Help! How to deal with dinoflagellates.

[lelandmarine]

So I have a relatively new tank, 75 gallons with some LPS and SPS corals, a cleanup crew plus a few tangs. I started getting a dinoflagellate outbreak in the past three or four days. I’ve read a lot in the last few days about various treatments for dinoflagellates. In particular the elegant coral method to get rid of cyano and dino outbreaks as well as others. My nitrate and phosphate are zero and so I know that’s probably a contributing factor. The question that I have is do I feed more to get the nitrate and phosphate up or do I use something like the elegant coral method (or similar approach) which appears to involve carbon dosing. I don’t see the point of carbon dosing if my nitrate and phosphate are already zero. Would it be best just to dose Nitrate and Phosphate to elevate those specific parameters and not feed or follow the elegant coral method. Thanks very much for your input and advice

 

[homer1475]

Start here with an ID, then you can figure out your plan of action.

Dinoflagellates – Are You Tired Of Battling Altogether?

They can multiply quickly asexually. Ostreopsis can really get going quick as they are the most poisonous easily creating enough food to support rapid cell division. Folks often say "I already have a UV running in-line and it is not working!" That is because the return pump runs them through so...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[Willbiker]

Hi. Your zero nutrients are the cause along with a tank which isn't matured. I'm battling dinos and I am winning. Ive tried everything and here is what Is working for me.

1) If the dino looks like it is better in the morning and then gets worse during the day, install a UV with a 2 or 3 tank turnover per hour.

2) Raise nutrients to 10ppm nitrate and 0.1 to 0.18 phosphate. This is the most important method of attack. You can do this by dosing nitrate and phosphate solutions or try by feeding lots and remove your skimmer cup until elevated.

3) don't do any water changes

4) turn off white lights and stick with just blues.

5) Dose a bacteria product such as microbacter7.

6) Run carbon and replace regularly as some dino release toxins when dying.

This battle takes a long time to overcome and the only way it will be properly controlled is by the tank maturing fully. At the very minimum control nutrients and just wait it out.

 

[lelandmarine]

Hi. Your zero nutrients are the cause along with a tank which isn't matured. I'm battling dinos and I am winning. Ive tried everything and here is what Is working for me.

1) If the dino looks like it is better in the morning and then gets worse during the day, install a UV with a 2 or 3 tank turnover per hour.

2) Raise nutrients to 10ppm nitrate and 0.1 to 0.18 phosphate. This is the most important method of attack. You can do this by dosing nitrate and phosphate solutions or try by feeding lots and remove your skimmer cup until elevated.

3) don't do any water changes

4) turn off white lights and stick with just blues.

5) Dose a bacteria product such as microbacter7.

6) Run carbon and replace regularly as some dino release toxins when dying.

This battle takes a long time to overcome and the only way it will be properly controlled is by the tank maturing fully. At the very minimum control nutrients and just wait it out.

Thanks, summary is very helpful. Any thoughts on increasing temperature

 

[Willbiker]

I have raised my temp to 80 degrees f and have been sitting at that for 1 month now. I don't think it has done anything. I believe my a UV, Raised nutrients and bacteria dosing to be the reason for my dino reduction.

 

[Willbiker]

If you can, buy a cheap kids microscope and post a picture or video of the dino up close on here. Once you can identify the type of dino, you can pick the best course of action. However the points I raised above are a perfect starting point and worth implementing immediately.

 

[Reefer1978]

What's the elegant coral method you are referring to?

 

[lelandmarine]

What's the elegant coral method you are referring to?

Just one of the many methods from the internet

 

[lelandmarine]

Working on getting a scope

 

[Gaby_scan]

Do you have sand in your tank? Me and someone else i know just came of a battle and we beat dinos, in my case i had to tear apart the system do a good cleaning and eliminate the sand so now i am bare bottom. After i started the system the dinos were gone. The other person i know raise his nutrients, his temperature and also took out all his sand from the tank but he did not tear down his system, after a while dinos kept dissapearing until they were gone. Hope this helps.

 

[Reefer1978]

Just one of the many methods from the internet

Ohh this old thing. Yep this didn't work for me back in the day.

 

[lelandmarine]

There‘s so much info, hard to know where to start and what to believe, getting a better idea since reading so much. Trying slightly higher temp as well as UV. tank is bare bottom with some caribsea special grade in sump just for extra surface rea

 

[Willbiker]

Do you have sand in your tank? Me and someone else i know just came of a battle and we beat dinos, in my case i had to tear apart the system do a good cleaning and eliminate the sand so now i am bare bottom. After i started the system the dinos were gone. The other person i know raise his nutrients, his temperature and also took out all his sand from the tank but he did not tear down his system, after a while dinos kept dissapearing until they were gone. Hope this helps.

I think I'm going to do this. Although I'm slowly overcoming the dino...what's left is on the sand bed and ive recently added new wave makers causing a sand storm. I need heavier sand so I may do this. I am concerned about removing the biology too fast. How long did you take to remove the sand? What % per week?

 

[Reefer1978]

There‘s so much info, hard to know where to start and what to believe, getting a better idea since reading so much. Trying slightly higher temp as well as UV. tank is bare bottom with some caribsea special grade in sump just for extra surface rea

Higher temps also don't work to be honest. Go with identification first with a microscope. Meanwhile raise your nutrients, it won't harm anything and is good for the coral.

 

[Willbiker]

There‘s so much info, hard to know where to start and what to believe, getting a better idea since reading so much. Trying slightly higher temp as well as UV. tank is bare bottom with some caribsea special grade in sump just for extra surface rea

Go for nutrient increase and UV as a starting point. These are a must for the battle

 

[Jib]

I had a Dino issue that I believe was caused by my nutrient levels being at zero. Here was my strategy.

• Turned off white lights, decreased intensity of blue / UV lights
• Dosed NeoNitro / NeoPhos to get my nutrient levels up
• Dosed 1ml per 10g of hydrogen peroxide at night
• Dosed 1ml per 10g of MIcroBacter 7 each morning.

This regimen cleared up my issue in about 2 weeks.

 

[lelandmarine]

I wonder if anyone has put a small light at the intake of their UV filter so that at night time the dinoflagellates would be attracted to the light and get sucked up into the filter faster?

 

[jda]

Biodiversity, UV will get to them directly. A pack of real ocean live rock will do this, but it takes a while for the fauna to spread and populate the whole tank.

By adding Nitrate, you poison them. This works, but can have other unintended consequences down the road depending on a lot of factors including what you might want to keep. This also is not always permanent since anoxic bacteria in your sump, sand or rocks can turn the nitrate into nitrogen gas. Sometimes this works as a temp type of deal until your tank gets more diverse.

FWIW - I have a very mature tank of over two decades (moved once, so not undisturbed) with massive amounts of biodiversity and I will get small patches every once in a while. The go as fast as the come and I do nothing, but just know that there is no way to be free of them forever. Same with cyano where I might see a few patches every once in a while and then they are gone all of a sudden.

 

[Gaby_scan]

I think I'm going to do this. Although I'm slowly overcoming the dino...what's left is on the sand bed and ive recently added new wave makers causing a sand storm. I need heavier sand so I may do this. I am concerned about removing the biology too fast. How long did you take to remove the sand? What % per week?

Well on my case cause i had a red sea max nano i just took it all at once, clean everything and let it dry for a while, then after everything was dry i put my rocks in and everything else with no problems. The other person i know took out a portion of the sand at first then he noticed the majority of his dinos was only on the sandbed so he decided to take it all. After the sand was gone the tank cleared in less than a week, his system is about a 90gallon. He took all the sand in a period of only one week. I could have done the same but because i had a nano for me it was just easier to restart and go bare bottom. Good luck and don't give up, it took trial and error for a while but at the end it was worth it. Now i dose neophos and neonitro to keep ky nutrients in balance.

 

[lelandmarine]

Biodiversity, UV will get to them directly. A pack of real ocean live rock will do this, but it takes a while for the fauna to spread and populate the whole tank.

By adding Nitrate, you poison them. This works, but can have other unintended consequences down the road depending on a lot of factors including what you might want to keep. This also is not always permanent since anoxic bacteria in your sump, sand or rocks can turn the nitrate into nitrogen gas. Sometimes this works as a temp type of deal until your tank gets more diverse.

FWIW - I have a very mature tank of over two decades (moved once, so not undisturbed) with massive amounts of biodiversity and I will get small patches every once in a while. The go as fast as the come and I do nothing, but just know that there is no way to be free of them forever. Same with cyano where I might see a few patches every once in a while and then they are gone all of a sudden.

Jda, Since all organisms need some level of nitrate in order to survive tell me what you mean by poisoning them with Nitrate?