Well its 9am on 1/1/2020 and so far all 3 fish left seem to be breathing better. I wont know for sure for a few hours though as my tankblikes routine and it's too early for the lights to be on. I will run to my lfs and get some bacteria to put back in the tank and wait. Thank you guys for all your help!!
Help! Tank crashing!!
- Thread starter Mena
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I dont have any grape cauldron. Just corals. You may be seeing some of the algea that I haven't removed yet, which is going to drive me batty. I have to keep telling myself not to clean anymore right now.
Yep, tank crashed. So much life gone. I have a percula clown, a humu trigger and a shrimp gobi left. All the invertebrates survived. I reseeded the tank and left it alone per advice, just doing water top offs. When do I do a water change? If you have read the posts you will see this helped my tank crash. Too much cleaning too fast.... but I haven't touched it in a week and the algea is starting back with a vengeance. More advice on bringing my tank back to normal is definitely appreciated! Thanks in advance
Your description of living animals still, fish, doesn’t indicate a crash are they all dead or alive
It sounds like disease killed fish that weren’t prepped for disease? A crash kills everything
It sounds like disease killed fish that weren’t prepped for disease? A crash kills everything
Oh it took all my corals as well. They kinda melted. And it was within 24 hrs that the fish died. The only reason two of the fish are alive is because I was able to get them into a tiny coral tank that was separate. I did have to put them back in the md tank after a couple days. They didn't actually fit in the little one. And the little gobi stayed under the one rock I didnt take out. I think. I have no clue why this happened, other than the new filtration and the cleaning.
We have threads that focus on cleaning running four years with no loss, that only means if you want to clean a system there’s a documented way that works as a reference. It means there are some ways to clean systems and adjust filters that never fail, any customization to the method sure can though.
It’s hard to know which method to choose for your tank among fifty options agreed. The biggest takeaway for your thread is next time there’s trouble don’t choose an action set from many offers, partial blends of more than one idea. It’s better to choose one tuner, give them two months where you make no judgement calls, then change tuners if they don’t produce results where you ran only one tank tuners method
I’m going to do a write up soon on that neat option for tank rescue work threads, the complete remote pilot for 2 mos vs random selections way of isolating what works for tank tuning. What other way could we make sense of options when so many are offered, some totally opposite recommends / hard to know which aspects to choose. You never had free ammonia in this tank that’s for sure, they’d never made it past the first day, all fish all at once. Post updated tank shot. You slow extended loss cycle was from something other than ammonia, any fish that skipped quarantine and died in the system can easily stress it all that’s for sure, hard to pinpoint causative off current post details.
It’s hard to know which method to choose for your tank among fifty options agreed. The biggest takeaway for your thread is next time there’s trouble don’t choose an action set from many offers, partial blends of more than one idea. It’s better to choose one tuner, give them two months where you make no judgement calls, then change tuners if they don’t produce results where you ran only one tank tuners method
I’m going to do a write up soon on that neat option for tank rescue work threads, the complete remote pilot for 2 mos vs random selections way of isolating what works for tank tuning. What other way could we make sense of options when so many are offered, some totally opposite recommends / hard to know which aspects to choose. You never had free ammonia in this tank that’s for sure, they’d never made it past the first day, all fish all at once. Post updated tank shot. You slow extended loss cycle was from something other than ammonia, any fish that skipped quarantine and died in the system can easily stress it all that’s for sure, hard to pinpoint causative off current post details.
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Here is a couple shots. And now it seems my snails are dying. Could be old because I have had them for over a year and they were big when I got them but.... water parameters are finally stabilizing.
Salt 1.025
Ph - 7.8
Ammonia- .25
NO2- 2.0
NO3- 10
Ca2+ - 440
DkH -107.4
PO43- - .10
you still have really good rock and sand...it would be neat to power clean up the whole tank, keep the rocks ready for use/not kill their bac/ and restart the system. can u get/make a bunch of new water? I don't usually buy into contamination guesses but we're close here, that's quite a bit of spread-out losses for sure.
its rare/unusual to see a loss cascade that extends out over several days/couple weeks, a true crash is cloudy water and near total loss, fast.
Im not versed enough in fish disease/prevention stuff to know how to prevent a recurrence before you restock up with new fish, that's worth inspection for sure before continuing on/restocking (to make sure round 2 is following today's best protocols for fish disease prep, fallow etc might be required)
after that assessment we'd have to rule out any type of contamination, copper contam somehow getting over into the main tank, any sourcewater issues/mixing stations...all that needs to be verified not causing problems before a smooth reboot in my opinion.
a 10-20% water change wont help anything if we're dealing with those type issues so am really hesitant to offer partial works on this large tank, it seems like we'll just set it all back up and repeat somehow/want to prevent that headache.
*Im big into pre modeling actions now in reefing vs guessing...so much of what we do is guess, cross fingers, see if something lives. so if I was to pre model something in order to give your big tank a chance on reboot #2 it'd be this:
set up a nano model using its parts.
still keep your main tank running, we're only using a few parts to model in a smaller setup/bucket/something cheap etc.
this eliminates issues of contamination as a nano will kill things fast when under stress, if a smaller easily controlled nano reef stays alive using your current water preps etc/materials from the tank in question then we've removed some guesses by pre modeling. you don't have to downsize forever, downsize until you feel your rocks and sand are safe, then begin again after fish protocols are checked off. the way you'd pre model it is to keep the current large tank running with topoffs etc, no big changes.
take out a section of rock and scrape off all the algae with a knife like its a dental visit and you're cleaning out reef teeth using picking motions like they do on our actual plaque. be detailed, pick out algae, rinse in saltwater, clean off a large section of rock ready for use in the nano and put it in the test bed with all new mixed water. leave the stuff in your current tank/clowns and snails.
go get a handful of snails and crabs, new, from fish store and put them in nano along with your rock. simply top it off, hardly feed it so you wont overdrive it, and see if they're alive in ten days or so. if they die fast (no reason to) then there's some contam issue we haven't seen yet.
of course this is lots of extra steps, but testing things in your own tank wont highlight anything we can see. prepping the side test and using animals in all new water, from lfs, isolates just your water prep and rock as actors in the test. its ideal and cheap.
if they live fine, showing your rock to be no problem and water mix to be no problem, then we can move on to prepping your big tank for a nice reboot, which is basically all new water, new sand and the same rocks.
we'll know your animals wont die because they didn't die in a nano.
Ive read in some places that copper treatment absorbs into tank glass...has that display tank ever been treated for fish disease directly
Im not versed enough in fish disease/prevention stuff to know how to prevent a recurrence before you restock up with new fish, that's worth inspection for sure before continuing on/restocking (to make sure round 2 is following today's best protocols for fish disease prep, fallow etc might be required)
after that assessment we'd have to rule out any type of contamination, copper contam somehow getting over into the main tank, any sourcewater issues/mixing stations...all that needs to be verified not causing problems before a smooth reboot in my opinion.
a 10-20% water change wont help anything if we're dealing with those type issues so am really hesitant to offer partial works on this large tank, it seems like we'll just set it all back up and repeat somehow/want to prevent that headache.
*Im big into pre modeling actions now in reefing vs guessing...so much of what we do is guess, cross fingers, see if something lives. so if I was to pre model something in order to give your big tank a chance on reboot #2 it'd be this:
set up a nano model using its parts.
still keep your main tank running, we're only using a few parts to model in a smaller setup/bucket/something cheap etc.
this eliminates issues of contamination as a nano will kill things fast when under stress, if a smaller easily controlled nano reef stays alive using your current water preps etc/materials from the tank in question then we've removed some guesses by pre modeling. you don't have to downsize forever, downsize until you feel your rocks and sand are safe, then begin again after fish protocols are checked off. the way you'd pre model it is to keep the current large tank running with topoffs etc, no big changes.
take out a section of rock and scrape off all the algae with a knife like its a dental visit and you're cleaning out reef teeth using picking motions like they do on our actual plaque. be detailed, pick out algae, rinse in saltwater, clean off a large section of rock ready for use in the nano and put it in the test bed with all new mixed water. leave the stuff in your current tank/clowns and snails.
go get a handful of snails and crabs, new, from fish store and put them in nano along with your rock. simply top it off, hardly feed it so you wont overdrive it, and see if they're alive in ten days or so. if they die fast (no reason to) then there's some contam issue we haven't seen yet.
of course this is lots of extra steps, but testing things in your own tank wont highlight anything we can see. prepping the side test and using animals in all new water, from lfs, isolates just your water prep and rock as actors in the test. its ideal and cheap.
if they live fine, showing your rock to be no problem and water mix to be no problem, then we can move on to prepping your big tank for a nice reboot, which is basically all new water, new sand and the same rocks.
we'll know your animals wont die because they didn't die in a nano.
Ive read in some places that copper treatment absorbs into tank glass...has that display tank ever been treated for fish disease directly
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No, this tank has never been treated. I did have a 40g that I treated once for ich, though I used a copper free medicine. The rock from that 40g was transferred to the bigger 55g when I swapped tanks. I have always had invertebrates so I cant use copper medicine.
when the testing is complete if that method is selected, and the main tank is all rinsed sand, clean-picked rocks and all new water, I would not add any new fish above the clowns if they make it.
that new system needs to be a couple cheap corals and a clean up crew to watch for a couple weeks, then begin adding fish via protocols selected (might take 76 days vs two weeks/fallow etc)
I think this is the best way to fix your main tank in increments, to reduce guessing, we still don't know the loss cause here above its very atypical. Hard to rule out fish disease/no qt fallow though
my method of tank fixing is never partial actions/10% changes etc, its full complete tank work after modeling. best way I currently know to keep dollars invested safe
that new system needs to be a couple cheap corals and a clean up crew to watch for a couple weeks, then begin adding fish via protocols selected (might take 76 days vs two weeks/fallow etc)
I think this is the best way to fix your main tank in increments, to reduce guessing, we still don't know the loss cause here above its very atypical. Hard to rule out fish disease/no qt fallow though
my method of tank fixing is never partial actions/10% changes etc, its full complete tank work after modeling. best way I currently know to keep dollars invested safe
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scottedontknow
Well-Known Member
Only if you over dose (I always use about half)
BeejReef
2500 Club Member
Best of luck. I'm far from an expert, but you have a lot of fish for a tank that size. There might not be a huge safety margin when the system is disturbed by major maintenance or filter changes. Not saying your system can't handle what you have, bc, clearly it has been. Just think you might be walking a tightrope. When any one thing goes wrong, the hammer is really close to falling.
Hijinks_78
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I’d get an icp test personally. I’m really sorry for your losses. With all that rock and sand I’m amazed that you didn’t have enough bacteria to not lose almost all of your fish. Just feels like something else to me. And I see why people said do nothing, but it sounds like you had a lot of fish dying over a prolonged time with no reason to think things were getting better. Doing nothing is hard when there is that much death.
