Help! Acro mini colony dying overnight.

[Diesel]

Found this. Not sure if it has anything to do with it. Seeing 6-7 of them

Pics are unclear to make a call.
First I thought a stomatella but it has some kind of legs and it’s to big to be FW.







#reefsquad

 

[EW_Fish]

I see a littany of potential issues. No 2 month old tank is stable - none. QT is even harder without much rock or places for bacteria to grow. Hydra alone is not a great light for acropora right out of the ocean - these can be very hard to start with and most people who have great success land them under better lights. Organic Carbon dosing (NoPOX) on a fresh tank is asking for trouble, IMO.

I do not dip wild stuff until it has recovered and started to grow. Sometimes, this can take months... but if it is in a QT, then there is no huge hurry. Bayer is better than CoralRx or Revive and is easier on the corals.

Nass snails need to eat more then brine shrimp. Some mysis or other more nutritious stuff is better, but fresh detritus (not yet broken down) is best. They really need a constant supply of food from an established tank to do well. This is why coral and invert QT can be next to impossible except for on paper since it is so hard to provide snails and inverts a proper home for 80 days without fish or a full ecosystem to support them.

You can frag with stainless bone cutters. There is no need for a Dremmel unless you HAVE to - the rotary blades get hot and the coral will be out of the water for too long. Sometimes you cannot avoid a Dremmel or tile saw, but you should if you can.

As you have found out, birdsnest or LPS (duncan) is not on the same level as acropora. Do not use a birdsnest as a litmus test for acros, but you can use an acro for a litmus for a birdsnest, monti, poci or stylo.

I agree with this.

 

[Crabs McJones]

Picture is to blurry, any chance at a clearer picture? Regardless I dont think its the cause of your issue.

 

[XLOR8T]

Picture is to blurry, any chance at a clearer picture? Regardless I dont think its the cause of your issue.

Trying to find one of my macro lenses.

I’m convinced it’s RTN. Not pest. But curious what it is

Has multiple legs and can move somewhat quickly. Maybe a pod?

 

[XLOR8T]

I agree with this.

Which part?

Red Sea Reef mature starts nopox from beginning and continues. It helps feed nitrifying bacteria as well and improves cycle.

AB+ spectrum is matched to solid growth spectrums as tested by coral lab

Marine pure provides more surface than standard rock.

Age of the tank will always be challenge in QT and I refuse to Gamble with my entire tank when adding new inverts and coral. So if I lose a few corals or inverts in qt I won’t be heart broken when I know I’m protecting the main system.

I just want to know why so I can improve my process. One thing that’s come out is using a milder dip. Something from others experience I will definitely implement.

 

[Diesel]

Maybe you can find a idea in this link,

https://www.lionfishlair.com/hitchhikers-guide/

 

[Diesel]

Which part?

Red Sea Reef mature starts nopox from beginning and continues. It helps feed nitrifying bacteria as well and improves cycle.

AB+ spectrum is matched to solid growth spectrums as tested by coral lab

Marine pure provides more surface than standard rock.

Age of the tank will always be challenge in QT and I refuse to Gamble with my entire tank when adding new inverts and coral. So if I lose a few corals or inverts in qt I won’t be heart broken when I know I’m protecting the main system.

I just want to know why so I can improve my process. One thing that’s come out is using a milder dip. Something from others experience I will definitely implement.

Try Bayer as dip.

 

[Mr.Acro]

The hitchhiker looks like an isopod. Any closer pictures?

 

[XLOR8T]

The hitchhiker looks like an isopod. Any closer pictures?

Best I could get. I have it in a vile.

 

[EW_Fish]

Try Bayer as dip.

I would try using bayer as you can make your own strenght up. Start by doing a light dip and move onto a harsher dip

Best I could get. I have it in a vile.

I have no clue what that could be. Very intresting to know though. Try posting it here and get an ID " https://www.reef2reef.com/forums/hitchhiker-critter-id.895/ "

 

[XLOR8T]

I would try using bayer as you can make your own strenght up. Start by doing a light dip and move onto a harsher dip



I have no clue what that could be. Very intresting to know though. Try posting it here and get an ID " https://www.reef2reef.com/forums/hitchhiker-critter-id.895/ "

Doesn’t look like any of the pics. I’ve been catching them until I know better.

 

[jda]

Dry rock would not be ready for a super-stable tank at 2 months, why would a Maripure block be any different? ...maybe one day, but then you have to assume that all of that surface area is able to be accessed since there is no microfauna to move water in and out. There is more going on in live rock than just surface area, regardless of what the manufacturer tells you. People have also had unknown issues that went away when the removed maripure - some have speculated that there is some metal or toxin in there that is not on an ICP test, but this seems like a stretch to me... but the anecdote seems like it is worth paying attention to. In any case, the Maripure block might be fine an aerobic bacterial production after a while, but I have not seen any actual evidence that it does much for anoxic regions.

Please do not believe that organic carbon dosing is necessary, or even a good idea, in new tanks. Of course the manufacturer tells you this, but is is not any more correct than many of the other false-claims of the manufacturers (SeaClone is a good skimmer, Jeabo is a reliable pump or even that Hydra is as good as a 250w MH). While dosing organic carbon can build some bacteria in the water column and on the surface, it will starve the ones that you truly want to build deeper in the MP block - you are setting the full cycle back. I am talking about the whole cycle - most people forget about the part that turns NO3 into N gas. All that you are doing is setting back this development, or stopping it for the dependency of the organic carbon, and thus, buying more of their product. This does not even touch the fact that it is easy to overdose and have the bacteria outcompete everything else and cause some damage to the acropora.

 

[XLOR8T]

Dry rock would not be ready for a super-stable tank at 2 months, why would a Maripure block be any different? ...maybe one day, but then you have to assume that all of that surface area is able to be accessed since there is no microfauna to move water in and out. There is more going on in live rock than just surface area, regardless of what the manufacturer tells you. People have also had unknown issues that went away when the removed maripure - some have speculated that there is some metal or toxin in there that is not on an ICP test, but this seems like a stretch to me... but the anecdote seems like it is worth paying attention to. In any case, the Maripure block might be fine an aerobic bacterial production after a while, but I have not seen any actual evidence that it does much for anoxic regions.

Please do not believe that organic carbon dosing is necessary, or even a good idea, in new tanks. Of course the manufacturer tells you this, but is is not any more correct than many of the other false-claims of the manufacturers (SeaClone is a good skimmer, Jeabo is a reliable pump or even that Hydra is as good as a 250w MH). While dosing organic carbon can build some bacteria in the water column and on the surface, it will starve the ones that you truly want to build deeper in the MP block - you are setting the full cycle back. I am talking about the whole cycle - most people forget about the part that turns NO3 into N gas. All that you are doing is setting back this development, or stopping it for the dependency of the organic carbon, and thus, buying more of their product. This does not even touch the fact that it is easy to overdose and have the bacteria outcompete everything else and cause some damage to the acropora.

I agree with benefits of live rock. I’m on minimal nopox dose. The block is 3 months old from an older main system. Added to qt to help cycle and stabilize tank. I also gave a Pyrex dish with deep sand isolated to help bacteria but easily removable in case of pest issues.

I will have to wait it out. I removed the two colonies that are in this state. The Frags seem ok for now. But will wait and see over the next few days. Did a 20% WC for good measure.

 

[Diesel]

I agree with benefits of live rock. I’m on minimal nopox dose. The block is 3 months old from an older main system. Added to qt to help cycle and stabilize tank. I also gave a Pyrex dish with deep sand isolated to help bacteria but easily removable in case of pest issues.

I will have to wait it out. I removed the two colonies that are in this state. The Frags seem ok for now. But will wait and see over the next few days. Did a 20% WC for good measure.

You did good to ask advice, it probably wasn’t any difference with a tank full of matured LR and the tank itself been matured through and through.
Let’s see how the frags will do.

 

[EW_Fish]

You did good to ask advice, it probably wasn’t any difference with a tank full of matured LR and the tank itself been matured through and through.
Let’s see how the frags will do.

I think either way trying to bring in wild colonies into a QT that hasnt been set up long with be a difficult task. Rather let them die in a qt then wipe out a main tank is a must.

 

[BluewaterLa]

I've read through all of the post thus far.
some good advise to be had here as well as some folks experience or repeats of what they heard.
Wild colonies are more delicate than what comes from an existing tank by another reefer for a few reasons though I will put my 2 cents in the pot here.

While I agree that a 2 month old tank is not anything I would ever consider stable, A person with lots of time and good equipment, test kits and the will to stay on top of such a tank will make the difference here.
Not on any planet would I use carbon dosing for a young tank.

From what I can see in your pictures is that you have an Acro wild and with really thick growth which more than likely came from a surge zone with Absurd amount of wave action / flow and high in oxygen.
This would be one of the most important things to this colony is high oxygen content and chaotic strong flow more than you would realize to maintain its happy place.
- Second would be your lights, Yes I use LED over my SPS tank though I've had more issues with corals needing to be acclimated to the light depending on how much they were getting where they were before, Wild or cultured does not matter here. LED is not a natural light source and can be really hard on corals to suddenly adapt to and with any wild, cultured coral you do not know its lighting requirements its always best to place them in lower light while they acclimate to your tank parameters then slowly over time move them into more intense light allowing Time for them to color back up.
- I will agree that most dips on the market are harsh on SPS, I've lost more due to dipping with these products than I have with placing corals into sterile tanks with air stones for inspection then turning on power heads and keeping the coral in QT for a week or two carefully looking for pest or signs of pest.
Bayer dip, I've used without loosing a coral though some species I have not attempted this as most times they die once dipped in anything ( in my experience )
- Keeping your dkh at or near NSW levels has been the most important and rewarding aspect to my success with wild grown corals. Out of the two dozen frags and mini colonies I've collected this year only two have died after a few weeks in my tank and they were Not real healthy when I got them so likely the root problem with these two. All the others have maintained coloration, great growth tips and encrusting bases on most. A few that were a bit pale have started to get a rich coloration back and two of the blah colored ones have started to really come into their own, One with blue growth tips and the other going from blah tan to neon green.
My DKH is 7 and due to growth over time will dunk slowly into the 6.7 range then slowly raised back up over a weeks time to the 7 mark.

Fragging the coral or any coral that starts to do this is in order. Saving remaining pieces will work out or it will not, No guarantee here as we all have had it work great or every frag still dies.
After fragging the coral, I would place all the frags in high flow area with less direct lighting to give them a chance to rest / recover.

Yes some corals will die in this manner despite who gets them, what tank they are in Or any other determining factor. Some things are just unknown to us.
I would rather a coral brown out or loose its coloration a bit from lower light levels while it adjust to my tank parameters then chance shocking it with intense LED.
We have no way of knowing if a coral came from deeper water or shallow water.

 

[XLOR8T]

I've read through all of the post thus far.
some good advise to be had here as well as some folks experience or repeats of what they heard.
Wild colonies are more delicate than what comes from an existing tank by another reefer for a few reasons though I will put my 2 cents in the pot here.

While I agree that a 2 month old tank is not anything I would ever consider stable, A person with lots of time and good equipment, test kits and the will to stay on top of such a tank will make the difference here.
Not on any planet would I use carbon dosing for a young tank.

From what I can see in your pictures is that you have an Acro wild and with really thick growth which more than likely came from a surge zone with Absurd amount of wave action / flow and high in oxygen.
This would be one of the most important things to this colony is high oxygen content and chaotic strong flow more than you would realize to maintain its happy place.
- Second would be your lights, Yes I use LED over my SPS tank though I've had more issues with corals needing to be acclimated to the light depending on how much they were getting where they were before, Wild or cultured does not matter here. LED is not a natural light source and can be really hard on corals to suddenly adapt to and with any wild, cultured coral you do not know its lighting requirements its always best to place them in lower light while they acclimate to your tank parameters then slowly over time move them into more intense light allowing Time for them to color back up.
- I will agree that most dips on the market are harsh on SPS, I've lost more due to dipping with these products than I have with placing corals into sterile tanks with air stones for inspection then turning on power heads and keeping the coral in QT for a week or two carefully looking for pest or signs of pest.
Bayer dip, I've used without loosing a coral though some species I have not attempted this as most times they die once dipped in anything ( in my experience )
- Keeping your dkh at or near NSW levels has been the most important and rewarding aspect to my success with wild grown corals. Out of the two dozen frags and mini colonies I've collected this year only two have died after a few weeks in my tank and they were Not real healthy when I got them so likely the root problem with these two. All the others have maintained coloration, great growth tips and encrusting bases on most. A few that were a bit pale have started to get a rich coloration back and two of the blah colored ones have started to really come into their own, One with blue growth tips and the other going from blah tan to neon green.
My DKH is 7 and due to growth over time will dunk slowly into the 6.7 range then slowly raised back up over a weeks time to the 7 mark.

Fragging the coral or any coral that starts to do this is in order. Saving remaining pieces will work out or it will not, No guarantee here as we all have had it work great or every frag still dies.
After fragging the coral, I would place all the frags in high flow area with less direct lighting to give them a chance to rest / recover.

Yes some corals will die in this manner despite who gets them, what tank they are in Or any other determining factor. Some things are just unknown to us.
I would rather a coral brown out or loose its coloration a bit from lower light levels while it adjust to my tank parameters then chance shocking it with intense LED.
We have no way of knowing if a coral came from deeper water or shallow water.

Thank you for taking the time to reply. Some very key advice in here. The 3 colonies that went first were all sold to me as “something to try and see if they color up and come back” I bought them at 1/4 of their usual price. So I think I started the race with a handicap, I did have a fair bit of flow 2500gph random flow in a 40gal tank but nothing is like surge zone of the ocean as you said. Light acclimation was done with starting at bottom and bringing them up to highest level over 2 weeks. I still have my suspicions of chemical warfare as I did a series of daily 20% water changes for 6 days and switched to Red Sea Carbon from the standard carbon cartridge of the hob filter and everyone else made a comeback. Unfortunately the 3 small sps Frags went with the 3 colonies as well as my lobo and wall hammer. They are doing great now and I’ve got a 90 gal plus 30 gal sump that I just started plumbing to serve as the coral/invert qt. Hoping larger water volume will give me more time to react to unfortunate problems such as this. Just haven’t decided if I’m going to transfer the water and marine pure to the new system or run the new one from scratch.

 

[DesertReefT4r]

OP, the first coral you pictured appears to be a maricultured or maybe a wild collected sps. IME and many others have had the same, these are difficult to keep in the reef aquarium. At least at first, if they do well and make it past about the 6-9 month mark with good color and growth then they tend to do well. Its like domesticating, they need to adapt to the captive environment of a reef tank. In the ocean or mariculture system that uses natural sea water righ off the reef and sun light these corals are used to super stability, NSW levels of alk, cal, mag ect, have an unlimited food supply and perfect lighting. The reef tank environment is very different even though we do our best to recreate the natural reef its just not possible. To have the best success with mari and wild corals here is what I recommend and what has worked for others: keep alk,cal and mag at NSW levels, MH lighting is best with a 6500k or 10,000k bulb and LOTS of flow.

 

[XLOR8T]

OP, the first coral you pictured appears to be a maricultured or maybe a wild collected sps. IME and many others have had the same, these are difficult to keep in the reef aquarium. At least at first, if they do well and make it past about the 6-9 month mark with good color and growth then they tend to do well. Its like domesticating, they need to adapt to the captive environment of a reef tank. In the ocean or mariculture system that uses natural sea water righ off the reef and sun light these corals are used to super stability, NSW levels of alk, cal, mag ect, have an unlimited food supply and perfect lighting. The reef tank environment is very different even though we do our best to recreate the natural reef its just not possible. To have the best success with mari and wild corals here is what I recommend and what has worked for others: keep alk,cal and mag at NSW levels, MH lighting is best with a 6500k or 10,000k bulb and LOTS of flow.

Ya I think I’m going to stick to Reef raised Frags moving forward. Best recent piece of advice I got from a fellow reefer with one of the most vivid reefs was: “I wish I had started my early years with small Frags of expensive corals than colonies of cheap corals, because I ended up having to trim/frag or basically give away the cheap colonies to make room for the growing premium Frags. I also watched the melev’s tour of the Rhode Island aquarium and their trick to making colonies was planing multiple small Frags of the same coral close to each other and letting them grow into each other to have. Better footing and grow into a colony faster.

 

[shub]

wild acros are really hard 2 keep thats why I try to only keep aquacultured pieces