Hey Triton, what's going on with my macro algae?

[d2mini]

In previous threads and vids I've shown my macro, especially Cheato, kicking butt.
But recently it has crashed. I even tried a brand new batch of Cheato this past week and it too is breaking down and disintegrating. I've also noticed more algae in the display. I know the problem with the fuge is not the Mars Hydro 300 light since it did great for the first several months. But what would cause such a turn around the past few months? I don't think it's starving either, especially since I've been having to crank up the dosing of my original base elements with the addition of more corals.

Any ideas?
My last ICP test didn't show much that was off track... I was a little low on a few elements which I corrected per the instructions.

Here's a PDF of the last ICP results, when I first started having this problem back in November.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2385073/Triton-11-13-16.pdf
Notice that p04 was off the charts high, which I attributed to the massive cheato crash.

 

[Psymon]

In previous threads and vids I've shown my macro, especially Cheato, kicking butt.
But recently it has crashed. I even tried a brand new batch of Cheato this past week and it too is breaking down and disintegrating. I've also noticed more algae in the display. I know the problem with the fuge is not the Mars Hydro 300 light since it did great for the first several months. But what would cause such a turn around the past few months? I don't think it's starving either, especially since I've been having to crank up the dosing of my original base elements with the addition of more corals.

Any ideas?
My last ICP test didn't show much that was off track... I was a little low on a few elements which I corrected per the instructions.

Here's a PDF of the last ICP results, when I first started having this problem back in November.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2385073/Triton-11-13-16.pdf
Notice that p04 was off the charts high, which I attributed to the massive cheato crash.

What's your photoperiod on the mars? I have cranked down my lighting from 12 hours to this weeks now sitting at 10 very slowly.
My chaeto brick started turning white directly underneath the mars, and the lower half is a lush green. I haven't touched it since I put it in. Some other Algaes seem to be struggling along.

 

[d2mini]

What's your photoperiod on the mars? I have cranked down my lighting from 12 hours to this weeks now sitting at 10 very slowly.
My chaeto brick started turning white directly underneath the mars, and the lower half is a lush green. I haven't touched it since I put it in. Some other Algaes seem to be struggling along.

10 hours and that has never changed since day 1.
Mine isn't turning white or showing other visual signs of too much light. It's literally falling apart/decomposing.

 

[Tim@Triton Verified Sponsor]

Hey Dennis

The algae in the display will unfortunately be a byproduct of the pro algae elements not being used by the algae in the fuge.

So as to why the fuge algae is not surviving can be down to a number of things.

Lighting, you are confident the lighting is ok so not that, still might be worth checking with a light meter if you have one to check the spectrum.
Lighting period, if the lights are on 24hrs then the algae may have become too efficient and taken all of it's own food source. Should be run reverse cycle to the main lights.
Elements, we know they are getting what they need from the C7
Nutrients, unknown.... if your nutrients have gone too low NO3 and PO4 then the algae will die back
Seasonal shift, we have observed several shifts through out the year when whether it be airborne pollen or pollutants causes the tank environment to favour one species over another. This causes one or more species to die back while allowing the other to come forward, however if you don't happen to have the species that like the new environment then you could of course be left with none. This is why we recommend as many different species of macro as possible.

I would look into nutrients first...

 

[Psymon]

10 hours and that has never changed since day 1.
Mine isn't turning white or showing other visual signs of too much light. It's literally falling apart/decomposing.

Do you have a pic? I have some parts where it looks like it's rotting. But I haven't touched it, and my last icp didn't show any issues about it.

 

[d2mini]

Hey Dennis

The algae in the display will unfortunately be a byproduct of the pro algae elements not being used by the algae in the fuge.

So as to why the fuge algae is not surviving can be down to a number of things.

Lighting, you are confident the lighting is ok so not that, still might be worth checking with a light meter if you have one to check the spectrum.
Lighting period, if the lights are on 24hrs then the algae may have become too efficient and taken all of it's own food source. Should be run reverse cycle to the main lights.
Elements, we know they are getting what they need from the C7
Nutrients, unknown.... if your nutrients have gone too low NO3 and PO4 then the algae will die back
Seasonal shift, we have observed several shifts through out the year when whether it be airborne pollen or pollutants causes the tank environment to favour one species over another. This causes one or more species to die back while allowing the other to come forward, however if you don't happen to have the species that like the new environment then you could of course be left with none. This is why we recommend as many different species of macro as possible.

I would look into nutrients first...

Yeah, it may be nutrients. My N03 is at zero this morning. It's always low, usually around 1 ppm.
P04 is .067 according to the hanna phosphorous checker.

Think I should I break out the stump remover and start dosing?
I feed a pretty good amount already (Larry's Reef Frenzy 2-3x per day) but I don't have a ton of fish yet. Three anthias, one tang, two clowns, and one springeri damsel.

Do you have a pic? I have some parts where it looks like it's rotting. But I haven't touched it, and my last icp didn't show any issues about it.

I do not have a pic yet.
I can try to get one later.

 

[Tim@Triton Verified Sponsor]

Yeah I would say that you have gone too low, apart from feeding more or actually increasing the fish stock then yeah you can dose NO3 as long as it is pure.

Other things you can do is reduce your photo period down to 8hrs, and skim less.

 

[bubbaque]

Dennis, if nutrients was the issue do you think the algae would be growing in the display?

 

[d2mini]

Dennis, if nutrients was the issue do you think the algae would be growing in the display?

Well like Tim says above, I think the algae in the display is a byproduct of the elements that are being dosed that are supposed to feed the algae bed.
The algae i'm seeing is some diatoms on the sand bed and some brown fluffy stuff that seams to like to catch on my gorgonians and grow there.
I was a bit shocked to see that the nitrates were completely undetectable on my Red Sea Pro kit this morning.

 

[Tim@Triton Verified Sponsor]

Some pest algae can use certain elements over nutrients to grow when nutrients are low, if the macro algae in fuge is not using the elements especially added to boost the goth of them then they will accumulate or being used up elsewhere.

This incidentally is the difference between Core7 Base Elements and Core7 Reef Supplements, as the Reef Supplements are designed to be used without an algae bed these boosting elements have been reduced.

 

[d2mini]

I'm actually about to switch to Core7 this week or next.
Finally almost done with the original Base Elements.
But I'll stick with the regular Core7 because I do prefer to have the macros in my systems.

 

[bubbaque]

Are you going to dose the no3, Dennis?

 

[EAsalty]

I am not sure if you are using No3: Po4-X. However, based on researching forums and my experience, dosing No3: Po4-X has a negative effect on Macro algae for obvious reasons. Prior to dosing N03: P04- X, my chaetomorpa was overrunning my small refuge (using reverse cycle) in my sump. I am slowing adding more acroporas to my mixed reef so I began dosing No3: Po4-X to create a low nutrient environment. No3: Po4-X was great in reducing my Nitrate levels leading to significant positive changes in my acroporas, although my cheato began diminishing and losing its color. I am considering removing what is left in my refuge and just adding LR rubble and sand for my amphipods and copepods. I am quickly learning that a mixed reef requires some give and take in efforts to create a good balance between the softies, LPS and SPS . . . . I may talk about low pH later.

 

[d2mini]

Are you going to dose the no3, Dennis?

Yes, going to dose Spectracide Stump Remover.
It's 100.0% KNO3

I am not sure if you are using No3: Po4-X. However, based on researching forums and my experience, dosing No3: Po4-X has a negative effect on Macro algae for obvious reasons. Prior to dosing N03: P04- X, my chaetomorpa was overrunning my small refuge (using reverse cycle) in my sump. I am slowing adding more acroporas to my mixed reef so I began dosing No3: Po4-X to create a low nutrient environment. No3: Po4-X was great in reducing my Nitrate levels leading to significant positive changes in my acroporas, although my cheato began diminishing and losing its color. I am considering removing what is left in my refuge and just adding LR rubble and sand for my amphipods and copepods. I am quickly learning that a mixed reef requires some give and take in efforts to create a good balance between the softies, LPS and SPS . . . . I may talk about low pH later.

Nope. My nitrates are always low so I wouldn't try to lower them further. Just p04 has been high for me.
I have a brs reactor with carbon and some HC GFO in it.

 

[bubbaque]

Sorry for so many questions, Dennis, I'm just wanting to learn. Do you think dosing the no3 will put you in a cycle where your dosing no3 just to keep the algae alive? Will you have to keep dosing it?

The photos of the sps you posted recently didn't look faded.

 

[d2mini]

Sorry for so many questions, Dennis, I'm just wanting to learn. Do you think dosing the no3 will put you in a cycle where your dosing no3 just to keep the algae alive? Will you have to keep dosing it?

The photos of the sps you posted recently didn't look faded.

My fish load is pretty light so I would say for now I would expect I'll need to keep dosing.

SPS do look good overall but my two new JF stags are doing poorly now.

I'll keep this thread updated.

 

[Roberto CRC]

I have a problem similar to my macro (Chaeto), about 6 months ago I grew fast and strong, when that my No3 were 0.75ppm and Po4 was 0.04 according to Red Sea. I have more than 1 year of adding Nopox and macro growing Excellent as I mentioned.

After about 4 months towards today the chaeto is soft, grows little and disintegrates. My nutrients are higher than before and I continue to add Nopox.

I have been seriously analyzing eliminate all chaeto and not use shelter, since I add carbon and I also use GFO.

But it is a rare thing that the alga is damaged so much and what bothers me is that everything that disintegrates falls to the bottom and decomposes leaving a bad appearance in the sump.

 

[Hans-Werner]

The analysis says you have enough phosphate. Maybe nitrate is low and the algae are starving. In theory also low molybdenum could play a role. Molybdenum is necessary to reduce nitrate to nitrogen forms algae can use for growth. Look for a trace element additive that adds molybdenum. At this opportunity I would recommend also to dose iodine, maybe with a trace element additive that combines both.

 

[d2mini]

I added my first dose last night.
Mixed up a solution of around 800ml of RO/DI water with 100ml of Spectracide powder.
I dosed 20ml of that solution and this morning I had an n03 reading of 2 ppm.
I'm going to dose a little more tonite with the intent of bringing closer to 4 ppm.
Then figure out what kind of dose it's going to take to keep it around 3-4 ppm somewhat consistently.

 

[Catchemall]

I added my first dose last night.
Mixed up a solution of around 800ml of RO/DI water with 100ml of Spectracide powder.
I dosed 20ml of that solution and this morning I had an n03 reading of 2 ppm.
I'm going to dose a little more tonite with the intent of bringing closer to 4 ppm.
Then figure out what kind of dose it's going to take to keep it around 3-4 ppm somewhat consistently.

Which test kit are you using to test nitrate?