High nitrate but 0.00 phosphate? What to do?

[MaxTremors]

Good to know, I will be watchn your progress. I started to does Sodium Phosphate yesterday. I was also in the same boat, 0.00 'phosphates and relatively low nitrates, this is after I did a major sump cleaning as well as using nopox...Today I tested the Phosphates (Hanna Checker/API) and they were at .033 ppm per Hanna and API .25ppm. I will continue to monitor mine and see if it continues to increase.

What’s the dilution on that, or how do mix that into solution and dose?

 

[fushi]

Okey thanks for the tip il look it Up as well. Is prodibio biodigest the same as PNS probio? Or are they 2 different brands? And why is microbacter 7 not a good option ? Just curious and want to learn more I’m really open for advices.

Yea I know I want to take things slowly and in a as natural way as possible. When it comes to my water changes I always match temp,and salinity what made me a little suprised is that My last mix showed a alk of 4.8!! And I’m using the tropic Marin pro reef salt. I keep my dkh at 9 in the tank so yea this was suprising

Yea I thought about the AI Nero as well it’s been between them or a MP10. I tried the gyres from maxspect before in another tank I had can’t say I wasn’t happy but the huge downside for me was 1 the maintenance
2 the extremely annoying sound wich my wife hates as well hahah.

So brightwell‘s explanation of what MB7 is; is vague and states it promotes the nitrification process, but doesn’t give much else. Personally I think it just contains a carbon source, even though brightwell says it doesn’t, everytime I used it my NO3/PO4 dropped to zero (just like when i played with carbon dosing). PNS probio is a non sulfur bacteria, it a newer company and there isn’t much anecdotal info on their products that i know of. It’s promotional video didn't really sell me on it Lol.

It may be time to start dosing an alkalinity supplement, for your situation I would recommend saturated Kalkwasser, its easy to use, has a long track record of working well, and I would bet you could use the ph boost.


If you want to put the Nero on your back wall but are concerned about the magnet you can always put the outside magnet in a plastic bag before putting it in the water.

 

[fushi]

What’s the dilution on that, or how do mix that into solution and dose?

You can use the linked calculator with the selection of “phosphate - potassium phosphate”
it is close enough.

http://www.theplantedtank.co.uk/calculator.htm

 

[jphilip813]

What’s the dilution on that, or how do mix that into solution and dose?

I use this calculator; however I was unsure how much I actually dose at a time

James' Planted Tank - Dosing Calculator

 

[jphilip813]

You can use the linked calculator with the selection of “phosphate - potassium phosphate”
it is close enough.

http://www.theplantedtank.co.uk/calculator.htm

How much would you dose over a 24hr period time frame?

 

[MaxTremors]

How much would you dose over a 24hr period time frame?

The neophos bottle says not to dose more than the equivalent of 0.04ppm per day.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

The neophos bottle says not to dose more than the equivalent of 0.04ppm per day.

Seems low to me.

I'd dose 0.02 ppm a day for a bit to see how much is needed. If a tank starts very low, it may take a huge amount to come up to detectable dure to binding to rock and sand.

 

[fushi]

How much would you dose over a 24hr period time frame?

I would recomend seeing what your tank consumes.

Use the planted tank calculator to make a solution where 1ml = 0.05ppm for your tank.
(your actual solution will end up a little lower like 0.04ppm)

Test your tank (test 1)
then dose 1ml of your phosphate solution
wait an hour and test again (test 2).
The next day test your tank (test 3) at the same time you did "test 2"

"test 2" - "test 1" = ammount increase in tank per ml of solution
"test 2" - "test 3" = estimated daily consumption

Then dose your daily consumption. Your daily consumption will vary due to many factors so just keep a good testing routine and adjust accordingly.


For example I currently dose 0.05ppm three times a day to keep my tank around 0.06ppm with an extra adjustment once a week.

 

[jphilip813]

I would recomend seeing what your tank consumes.

Use the planted tank calculator to make a solution where 1ml = 0.05ppm for your tank.
(your actual solution will end up a little lower like 0.04ppm)

Test your tank (test 1)
then dose 1ml of your phosphate solution
wait an hour and test again (test 2).
The next day test your tank (test 3) at the same time you did "test 2"

"test 2" - "test 1" = ammount increase in tank per ml of solution
"test 2" - "test 3" = estimated daily consumption

Then dose your daily consumption. Your daily consumption will vary due to many factors so just keep a good testing routine and adjust accordingly.


For example I currently dose 0.05ppm three times a day to keep my tank around 0.06ppm with an extra adjustment once a week.

Ok, thanks...I will follow your recommendations

 

[scandinavian reefer]

So brightwell‘s explanation of what MB7 is; is vague and states it promotes the nitrification process, but doesn’t give much else. Personally I think it just contains a carbon source, even though brightwell says it doesn’t, everytime I used it my NO3/PO4 dropped to zero (just like when i played with carbon dosing). PNS probio is a non sulfur bacteria, it a newer company and there isn’t much anecdotal info on their products that i know of. It’s promotional video didn't really sell me on it Lol.

Okey I see well then I might go with biodigest then as beneficial bacteria.

It may be time to start dosing an alkalinity supplement, for your situation I would recommend saturated Kalkwasser, its easy to use, has a long track record of working well, and I would bet you could use the ph boost.

I am dosing alk I’m dosing the ATI essential pro undiluted 2 part it keeps my tank at a dkh of 8,7-9 wich is where I want it.
Now I have thought about kalkwaser and it seems to be really good and good for the ph boost of course. But if I’m going to dose kalkwasser don’t I need to dose like a lot ? Or is it possible to dose it through my apex dose? Now according to my apex my ph has never dropped below 8 wich is cool since I live in a apartment and have 2 dogs a wife and a kid. At night it’s usually 8.14-8.13 and at day time it usually goes up to 8.23. Would like though to have it at a stable 8.3.

If you want to put the Nero on your back wall but are concerned about the magnet you can always put the outside magnet in a plastic bag before putting it in the water.

Thinking outside the box here I like the idea

 

[Koigula]

I’ve been reefing since we’ll before T5s were even a thing, and phosphates have always been something that were tested for and were a concern. The tanks and species that people are keeping today we’re not possible 20 years ago, part of that is a better understanding of nutrient import/export, part of it is better equipment. But not testing and ‘simplicity’ isn’t a solution. That said, my tank is very basic, just flow, lighting, skimmer, and refugium, the same setup I’ve always run. The difference, IMO, isn’t necessarily ‘simplicity’, it’s the move from live rock to dry rock. These huge disparities between nitrates and phosphates (being high in one and not the other) was really uncommon years ago.

I would argue little to no progress has been made in keeping SPS tanks in last 10 to 20 years other than the cost and expense, and diversity in collection. I do not mean that in an etirely negative way but over filtration over analysis is a concern. I kinda hate LEDs and gave up on them. Dinoflaggelates were far less common. RTN is still unknown.

Do not not take me literally as I do test and have reasonable ranges but also do not fuss if anything is a bit off other than alkalinity. Doing test consistently instead of accurately is best we can still do without spending a ton.

Here is my old tank I rescape from 2+ year old reef saver rock. It has a Mike Paletta blue in middle. I treated that as canary in coal mine when observing the tank.

 

[fushi]

Okey I see well then I might go with biodigest then as beneficial bacteria.

I am dosing alk I’m dosing the ATI essential pro undiluted 2 part it keeps my tank at a dkh of 8,7-9 wich is where I want it.
Now I have thought about kalkwaser and it seems to be really good and good for the ph boost of course. But if I’m going to dose kalkwasser don’t I need to dose like a lot ? Or is it possible to dose it through my apex dose? Now according to my apex my ph has never dropped below 8 wich is cool since I live in a apartment and have 2 dogs a wife and a kid. At night it’s usually 8.14-8.13 and at day time it usually goes up to 8.23. Would like though to have it at a stable 8.3.

Thinking outside the box here I like the idea

In that case don't fix what ain't broken. I read "alk of 4.8" and thought that was a good indicator to dose lol

You can dose saturated kalkwasser through a Apex dose, but if ATI is working I would stick with that.

 

[scandinavian reefer]

In that case don't fix what ain't broken. I read "alk of 4.8" and thought that was a good indicator to dose lol

You can dose saturated kalkwasser through a Apex dose, but if ATI is working I would stick with that.

Yea, what I meant was when I mixed a fresh bucket of new salt for water change (tropic Marin pro reef salt) wich I’m using I took a alkalinity test on that mix and to my surprise the test showed a dkh of 4.8 wich is strange thought their salt was around 8 dkh or something but 4.8?! That’s just doesn’t feel right.

I will stick with the ATI for the moment seems to work well.

 

[jphilip813]

Yea, what I meant was when I mixed a fresh bucket of new salt for water change (tropic Marin pro reef salt) wich I’m using I took a alkalinity test on that mix and to my surprise the test showed a dkh of 4.8 wich is strange thought their salt was around 8 dkh or something but 4.8?! That’s just doesn’t feel right.

I will stick with the ATI for the moment seems to work well.

I think their salt (PRO) is at 7...I use that same salt as well for weekly water changes.

 

[fushi]

Yea, what I meant was when I mixed a fresh bucket of new salt for water change (tropic Marin pro reef salt) wich I’m using I took a alkalinity test on that mix and to my surprise the test showed a dkh of 4.8 wich is strange thought their salt was around 8 dkh or something but 4.8?! That’s just doesn’t feel right.

I will stick with the ATI for the moment seems to work well.

Just as a heads up there has been a lot of reports of problems with TM pro salt, if you search it on r2r im sure you could find out more.

 

[scandinavian reefer]

Just as a heads up there has been a lot of reports of problems with TM pro salt, if you search it on r2r im sure you could find out more.

Okey though the salt was very good since BRS use it and heard a lot of good things about it.
any recommendations on a very good salt ?

 

[scandinavian reefer]

This might been answered before but will raising my phosphates (by dosing) automatically make my nitrates to drop??

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

This might been answered before but will raising my phosphates (by dosing) automatically make my nitrates to drop??

No.

It will only accelerate nitrate consumption if the phosphate has been so low that it is limiting the growth of something that uses nitrate. If you add phosphate and reduce that limitation, nitrate may decline.

 

[skyrne_isk]

No.

It will only accelerate nitrate consumption if the phosphate has been so low that it is limiting the growth of something that uses nitrate. If you add phosphate and reduce that limitation, nitrate may decline.

I’ve been reefing a long time, but only recently came around to comprehending and utilizing advice like this. In the past, I was much more likely to turn to Rowaphas or lanthanum chloride or other phosphate absorbent materials on my tanks that would have high phosphates - probably because I feed pellets primarily. This was fairly common for me and I would say mixed (and expensive) results at best in knocking down phosphate.

But over the last year or so I have dosed low amounts of potassium nitrate, and it is staggering how low phosphate will go when dosing nitrate in a nitrate limited tank - the Redfield ratio is a very real thing. I tested at .02 on Hannah ULR last night. It’s usually between .04 and .10.

You have the opposite problem, but so long as you have biological activity via live rock or (probably even better) macroalgae of some sort, you will likely have great success reducing nitrate by adding phosphate.

The other thing to be aware of is what food you typically use. If composed excessively on either end of the nitrate/phosphate spectrum you’ll probably be in a position of dosing the other to keep your export of both going.

 

[fushi]

Okey though the salt was very good since BRS use it and heard a lot of good things about it.
any recommendations on a very good salt ?

BRS is in sales, they do provide some good information but their product recomendations have a large conflict of interest, especially when certain companies sponser their "studies".

Brightwell
red sea
Fritz
Instant Ocean

Are all very popular, I believe salt has very good margins allowing more money for marketing, so just be aware of that.