Help with sump design

[Dan7575]

Hi Guys,

I have a CNC cutter and can get acrylic at trade prices, I also don’t have space in my sump for a refugium so I thought why not build myself a custom one! I have all the tools to do it but I really don’t understand the science of sumps and every one I look at is different. can anyone help with explaining what I need to incorporate into a design so that it works?

 

[RocketEngineer]

At its simplest, a sump is just a water tight container. Beyond that becomes a matter of what you want to do with it. There is little science involved, just choices.

The first choice is location. My setups usually have the sump in the stand. This dictated the size (40B for my last setup). With the size worked out, it’s a matter of how the volume of the sump will be used. In my case, I went with my skimmer at one end, my refugium at the other end, and the pump in the middle. There are other layouts out there and they all have their pro/con considerations. Next I worked out where the baffles went based on the equipment I had chosen. The addition of a bubble trap after the skimmer is a common choice to reduce microbubbles in the display.

One bit of physics to help your design: water should enter or exit each section by flowing OVER a baffle. By doing so you break the surface and prevent the formation of oil slicks and biofilm on that section.

Hope that helps.

 

[Dan7575]

If you have the return in the middle wouldn’t that mean that the refugium gets bypassed as the flow would go through the skimmer then in the return chamber?

 

[RocketEngineer]

I supplied the refugium from my return pump. By going that route I was able to use a taller baffle for the refugium than I would have been able to use with it in the middle.

 

[R.Weller]

It really depends on what you are trying to do with the sump.

Are you trying to add water volume to the overall system?
Are you wanting to hide equipment?
Are you wanting to remove nitrates?
Are you wanting to increase flow through the system?
Are you wanting to cultivate live food (pods) for your fish / corals?

Knowing the answers to these questions, & in what priority, will help the community offer some recommendations.

A good sump will help you do all of these things (YES to all above), but how to configure it will be based on your goals, the specifics of your current system & how much available space you have to work with.

 

[Dan7575]

Well my main problem because I am pretty new to the hobby is I don’t really know. I have a sump because it came with the kit I bought and everyone has one but as far a having a real understanding of what they are for and then adapting that to a personal level is a bit more advanced than the stage that I am at. I do a lot of reading about reefing but it can sometimes be hard to get an understanding as there are so many differing views on the same subjects but they all seem to work. Guess I will just have to keep reading!

 

[gabrieltackitt]

Well my main problem because I am pretty new to the hobby is I don’t really know. I have a sump because it came with the kit I bought and everyone has one but as far a having a real understanding of what they are for and then adapting that to a personal level is a bit more advanced than the stage that I am at. I do a lot of reading about reefing but it can sometimes be hard to get an understanding as there are so many differing views on the same subjects but they all seem to work. Guess I will just have to keep reading!

More than just continuing to read, go out and do! That’s the best way to learn what works for you and your setup!

My advice would be to go out and make a plan, then post it on here for critique, then revise, repost, etc. until you have a solid plan and a good idea of what you are trying to accomplish and why.

Reading about it is great and all but immerse yourself in the challenge of planning and you start having to learn a lot more and it directs what you are learning along the way!

 

[RocketEngineer]

For me, I can honestly say sumps have been an experiment. My very first tank was a 30 where I did a lot of HOB equipment. I built a pvc overflow ( don’t recommend it tbh) and fit a 10g in the stand. I had to get creative to move my skimmer as a) it was too tall to hang on the sump, and b) I didn’t have any baffles. But I learned about keeping the water level go the skimmer constant so I added a container inside the sump that the skimmer pump and drain sat in. I then decided to try chaeto and added a piece of grid to keep it out of my return pump. I learned how to use a bag of sand as a pump pad to reduce the pump noise. And when I upgraded to my 75g I used what I learned to make the system more to techniques I liked. Drilled tank, ball of chaeto. The upgrade to the 125 was a chance(excuse) to rework the spacing on the sump for a bigger skimmer area to make cleaning it easier. And this time around, I’m going back to the system that worked on the 75 instead of the failures I had with the 125. Good luck.

 

[Sebastiancrab]

Well my main problem because I am pretty new to the hobby is I don’t really know. I have a sump because it came with the kit I bought and everyone has one but as far a having a real understanding of what they are for and then adapting that to a personal level is a bit more advanced than the stage that I am at. I do a lot of reading about reefing but it can sometimes be hard to get an understanding as there are so many differing views on the same subjects but they all seem to work. Guess I will just have to keep reading!

I am in the same boat as you. Can you email me anything you decide/learn? I am getting a 40 gal breeder with a 20 gallon sump.

 

[gabrieltackitt]

I am in the same boat as you. Can you email me anything you decide/learn? I am getting a 40 gal breeder with a 20 gallon sump.

Let me know if you have any questions as well, I just put together nearly that exact setup!

 

[Sebastiancrab]

Let me know if you have any questions as well, I just put together nearly that exact setup!

I really appreciate that. You will hear from me!

 

[R.Weller]

Well my main problem because I am pretty new to the hobby is I don’t really know. I have a sump because it came with the kit I bought and everyone has one but as far a having a real understanding of what they are for and then adapting that to a personal level is a bit more advanced than the stage that I am at. I do a lot of reading about reefing but it can sometimes be hard to get an understanding as there are so many differing views on the same subjects but they all seem to work. Guess I will just have to keep reading!

After failing for 2 years I decided to check out all the books that I could on the subject from the local library. I saw all these beautiful tanks & knew that I could accomplish this with sufficient knowledge. Perhaps the most profound work that I read was written by John H. Tullock, Natural Reef Aquariums, 2001. Highly recommended. I bought a copy & referred to it often to plan our upgrade to a larger system.

As others have noted, grab some graph paper, sketch out your ideas / plans & post them here. I can say that while we love the display tank, the bio diversity in the sump is astonishing. It may not be as colorful, but watching everything work is well worth the investment.

 

[Sebastiancrab]

Like you, I got a bunch of books from the library and devoured them. Then I bought the tank and stand from Petco and got it going with my Eheim 250 canister. I got on this blog and decided that I needed to change some things!

I am ordering the book now $6 used on Amazon! I love your Psalm 19:1 quote. The stars reveal His/Her glory but then so do the bluebird babies cheeping their heads off for food in my backyard today.

 

[Mikeneedsahobby]

I will explain why I designed my sump the way I did and maybe that will help you with what you want from your sump.

at the end... my sump is very similar to rocket engineers.

for me the most important thing for the sump to do is hide the equipment and keep a constant water height in the display tank. As long as the sump is below the display tank then the water level in the display tank will be constant. Now on to equipment.

I have a skimmer, heater, pump, and a couple of probes.

skimmer compartment
Skimmers work best if the water level they are in is constant. And wherever the return pump is will vary in height as water evaporates. So I want the skimmer to be separated from the return pump with a baffle at the height the skimmer needs ( mine is 7 inches). The skimmer puts out lots of bubbles. So I have a second baffle set higher than the first baffle and off the bottom. This forces water to go over and then under the baffles and removes bubbles. I decided I wanted the dirtiest water going to the skimmer first. To do this the tanks main drains go to the skimmer compartment and it fills first and flows to the pump return.

Main pump chamber
the heater, probes, and return pump are in the second chamber. No decisions here. It is what is left over. In my sump it is in the middle.

Refugium
I have room and they can be helpful as a filter and place for pods to live. (Or an evil but cool hitchhiker or fish). My refugium is on the opposite side of sump from the skimmer (pump is middle). I wanted to maximize the refugium size so it’s baffle is much taller than the skimmer baffle. (12 inches) That is a big drop to the pump chamber (about 6 inches) so I have two baffles that stair step down to reduce noise. The second is 9 inches. Both are over baffles. To fill the refugium I use a manifold from the return pump to move some water to it.

Other
Auto water top off. Water drips to the pump chamber and from a remote reservoir. I use an elevated bucket and float valve. This isn’t the best but works for now You may want to plan a reservoir next to the sump.

Future
Reactors. If I decided to get them later they will get water from the manifold.

hope this helps.

 

[Dan7575]

I will explain why I designed my sump the way I did and maybe that will help you with what you want from your sump.

at the end... my sump is very similar to rocket engineers.

for me the most important thing for the sump to do is hide the equipment and keep a constant water height in the display tank. As long as the sump is below the display tank then the water level in the display tank will be constant. Now on to equipment.

I have a skimmer, heater, pump, and a couple of probes.

skimmer compartment
Skimmers work best if the water level they are in is constant. And wherever the return pump is will vary in height as water evaporates. So I want the skimmer to be separated from the return pump with a baffle at the height the skimmer needs ( mine is 7 inches). The skimmer puts out lots of bubbles. So I have a second baffle set higher than the first baffle and off the bottom. This forces water to go over and then under the baffles and removes bubbles. I decided I wanted the dirtiest water going to the skimmer first. To do this the tanks main drains go to the skimmer compartment and it fills first and flows to the pump return.

Main pump chamber
the heater, probes, and return pump are in the second chamber. No decisions here. It is what is left over. In my sump it is in the middle.

Refugium
I have room and they can be helpful as a filter and place for pods to live. (Or an evil but cool hitchhiker or fish). My refugium is on the opposite side of sump from the skimmer (pump is middle). I wanted to maximize the refugium size so it’s baffle is much taller than the skimmer baffle. (12 inches) That is a big drop to the pump chamber (about 6 inches) so I have two baffles that stair step down to reduce noise. The second is 9 inches. Both are over baffles. To fill the refugium I use a manifold from the return pump to move some water to it.

Other
Auto water top off. Water drips to the pump chamber and from a remote reservoir. I use an elevated bucket and float valve. This isn’t the best but works for now You may want to plan a reservoir next to the sump.

Future
Reactors. If I decided to get them later they will get water from the manifold.

hope this helps.

Yes really good thanks, nice explanation of why you have done the way you have. Can you post some pics of it as well?

 

[ekopapers]

I have a 75 gallon with a 20 gallon long tank for the sump (from petco dollar sale). I designed my sump based off the trigger system here and have been very happy with it. Here is the link to download the corel file and here is the link to the svg if you are using another vector software (if you want to check it out). attached are some pictures of it when i set it up a couple of months ago.

 

[Dan7575]

I have a 75 gallon with a 20 gallon long tank for the sump (from petco dollar sale). I designed my sump based off the trigger system here and have been very happy with it. Here is the link to download the corel file and here is the link to the svg if you are using another vector software (if you want to check it out). attached are some pictures of it when i set it up a couple of months ago.

Did you make that sump yourself or buy it?

 

[R.Weller]

I mentioned the design sketch above. Have a look at the first image in our sump design along with the other images in the build process. I've tried to be detailed to explain the choices that we made along the way. It might give you some ideas as well.

DIY evolving sump for large system

Our journey with a sump started years ago with a 20gal tall supporting a non-drilled 60gal display. That provided some interesting learning, so when we upgraded to a large system, we had a jumpstart on a design that would work for our new system. After a few months of reading & discussing with...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[ekopapers]

Did you make that sump yourself or buy it?

I made it and the files myself, used a laser to cut out acrylic and siliconed them into a 20 ga long tank from petco

 

[Sebastiancrab]

Did you make that sump yourself or buy it?

Dan, know that you can purchase the inside sump pieces from Jax Racks. They are the most reasonable I have come across so far.