well.....things got worse.....Im at a loss.....I finally created a small 6 gallon hospital tank with fresh saltwater only in it and moved the clowns.....they seem to be doing much better but still not sure about 2 of them......the royal gramma didnt make it.....I got tired of fighting nitrite......it was staying through the roof.....went and bought 15 gallons of saltwater from the fish store and did about 90-95% water change to start from scratch.....my ph is a hair low at 8 so I added some balance to bring it up.....zero ammonia..... between 0 and .25 nitrite......will check on it tomorrow and monday to see where we are and proceed from there......if things stay as they should.....any one want to chime in on how long I should wait before adding any fish back in to the tank? I will likely not add all 4 clowns back at the same time regardless of when that is
HELP
- Thread starter motomac3
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Obviously had I known 4 fish would have been a problem and thrown my tank into this spiral I wouldn't have done it....I have been trying to find somewhere to rehome them and haven't had any luck...so with my very limited options I could put 4 1" clownfish in to some safe water to hopefully save their lives or let them die where they were.....this is supposed to be a forum for education and help....im having issues and looked for help but got met with your attitude. I screwed up and admitted I screwed up. It happens....im guessing you have never made a single error with any of your tanks or fish...im in an emergency situation trying to save my fish and tank and dont need your holier than thou attitude. Its not like i asked if i could put 4 clowns in tank and was told no and did it anyway!
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chipmunkofdoom2
Always Making Something
There are no good chemical additives to do this in a reef tank. The only way you can really raise pH is to control the level of dissolved CO2 in the water. Any additive that does raise your tank's pH will only have a temporary effect. Worse yet, all pH boosting additives of which I am aware also raise carbonate alkalinity, which over time will become a problem.
Unless you have specific goals (raising pH to encourage calcification of hard corals or coralline algae), I would not attempt to control pH. Unless the control measure is opening a window and getting some fresh air into the area surrounding your tank.
I guess I am just getting bad information everywhere I turn....the lady at the saltwater pet store ( when i originally set up my tank) told me I should keep eye on ph and sold me a bottle that says on it that it will raise ph without affecting alkalinity. Who knows if that's true. It's called balance....forget the brand name but can list it when I get back to my office....everywhere I turn I get contradictory info and trying to fix my issues....i have no reason to raise ph other than I have been told to keep it between 8.2 and 8.4.....and it was around 8.0
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chipmunkofdoom2
Always Making Something
Unfortunately, in my experience, most of the advice I receive from LFSs is incorrect. At the very least, it's incomplete or slightly misleading. At worst it's just plain wrong.
Aquavitro Balance (which I'm pretty sure is what you're describing) is a potassium/sodium hydroxide-based product. The way Na/K hydroxide increases pH is similar to the way that kalkwasser increases pH. The hydroxide combines with carbon dioxide in the water to form carbonate and bicarbonate (see Randy Holmes-Farley's article on the topic). The reason this raises your pH is partially because hydroxide solutions are usually very basic, but also because the chemical reaction removes CO2 from the water. The problem is the carbonate and bicarbonate formed by this reaction raise your overall carbonate alkalinity.
Remember that some vendors are more concerned about making a sale than advising patience.
Do diligent research here or similar media before buying any products or livestock.
The frustration can be maddening but go slow.
Ph is not your problem, do not use the product, for now forget about pH. Continue with small water changes, like a gallon a day or every other day until the system stabilizes.
Yes that is it.....i will quit worrying about ph foe now.....im mainly just trying to get nitrite under control.....its very discouraging as that is my only issue.....every other parameter is perfect....i try and weed through all the info I get and make a best judgement....but even here in this thread I have gotten contradictory info....everyone has their own way of doing things and I get everyone will go about ways a little different. Just trying to make sure I am doing everything I can.....i realize I can't fix it with the snap of a finger. But want to make sure I am doing everything I can
The animals were already bought and in the tank....things were great then out of the blue nitrite spiked to the moon....i didn't ask for advice and not follow it....i asked for advice in helping fix my problem...
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Woah... let's just leave it there shall we? There's another forum if you wanna have a row lol.
Back to the tank... iirc you currently have a 13.5g, with rock / sand / filtration etc but no fish... and a 6g with nothing in it except 4 clowns and seawater?
If that's right, you need to sort the 6g out pronto as with no filtration at all, ammonia will be through the roof and the fish dead in hours.
If i were you, I'd add 2 clowns back into the 13.5g now, bag the other 2 up in fresh saltwater and take them back to the store.
The 2 clowns in the 13.5g will be fine, just do 10% WC per day until everything sorts itself out... bacteria multiply rapidly, you're not high in ammonia so the cycle shouldn't stall.
Give it 5 days and you'll see nitrite stable at zero. Then you can switch to WCs to control nitrates only.
Bin that balance stuff, stability of pH is far more important than the number... at the moment you're destabilising it by chasing numbers. Keep the prime, dose a little every day until you get consistent zero test results for nitrite.
Lastly, don't sweat it. We all make mistakes, that's life. At least you were big enough to admit it and seek help. Many others would have let the fish die.
Good luck and keep us posted
Oh and keep the bio and carbon in the filter... it'll all have bacteria and you need as much of that as you can get atm.
Welcome to R2R btw... nice to have you on board... I'll mention a few bits of advice I was given years ago and have stood me in good stead:
Nothing good happens quickly in this hobby.
We keep water, not fish. Get that right and your animals will thrive.
Observe; an hour's observation will tell you more than a years worth of test data.
Welcome to R2R btw... nice to have you on board... I'll mention a few bits of advice I was given years ago and have stood me in good stead:
Nothing good happens quickly in this hobby.
We keep water, not fish. Get that right and your animals will thrive.
Observe; an hour's observation will tell you more than a years worth of test data.
Well...
Not to throw another wrench into this, but after reading through all of the posts it sounds to me like your tank never fully cycled; or at the very least the cycling process is not progressing successfully. If you're having any issues with nitrite at all, forget about everything else; the tank isn't ready. As mentioned, PH is a non issue at this point and for what it's worth, my current system is 2 years old and it's rare that my PH is 8.0 or higher.
IMO your tank should have no fish or inverts what so ever. If it was me... I would return everything to the fish store, even if they don't credit you full price, you're saving the fish... Live and Learn.
I would dose a pure ammonia source to your system. This doesn't mean you're starting over, there's probably beneficial bacteria already present. In which case they will quickly convert that ammonia and you should see your nitrite spike again and then hopefully a nitrate spike shortly there after. Also, I would not perform any water changes during this process. You're not supposed to perform a water change when cycling a tank until you see 0 nitrite and a large spike in nitrate.
And while the comments were not my own, i'd like to apologize for any ill tempered or rude comments you received. I promise you this type of behavior is not indicative of this forum and is a rare thing. There are a plethora of very friendly and knowledgable folks around here that are more than willing to help! With that being said, it is not uncommon to receive a wide array of feedback and suggestions, in this hobby, for the various issues you may be having. If you happen to be skeptical or confused, look to the forum "experts" and "guru's" who have years of experience and the know how to point you in the right direction.
Not to throw another wrench into this, but after reading through all of the posts it sounds to me like your tank never fully cycled; or at the very least the cycling process is not progressing successfully. If you're having any issues with nitrite at all, forget about everything else; the tank isn't ready. As mentioned, PH is a non issue at this point and for what it's worth, my current system is 2 years old and it's rare that my PH is 8.0 or higher.
IMO your tank should have no fish or inverts what so ever. If it was me... I would return everything to the fish store, even if they don't credit you full price, you're saving the fish... Live and Learn.
I would dose a pure ammonia source to your system. This doesn't mean you're starting over, there's probably beneficial bacteria already present. In which case they will quickly convert that ammonia and you should see your nitrite spike again and then hopefully a nitrate spike shortly there after. Also, I would not perform any water changes during this process. You're not supposed to perform a water change when cycling a tank until you see 0 nitrite and a large spike in nitrate.
And while the comments were not my own, i'd like to apologize for any ill tempered or rude comments you received. I promise you this type of behavior is not indicative of this forum and is a rare thing. There are a plethora of very friendly and knowledgable folks around here that are more than willing to help! With that being said, it is not uncommon to receive a wide array of feedback and suggestions, in this hobby, for the various issues you may be having. If you happen to be skeptical or confused, look to the forum "experts" and "guru's" who have years of experience and the know how to point you in the right direction.
That helps .....and I guess it could be the problem....i just would have figured by now surely the tank would have cycled.....but I have zero ammonia and my nitrates are around 30ppm.....im just tiring of chasing this nitrite issue with absolutely zero improvement at this point....any improvement at all would not be so discouraging but I can get nitrite down to .25ppm and the next day it's back to 5.0ppm or higher.
seastar
Well-Known Member
That nitrite is all part of the tank's initial cycle. That will eventually start testing as nitrate and then things will begin to settle down at which point you'll have a "cycled" tank and it will be safe for a small amount of fish. It will happen and I know it's super frustrating but it will settle in and can even be kind of fun if you look at it through the lens of how complex and amazing the ocean really is.
Your questions alone so far show you care and have what it takes to have a very successful tank, so keep at it!
@CodyRVA has given you some great advice and very much in the spirit of this forum so I'd lean towards following that. If you can swing it, you might want to look into quarantine procedures (QT) and begin that with your fish. You can typically pick up the equipment needed for that relatively cheap (look for the major pet store chains $1/gallon tank sales) and you could start that with you fish to make sure that your 13.5 is all ready to go and disease free once it's cycled as well.
Your questions alone so far show you care and have what it takes to have a very successful tank, so keep at it!
@CodyRVA has given you some great advice and very much in the spirit of this forum so I'd lean towards following that. If you can swing it, you might want to look into quarantine procedures (QT) and begin that with your fish. You can typically pick up the equipment needed for that relatively cheap (look for the major pet store chains $1/gallon tank sales) and you could start that with you fish to make sure that your 13.5 is all ready to go and disease free once it's cycled as well.
Thanks for all the help from those who are helping......From 8am....to 9:45. After only about 1.5 gallon water change and some prime and stability......tomorrow will likely be back to deep purple.....i guess where I am having issue....is why do I have good nitrate levels and zero ammonia if it's still in cycle?
the reason i had been adding it was because its "supposed" to help lower nitrites....and the stability is "supposed" to help in setting up a new tank......with all of the water changes and chasing nitrite i thought it would help......i will gladly stop using it if it will help get this under control.
