Help! GHA/ Cyano , Phosphates and nitrates

Reef_a_holiks

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Hey everyone so im done trying to figure this out my self. For a little over a month now I have been getting some algae. Started with small spots of green hair algae to eventually some red slime. After many days of scrubbing and removing the most I can, along with water changes, and decided to dose chemiclean cyano bacteria is now completely gone and ive done a big dent on the hair algae. Fast forward a week later and no more cyano coming back, but the hair algae seems to be coming back. I scrubbed more off today before I let this get out of control in my tank. So being in this hobby for years now, I know the cause must be phosphates and nitrates. Tested recently to find the results of close to zero phosphates and about 5ppm of nitrates, now this is with a API kit so levels might be higher if tested with a higher end test kit. Now I just cant figure out what caused this, I feed fish every other day, corals twice a week, clean filter socks every 3 days, and bi weekly 15 gallon water changes to my 57 gallon reef. This tank is about 7 months old now, started out amazing, to transform into this. Not sure what the next step should be to helping my tank return to thriving health. Corals dont seemed to stressed, but definitely not thriving like before. Was thinking of running GFO but I keep getting so much mixed opinions about it, that im worried about running it. What do you guys recommend? Help please.
 
I would definitely up the water changes. When I was doing once a week I was just able to manage nitrates in my tank that was very lightly stocked.
 
Hey everyone so im done trying to figure this out my self. For a little over a month now I have been getting some algae. Started with small spots of green hair algae to eventually some red slime. After many days of scrubbing and removing the most I can, along with water changes, and decided to dose chemiclean cyano bacteria is now completely gone and ive done a big dent on the hair algae. Fast forward a week later and no more cyano coming back, but the hair algae seems to be coming back. I scrubbed more off today before I let this get out of control in my tank. So being in this hobby for years now, I know the cause must be phosphates and nitrates. Tested recently to find the results of close to zero phosphates and about 5ppm of nitrates, now this is with a API kit so levels might be higher if tested with a higher end test kit. Now I just cant figure out what caused this, I feed fish every other day, corals twice a week, clean filter socks every 3 days, and bi weekly 15 gallon water changes to my 57 gallon reef. This tank is about 7 months old now, started out amazing, to transform into this. Not sure what the next step should be to helping my tank return to thriving health. Corals dont seemed to stressed, but definitely not thriving like before. Was thinking of running GFO but I keep getting so much mixed opinions about it, that im worried about running it. What do you guys recommend? Help please.

Close to zero phospathe means what with what kit?

Regardless of the reading, intercepting phosphate with GFO before the algae takes it up is generally a good plan for dealing with hair algae.

I also agree that more herbivores of some sort is also a very good plan.

Here's a copy and paste of a recent post of mine on "figuring out" the cause of algae:


If you have excessive green algae, don't waste a lot of effort trying to determine "what" is causing it.

Many folks mistakenly think that a high level of nitrate or phosphate can "cause" algae to grow excessively. Or that high silicate causes diatoms.

These aren't really true in the sense that it is never one thing. All algae must get relatively fixed amounts of several different things to grow: a source of nitrogen (which might be ammonia or nitrate), a source of phosphorus (usually phosphate), iron, silicate (if diatoms are the concern), and some other trace elements (and, of course, light, space, etc.).

If ANY of these is sufficiently low, it can slow or stop the growth of algae, no matter high high the others get.

Also, the levels of these measured with a kit may be low simply BECAUSE the algae is growing fast and taking it up (just as growing macroalgae or using anATS can reduce nutrients).

So testing with a kit is never needed to tell you "what" the cause is, since the cause is always an adequate supply of all of them.

Always think of dealing with algae problems by getting the nutrients before the algae does, no matter what any kit reads for any of these nutrients.

A kit reading might tell you the magnitude of the problem, however, so it may be useful. For example, reducing phosphate from 0.5 ppm is a lot harder than reducing it from 0.1 ppm to levels adequate to slow algae growth. Bear in mind that algae may grow equally well at both phosphate values and getting it a lot lower needs to be the goal. You may see no benefit until it gets down to 0.03 ppm or less, and if there is a lot of algae taking it up, you may need to go below what most kits can accurately detect.

Both nitrate and phosphate can be driven low enough to prevent most algae, although phosphate may be easier since some ways of reducing nitrate may not reduce the natural level of ammonia, which could be enough to supply nitrogen to some types of algae.

There are many ways to reduce nutrients, including phosphate binders (e. g., GFO), growing macroalgae or ATS, denitrators, organic carbon dosing (pellets or soluble versions such as vinegar), skimming, etc.

Discussion of these is certainly beyond this thread, but remember that you can usually attack algae using any of these nutrients they need. The caveat to that statement is that some problems types of algae, such as bryopsis, might require the nutrient levels to be dropped so low to kill it that corals and other organisms we want may begin to suffer. Those pests may require different and possibly more aggressive solutions. Consequently, it can be important to try to identify the type of pest you have before deciding what to do about it.
 
Close to zero phospathe means what with what kit?

Regardless of the reading, intercepting phosphate with GFO before the algae takes it up is generally a good plan for dealing with hair algae.

I also agree that more herbivores of some sort is also a very good plan.

Here's a copy and paste of a recent post of mine on "figuring out" the cause of algae:


If you have excessive green algae, don't waste a lot of effort trying to determine "what" is causing it.

Many folks mistakenly think that a high level of nitrate or phosphate can "cause" algae to grow excessively. Or that high silicate causes diatoms.

These aren't really true in the sense that it is never one thing. All algae must get relatively fixed amounts of several different things to grow: a source of nitrogen (which might be ammonia or nitrate), a source of phosphorus (usually phosphate), iron, silicate (if diatoms are the concern), and some other trace elements (and, of course, light, space, etc.).

If ANY of these is sufficiently low, it can slow or stop the growth of algae, no matter high high the others get.

Also, the levels of these measured with a kit may be low simply BECAUSE the algae is growing fast and taking it up (just as growing macroalgae or using anATS can reduce nutrients).

So testing with a kit is never needed to tell you "what" the cause is, since the cause is always an adequate supply of all of them.

Always think of dealing with algae problems by getting the nutrients before the algae does, no matter what any kit reads for any of these nutrients.

A kit reading might tell you the magnitude of the problem, however, so it may be useful. For example, reducing phosphate from 0.5 ppm is a lot harder than reducing it from 0.1 ppm to levels adequate to slow algae growth. Bear in mind that algae may grow equally well at both phosphate values and getting it a lot lower needs to be the goal. You may see no benefit until it gets down to 0.03 ppm or less, and if there is a lot of algae taking it up, you may need to go below what most kits can accurately detect.

Both nitrate and phosphate can be driven low enough to prevent most algae, although phosphate may be easier since some ways of reducing nitrate may not reduce the natural level of ammonia, which could be enough to supply nitrogen to some types of algae.

There are many ways to reduce nutrients, including phosphate binders (e. g., GFO), growing macroalgae or ATS, denitrators, organic carbon dosing (pellets or soluble versions such as vinegar), skimming, etc.

Discussion of these is certainly beyond this thread, but remember that you can usually attack algae using any of these nutrients they need. The caveat to that statement is that some problems types of algae, such as bryopsis, might require the nutrient levels to be dropped so low to kill it that corals and other organisms we want may begin to suffer. Those pests may require different and possibly more aggressive solutions. Consequently, it can be important to try to identify the type of pest you have before deciding what to do about it.

Im using an API kit for testing, I feel running GFO or Bio pellets are band aids to phosphate and nitrates and its not the cure. I don't like the fact that once you stop running it the phosphates will be back again. Ive never ran neither GFO or bio pellets in any reef aquarium ive owned, but ive never had a problem with phosphate or nitrates either until now, but then again I believe cheato has helped me fix and keep these levels under control, now for some reason I cant get chaeto to grow in my 57 gallon reef. As for a clean up crew, I feel that its pretty good, but maybe not enough, I have about 25 blue legged hermit crabs, 4 mexican snails, 4 trochus snails, and about 3 red leg hermits, I had thrown in 2 sea hares, but havent done much to the hair algae. I prefer to fix this naturally, maybe getting chaeto to grow , but after so many attempts ive given up, im willing to buy a fresh batch and try again before I try GFO.
 
Im using an API kit for testing, I feel running GFO or Bio pellets are band aids to phosphate and nitrates and its not the cure. I don't like the fact that once you stop running it the phosphates will be back again..

But that's exactly the same as with any nitrate or phosphate export method. You simply must export somehow or add into growing tissue in the tank as much as you add, or you end up accumulating it from food. :)
 
But that's exactly the same as with any nitrate or phosphate export method. You simply must export somehow or add into growing tissue in the tank as much as you add, or you end up accumulating it from food. :)

Now thinking about it, yes your right, in order to have it completely cured, it would be the tank running without any nitrate or phosphate export and maintaining zero phosphate and nitrates. Which is near impossible when feeding your livestock. Thanks so much for your inputs Randy, really helpful. I guess im going to go out and get a nice fresh batch of cheato and give it another shot . il also be doing a 20 gallon water change this week.

Oh by any chance could it have to do with running chemiclean, thinking back I think the nitrates might have started after the chemiclean treatment, maybe im wrong. What you think ?
 
If you kill off bacteria such as cyano with an antibiotic (such as in chemiclean), then yes, that will result in a burst of nutrients released to the water.
Got it, all cyano is done and hasnt returned, scraped off almost all hair algae, added about 10 more snails this morning, and a fresh batch of cheato. hopefully the cheato can grab a hold of the nutrients released into the water and continue to beat the nuisance algae to it.
 
little update on this, so the upgraded clean up crew has done an amazing job. I have zero algae in the tank. no more GHA or cyano for a week now. Also the cheato has held up , its still dark green, although it hasnt grown yet. Im still fighting nitrates ranging from 5-10ppm. I did a 15 gallon water change yesterday and water tested for zero nitrates about an hour after the water change, I retested this morning and its back up to 5ppm. Im going to hit it with another 15-20gallon water change wednesday. What you guys think?
 
Water changes are not usually the best approach to nitrate since it takes a big change to drop it, and they will come back over time.

However, if you get it down, perhaps the macroalgae can keep it from rising.

If not, perhaps organic carbon dosing would be a reasonable plan. :)
 
Water changes are not usually the best approach to nitrate since it takes a big change to drop it, and they will come back over time.

However, if you get it down, perhaps the macroalgae can keep it from rising.

If not, perhaps organic carbon dosing would be a reasonable plan. :)

Imma do one more big water change wednesday, and go from there. What is good organic carbon I could use? and how is that ran?

Oh btw on another thread about 2 part dosing, you recommended to me ESV over my c balance, I purchase the ESV bionic, and wow the ESV has really made a difference , corals colors popped more and im starting to grow coraline which i havent grown before in this tank for some reason. Thank you!
 

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