Help shark not doing well

Thomashtom · Dec 16, 2017

Hi shark not doing well nitrates are high did large water change not realizing R/O filter is putting out water that has 40/50 nitrates so I was wondering can I use prime with CP? I am on 21 st day of treatment . Thanks

saltyfilmfolks · Dec 16, 2017

No don't do anything.
Nitrates are not the problemb.

Stand by.

#reefsquad @Humblefish

How are the shark guys?

saltyhog · Dec 16, 2017

Have you checked ammonia?

Flippers4pups · Dec 16, 2017

Thomashtom said:
Hi shark not doing well nitrates are high did large water change not realizing R/O filter is putting out water that has 40/50 nitrates so I was wondering can I use prime with CP? I am on 21 st day of treatment . Thanks

Tell us what type of shark and what size tank.

Crabs McJones · Dec 16, 2017

Oh boy, I know nothing about sharks, other than you're going to need a bigger boat..

Thomashtom · Dec 16, 2017

440 gallon tank with an epaulette shark ammonia test does not work with CP. ammonia badge not showing anything. Heard prime might help till I replace filter cartridges. Thanks

saltyhog · Dec 17, 2017

Didn't know that about the ammonia test. The API ammonia test has seemed to work fine for me in my QT with CP in it. Hope the shark improves!

sundog101 · Dec 17, 2017

Can you describe “not doing well”?

Thomashtom · Dec 17, 2017

Sorry scratching, uncomfortable. Swimming constantly, did not eat last night only 2nd time in 5 years. I don't think the ammonia badge worked because I used prime and the fish are doing better but the shark is still not right. I don't understand I changed all cartridges on the R/O 3 about months ago and it's already producing water with nitrates in it . Any suggestions? How often can I use prime until I can replace filters again?!!!! Thank you

Maritimer · Dec 17, 2017

"Nitrates are high..." - How high is "high"? A number would help, but generally marine fish aren't affected by nitrates until they're really stratospheric.

I _think_ Prime ought to be OK with CP - it's well known to convert copper to a more toxic form, but I don't know that it has any such effect with CP. Take that with a grain of Reef Crystals though, as I've never worked with CP.

Sharks often develop goiter, IIRC, and need some level of iodine supplementation in captive environments - but beyond that, I don't know much about their special needs.

~Bruce

sundog101 · Dec 17, 2017

Thomashtom said:
Sorry scratching, uncomfortable. Swimming constantly, did not eat last night only 2nd time in 5 years. I don't think the ammonia badge worked because I used prime and the fish are doing better but the shark is still not right. I don't understand I changed all cartridges on the R/O 3 about months ago and it's already producing water with nitrates in it . Any suggestions? How often can I use prime until I can replace filters again?!!!! Thank you

How long have you had the CP treatment going? Did this start right after?

Thomashtom · Dec 17, 2017

19 days after I started CP which was 3 days ago . I noticed him scratching but acting pretty normal than he got worse. I am starting to think I may of got some ammonia in the water that either the ammonia badge did not show or I could not read. With the combination of water changes with R/O water that has 40 nitrates which I guess helped a little, a bottle of Dr tims bacteria and a dose of prime hopefully bought me some time to replace cartridges on R/O. How often can you use prime? Need time to fix filter and make 80 gallons of water Thanks for your help

Dom · Dec 17, 2017

Thomashtom said:
Sorry scratching, uncomfortable. Swimming constantly, did not eat last night only 2nd time in 5 years. I don't think the ammonia badge worked because I used prime and the fish are doing better but the shark is still not right. I don't understand I changed all cartridges on the R/O 3 about months ago and it's already producing water with nitrates in it . Any suggestions? How often can I use prime until I can replace filters again?!!!! Thank you

I've never heard of RO/DI system producing water with nitrates in it. Over time, as the membrane wears, you with get increasing TDS readings. That isn't to say it can't be, just saying I never heard of it.

Myk · Dec 28, 2017

The CP can def. weaken your biofiltration. Also, have you checked for stray voltage in the tank?

S-t-r-e-t-c-h · Dec 28, 2017

Just noticed the OP date after I'd typed this out, but posting anyway...

By CP, are we talking about a copper based medication? If so, it's generally a bad idea to use copper with sharks & rays. Epaulette sharks can handle for a couple of weeks, but tend to degrade if much longer than that. The copper interferes with their electrosensory organs, so the lack of feeding response is fairly typical.

Can I ask, why were you dosing copper? Sharks are not typically susceptible to diseases that you'd usually treat with copper anyway.

I'd be looking to get the copper out of the water as soon as possible, IMO...

chipmunkofdoom2 · Dec 28, 2017

Thomashtom said:
Sorry scratching, uncomfortable. Swimming constantly, did not eat last night only 2nd time in 5 years. I don't think the ammonia badge worked because I used prime and the fish are doing better but the shark is still not right. I don't understand I changed all cartridges on the R/O 3 about months ago and it's already producing water with nitrates in it . Any suggestions? How often can I use prime until I can replace filters again?!!!! Thank you

There is something very wrong with you water filter. A functioning reverse osmosis membrane should reject 90% of nitrates, and a DI resin should clean up the rest (although I'm guessing you don't have a DI stage, because that would clean up almost all of the nitrates that got past the RO membrane). The only way 50ppm nitrate in the product water makes sense is if the water coming out of your tap has 500ppm nitrates. Which is very unlikely. It's much more likely that your membrane has gone bad.

I would start by making sure you RO/DI system is working properly before changing any more water. First, make sure you have decent water pressure. You need at least 40-45 PSI to get decent rejection rates. Second, you should be replacing the prefilters (carbon blocks, sediment filters, etc) every 6 months on a schedule. The only way around this is to monitor chlorine/chloramine breakthrough and water pressure to make sure the filters aren't clogged. Third, replace the RO membrane when the TDS out of the membrane reach 5% - 10% of your tap water. So if the water comes out of your tap at 500ppm TDS and the water coming out of your RO membrane is greater than 40-50ppm TDS, it's time to change the membrane. Lastly, if you're going to use a DI stage, replace the resin when the TDS of the product water reads above zero.

After you know you have clean water, you can make changes with confidence. As of right now, you don't really know what's going into your tank. I would stop making water changes until you know what's in the water.

bluedevils6653 · Dec 28, 2017

S-t-r-e-t-c-h said:
Just noticed the OP date after I'd typed this out, but posting anyway...

By CP, are we talking about a copper based medication? If so, it's generally a bad idea to use copper with sharks & rays. Epaulette sharks can handle for a couple of weeks, but tend to degrade if much longer than that. The copper interferes with their electrosensory organs, so the lack of feeding response is fairly typical.

Can I ask, why were you dosing copper? Sharks are not typically susceptible to diseases that you'd usually treat with copper anyway.

I'd be looking to get the copper out of the water as soon as possible, IMO...

Completely agree with the above post. Copper is never a good idea to use with sharks/rays. I would get that copper out of the water asap.