancy into my current heating approach with multiple heaters and dual controllers, but the HW loop would have been much less secure. Since the amount of heat from my HW heaters is essentially infinite, a major failure of the control mechanisms would quickly spiral things out of control. OK, I get that there are folks that have done this without any problems but I just felt the benefits did not sufficiently outweigh the drawbacks. Also, when I converted my system from a 12mm glass tank to a 1 inch acrylic tank, heat wattage required dropped singificantly.

With a proper double loop, there are at least 3 safteys that need to fail to cause runaway heat. Solonoid valve, primary loop pump and secondary loop pump. All three of these would need to get stuck with power on to fail. A lot safer than in tank heaters IMO. I design and install hydronic heating/cooling for a living and I have never seen all three fail. Even if all three fail, you can have a high limit switch wired to cut out all power requiring a manual reset. Heck you could even be super careful and add 3 more high limit switches

 

[AlexG]

Here is a diagram of the method I used for three years without issues. I will be setting up a similar heating system in my new aquarium system once it is built. Having a redundant temperature controller that will shutoff the power to all of the recirculating pumps on high temp eliminates the possibility of run away heating as long as you are keeping up with equipment maintenance. The failure of a PEX line heat exchanger is low as it is rated for home use. If you don't want the heating coil in the system it can also be put into a separate heat exchanger on its own pump. Compared to electric heaters the risks of failure in much lower and it saves a lot of money on operating costs.

 

[Dr. Dendrostein]

Here is a diagram of the method I used for three years without issues. I will be setting up a similar heating system in my new aquarium system once it is built. Having a redundant temperature controller that will shutoff the power to all of the recirculating pumps on high temp eliminates the possibility of run away heating as long as you are keeping up with equipment maintenance. The failure of a PEX line heat exchanger is low as it is rated for home use. If you don't want the heating coil in the system it can also be put into a separate heat exchanger on its own pump. Compared to electric heaters the risks of failure in much lower and it saves a lot of money on operating costs.

Can you do a tankless water heater. Very efficient.

 

[NP57]

Following

 

[Blue Spot Octopus]

Natural gas is much cheaper than elec. in Ca