High ammonia

[huckilt]

Sounds like you need a new clean up crew.

I know I need more jus hard to make the drive to Albuquerque and in time to make it to a descent shop. No Petco or petsmart for me. Maybe for goods but not livestock. Any suggestions On what I should add? It’s only a 36 bow front. I laugh at my nassarius snails there’s a pair that follow each other around like husband and wife lol and you won’t usually see them unless it’s a few mins after feeding the clown. I guess they smell the food and come out.

 

[brandon429]

you can easily see by searching that most people feel their ammonia control systems have been overcame when any tests read free ammonia, so your initial concerns are what most would have had. This is new science / how we discerned your cycle status, so there isn’t much to compare out there in google. Nothing you can search provides what was provided, it takes instances like this to make new search returns


nothing has overcame the normal ability for the reef here, it met its cycle just fine though it seemed not to

in my threads we would put your tank through something called a rip clean where by this time tomorrow it’s been taken apart and 100% cleaned out, then put back together in excellent condition. That too is new science (the hobby would feel that a deep clean on a tank showing positive for ammonia would only inflame the bacteria more)

Most will have you wait it out in some way and that’s ok too, my main use for this thread was to reflect back on cycling rules that are universal vs varying. We needed your + ammonia concern thread to reflect back on ways the hobby would value a test kits reading over cycling charts which give no condition for ammonia to rise back up after a completed cycle, other than mass loss events like fish dying off etc.

your posted issue is so common for the hobby I tend to link these posts in work threads after they’re fixed up so we can log the patterns for others to see when they run searches

 

[brandon429]

when a test from ro water or tap or newly mixed comparative shows zero: Non reef water has no conversion going on so it usually blanks cleanly, just not the tank itself, which is over reported in most color tube comparison kits.


seneye tends to show a much different reading than api so that’s the best test we have in the hobby to understand what ammonia really does vs seems to do

we used this thread as an example of changes in cycle rules because the title is so common in searches, there’s probably eighty pages or more on google of threads exactly like this, all with the same factors and readings and timing in place such that the hobby itself had no way to disbelieve the initial readings posted here until recently.

 

[brandon429]

When I catch high ammonia threads I’m calling out the hobby not the actual poster if that helps any. For thirty years straight in the hobby we each reinforce the readings to each other


it’s only recently we all began questioning test readings, and by extension reinforcing what bacteria do vs doubt them. The hobby still isn’t quite sure -how much- to believe in the bacteria but we are evolving fast

Check this out

Ammonia slowly climbing?

Hey all, I'm having an ammonia problem. According to my Seneye Reef (multiple slides) and my Red Sea test kit I have ammonia in my tank. It's a 112g system that's almost a year old. I started seeing Ammonia slowly tick up around the first of the month, but I couldn't immediately locate the...

www.reef2reef.com

that’s your exact issue but in a seneye thread, the best meter we have


we caught a misread simply because he posted hundredths ppm conversion rates for ammonia vs thousandths ppm...if a tester disagrees with the biology we can see, the test kit is wrong and not the bacteria. It took thirty years for us to evolve to this, and even now only about 10% of readers agree with me 90% still doubt the bacteria

 

[huckilt]

I went to my local wal mart and picked up some strip tests and even it is showing some ammonia..??

 

[huckilt]

Omg I jus noticed my hammer looked this way!!!! It was not like this when I left for work this am!!!

 

[Garf]

You got any freshly made up saltwater to dip your strip in, just for comparison?

 

[huckilt]

You got any freshly made up saltwater to dip your strip in, just for comparison?

Yes will take one in the fresh ro and my fresh mixed salt. Will post results shortly.

 

[huckilt]

The one with the results on bottom is saltwater the one with the results on top is freshwater and then the two side by side.

 

[brandon429]

you are buying test kits known to show false positives, this must be considered.

Google your test kit, see if anyone else gets false positives

Here's the search string to run, not a test on the tank but a web search: on google-'api test strips misread reef tank'

And then the classic from Google: 'api .25 false reading'

The posted links show work examples proving your tests are misreading, a large corporation responds to the false read issue in one of the standout posts...

Your hammer is fine. Lps corals change shape, that's not bleached or bailed out and if it was, the tank being put into eutrophic condition and left for six months vs clean reef is a more fitting explanation.

there's nothing wrong with the coral it's healthy and fine.

you have too much surface area from rocks and sand to have free ammonia, we are skipping that critical detail

Buy seneye if you're serious about testing.

Free ammonia doesn't affect just one animal it's a tank wiper, with cloudy smelly water. You have opposite

 

[brandon429]

If you want your reef to work correctly apply the fix where it's needed and clean up the system, disallow the algae and clouding from waste in the rocks and sand, those produce irritating waste acids and detritus clogs up your system although it doesn't cause free ammonia.


Cease testing for ammonia for the life of the tank, it can't drift out of spec.




Reefing isn't very fun using the old cycle rules is it- from those rules we get concern, doubt, untimeliness, hesitation vs absolute resolve posted for you to consider using the new rules. The reason your post is a cycle issue is because on a cycling chart ammonia never goes back up and holds, after a cycle.


Old cycling rules got you to spend money to test a param we already know is fine.

New cycling rules save you money


Old cycling rules disavow surface area mechanics, no matter how many times it's mentioned. Old cycling rules accept test readings as right no matter what, even if Google shows twenty years of misreads for the same kit

 

[Garf]

It may indeed be a red herring but by insisting you are correct in every matter you are preventing proper analysis of the problem. Thankfully the OP has found there is something wrong with his RODI which may be causing the issues he has noticed.

 

[huckilt]

If you want your reef to work correctly apply the fix where it's needed and clean up the system, disallow the algae and clouding from waste in the rocks and sand, those produce irritating waste acids and detritus clogs up your system although it doesn't cause free ammonia.


Cease testing for ammonia for the life of the tank, it can't drift out of spec.




Reefing isn't very fun using the old cycle rules is it- from those rules we get concern, doubt, untimeliness, hesitation vs absolute resolve posted for you to consider using the new rules. The reason your post is a cycle issue is because on a cycling chart ammonia never goes back up and holds, after a cycle.


Old cycling rules got you to spend money to test a param we already know is fine.

New cycling rules save you money


Old cycling rules disavow surface area mechanics, no matter how many times it's mentioned. Old cycling rules accept test readings as right no matter what, even if Google shows twenty years of misreads for the same kit

Great info!! Thank you so much for the detailed responses. The only reason I even tested for ammonia is cause of the algae/bacterial problem, I started with nitrate and phosphate came up with zero so I moved on to ammonia. I’m not really worried about the ammonia issue as much as I am the algae/bacteria growth. And that was the main reason for this thread. Now that I understand ammonia shouldn’t be an issue I will regroup and concentrate my efforts on getting rid of the algae/bacterial growth. Maybe jus some Vibrant will help there. What would be a better choice seneye or trident? with the next round of stimulus I’m definitely going to buy one. I have another tank being built atm so it would be nice to have a system that can expand to multiple tanks if that’s possible. I know I wouldn’t want to buy two tridents that’s for sure. I didn’t think the seneye was as impressive as I recently found out. Seen a chart off someone’s seneye and wow they do a lot more that I expected. Didn’t think it gave actual readings, thought it was more of jus an alarm for when things were bad. So I have a new appreciation for them especially their price point. But I like the idea of being able to control things as well not jus monitor. I’m too cheap to buy timers and I’m not always home on time to shut off tank lights and turn on sump lights. As a matter of fact could that be a reason my hammer did that? I had accidentally left my blue channel on all night the night before that happened. It was looking better this am only got a quick glance at it though as I am on a quick road trip to pick up a new Rott puppy.

 

[brandon429]

How are we looking here


curious if the tank was cleaned up vs dosed. Cleaned, clouding waste and growths removed. If that did occur the tank will be back to sharp and new looking

 

[huckilt]

How are we looking here


curious if the tank was cleaned up vs dosed. Cleaned, clouding waste and growths removed. If that did occur the tank will be back to sharp and new looking

We’re looking somewhat better...??? It’s not really growing back as quickly as it has. I usually blow off what I can with a turkey baster get the big chucks suspended and suck em up and put em down the overflow. Then after a few hrs I clean out the filter floss and replace. But there’s still a lot of fuzz and heavy patches of the snot like stuff. I haven’t gotten a chance to get anything to dose(vibrant) so I’ve jus been doing my weekly water changes and daily blowing of the rocks. I was jus starting to setup a 30 gal tank I have to move my fish and coral to with the clean live rock from the sump and jus let this system run empty till it clears up. I have multiple tanks so it’s not to big a problem with that’s jus don’t have any live sand to put in so it would be a bare bottom with cycled LR would that work out ok? Or would I be better off getting a bag of sand?

 

[brandon429]

That’s chrysophytes / the growth on there

no sand will be needed if you use clean live rock in the new setup to a normal degree, it’s always enough surface area even without sand

 

[brandon429]

H

would you take an ammonia reading and post the vial next to the color chart in clear light as a picture so we can see the reading ourselves

want to know what your test says for continual free ammonia

 

[huckilt]

Soon as I get back home I’ll use the api drops I have and post the results here. I have pics posted of the dip strip tests I took that I was able to get brand new from the wal mart in my small town. I have one of the tank water and one is the freshwater out of the ro/di. The api test I have might be kinda old.. I dunno how age affects them I know they have an expiration date but doesn’t everything? I was drinking milk last week that was expired for ten days but the milk was still good.

 

[brandon429]

Cant wait to see

 

[huckilt]

I know the last time I checked it with the api test it was not that light of a green kinda darker at least in the 1.0 range