Help with Stocking.

zchauvin · Jun 24, 2019

Hey guys, so I’m super pumped because I close on home Friday. The house has me minutely excited, the fact that wife has agreed to a larger tank is what I’m really stoked about.

Ever since agreeing on and being under contract for home I have been getting multiple quotes for multiple different sized tanks. I ended up finding a acrylic 48 x 30 x 36. Personally I wanted something 72-84 x 30 x 30 or in that range. While this tank is shorter, it does have the depth and height I wanted, has lids, and is selling at a discount as when made the overflow was put in wrong place per customer. If I went with this tank, I would make it a FO tank as my wife and I both love the larger angels and butterflies. If the tank were the other said dimensions it would’ve been reef with mainly tangs for larger fish.

Now that you have the rundown, my question is with the tank only being 48” - what would my stocking options be in terms of angels and butterflies. I know fish like powder blue, Achilles ect take more length due to swimming habits but I do not have a ton of knowledge with angels and butterflies, the biggest fish I would want for this tank would be a emperor angel.

BestMomEver · Jun 24, 2019

I would say I zebrasoma tang and maybe a small bristletooth like a Tomini if you want my opinion on tangs... ;Hilarious;Hilarious

As for angels and butterflies, I’m clueless!

LobsterOfJustice · Jun 24, 2019

Save yourself the headache and just get the bigger tank you actually want. 48” will not let you keep large angels.

DylanE · Jun 24, 2019

LobsterOfJustice said:
Save yourself the headache and just get the bigger tank you actually want. 48” will not let you keep large angels.

Agreed. You just bought a house, might as well get the tank you really want to go with it (also congrats on the close)! Get the 6 foot tank and do the reef you want. You could still try some of the large reef safe-ish angels (like a regal) and a butterfly like a copperband. But this way you know you won’t get bored and start looking to upgrade next year.

zchauvin · Jun 24, 2019

Thanks, if I did a reef it would be to replicate Hedgedrews 180g butterfly / angel tank. I like fish more so than coral.

This 48” tank is less than 50% the cost of the 72x36x36 I was quoted hence the consideration.

Also the wait time for tank delivery was a concern though not a deal breaker.

Pbh-reef · Jun 24, 2019

That’s an interesting tank size - a bit more than 200 gallons but 48” long. I have some guesses of what angels could work - my basic sense is you can stick with angels that get 1' long or smaller - such as the ones here:
https://www.liveaquaria.com/categor...?c=18&r=3131&s=ts&start=1&page_num=1&count=24

examples include: gold flake and flagfin, rock beauty, regal, bellus, lamark's, personifier, scribbled, blue line, blue girdled. The asfur is in my opinion pushing it. Basically stay away from most holocanthus (except rock beauty) and pomacanthus (except blue girdled) and stick to the smaller genera of the larger angelfish. That said I'd love for @eatbreakfast, @4FordFamily and/or @ca1ore who all have a lot more experience than I do with bigger angels to comment.

For butterflies there are a lot of options that could work.

also - congrats on the new house and soon to be tank!

zchauvin · Jun 24, 2019

Pbh-reef said:
That’s an interesting tank size - a bit more than 200 gallons but 48” long. I have some guesses of what angels could work - my basic sense is you can stick with angels that get 1' long or smaller - such as the ones here:
https://www.liveaquaria.com/categor...?c=18&r=3131&s=ts&start=1&page_num=1&count=24

examples include: gold flake and flagfin, rock beauty, regal, bellus, lamark's, personifier, scribbled, blue line, blue girdled. The asfur is in my opinion pushing it. Basically stay away from most holocanthus (except rock beauty) and pomacanthus (except blue girdled) and stick to the smaller genera of the larger angelfish. That said I'd love for @eatbreakfast, @4FordFamily and/or @ca1ore who all have a lot more experience than I do with bigger angels to comment.

Most fish I had in mind stay less than 1’ in length minus the emperor. I do not know the relation of swimming pattern, but would guess a 8” angel will be less active than a 4” powder blue who requires lots of swimming space.

4FordFamily · Jun 24, 2019

Pbh-reef said:
That’s an interesting tank size - a bit more than 200 gallons but 48” long. I have some guesses of what angels could work - my basic sense is you can stick with angels that get 1' long or smaller - such as the ones here:
https://www.liveaquaria.com/categor...?c=18&r=3131&s=ts&start=1&page_num=1&count=24

examples include: gold flake and flagfin, rock beauty, regal, bellus, lamark's, personifier, scribbled, blue line, blue girdled. The asfur is in my opinion pushing it. Basically stay away from most holocanthus (except rock beauty) and pomacanthus (except blue girdled) and stick to the smaller genera of the larger angelfish. That said I'd love for @eatbreakfast, @4FordFamily and/or @ca1ore who all have a lot more experience than I do with bigger angels to comment.

This is good advice, blueline stress very easily and I imagine without at least 6 foot they’d stress.

Personally, I wouldn’t add large angels to a tank smaller than 6 feet except perhaps majestic, rock beauty, and other smaller angels. Regal might be pushing it — they aren’t particularly active but they do stress easily.

I’ve never kept large angels in a tank fewer than 180 gallons, except for a juvenile emperor in a 90 for a year.

Pbh-reef · Jun 24, 2019

zchauvin said:
Most fish I had in mind stay less than 1’ in length minus the emperor. I do not know the relation of swimming pattern, but would guess a 8” angel will be less active than a 4” powder blue who requires lots of swimming space.

I think you're right about swimming patterns. I would think an emperor will eventually be too big. @4FordFamily you reminded me that I've seen a blue line in an a LFS display tank and it seemed to swim more in the open than most other angels, vs sticking to the rock work, so probably would be less happy in a shorter tank.

If I had a 48" FO tank and wanted larger angels I might do the majestic (blue girdled), and/or goldflake and/or a regal.

zchauvin · Jun 24, 2019

Pbh-reef said:
I think you're right about swimming patterns. I would think an emperor will eventually be too big. @4FordFamily you reminded me that I've seen a blue line in an a LFS display tank and it seemed to swim more in the open than most other angels, vs sticking to the rock work, so probably would be less happy in a shorter tank.

If I had a 48" FO tank and wanted larger angels I might do the majestic (blue girdled), and/or goldflake and/or a regal.

My ideas were Goldflake, bandit, conspicuous, blue cheek butterfly, blue line angel, scribbled, personifier. Fish of that size range. Emperor I like, but they do get large. If I did a Tang, it would be black or gem. My thought were fish 7-9” at largest - but realistically they would go into QT at juvenile sizes - 2-3”.

If those that did comment have actual experiences with these fish it would be nice to hear. Regardless of gallon count the tank is only 48” so I that was my concern. If people who have experience with these fish can comment based on their swim habits that would be appreciated.

This will be FO with minimal rock so before we jump to conclusions keep that in mind - this is not a 72” 180g tank with 50% volume being rock and coral. I would like to stay open minded and make a realistic decision. Obviously I have seen other tanks than had far less swimming room with far more fish that have been successful and the fish healthy for many years so my thoughts may be biased so bear with me.

tbare89 · Jun 24, 2019

I currently have a 3-4 inch regal angel in a 75 gallon reef and he is thriving. Eats a lot of pellets. He is the reason for my future upgrade though. You can start with them small but they will eventually need a bigger tank.