High nitrates need help.

[chris124]

MY nitrates are about 30 ppm now. They where off the charts due to over feeding. My tank is a 75 gallons with sump. I have a reef octopus space saver protein skimmer also. I put some mangrove plants in the sump last week to see if it would help. I have one yellow tang one fox face and two chromis left after the fish kill. I lost my puffer and two clowns it makes me sick to think about it. I;am doing a 20% water change once week to try to bring them down two 20ppm or below but its a slow process. Any ideas would be nice. Thanks.

 

[Pete polyp]

30ppm for fish only should be no problem for you. You're on the right track and really the only thing that will help is time. I would continue to do water changes if you wish. A ball of cheato would also help reduce excessive nutrients.

 

[chris124]

Thanks. I still want to get them down to 20ppm or below.

 

[Reefing Madness]

If you rdoing WC once a week, you could up that to doing 25% every other day until you have them down.
Or
Run Pellets
Or
Carbon Dose (aka Vodka Dose)
Or
Wait til your mangroves mature a bit. And throw in some macro algae to the mix to help out.
Or
Make an Algae Turf Scrubber

 

[prsnlty]

If you rdoing WC once a week, you could up that to doing 25% every other day until you have them down.
Or
Run Pellets
Or
Carbon Dose (aka Vodka Dose)
Or
Wait til your mangroves mature a bit. And throw in some macro algae to the mix to help out.
Or
Make an Algae Turf Scrubber

+1 to all of the above!

I ran pellets when I couldn't get nitrates down and had hair algae due to phosphates. The bio pellets did the trick. Nitrates where gone in no time plus so was the phosphates and hair algae.

 

[Pete polyp]

+1 to all of the above!

I ran pellets when I couldn't get nitrates down and had hair algae due to phosphates. The bio pellets did the trick. Nitrates where gone in no time plus so was the phosphates and hair algae.

Yep, that would work

 

[chris124]

Thanks for the info. I will keep doing the water changes. What equipment is needed to vodka dose other than a good skimmer and have any of you tired it? Iam just a little nervous about putting vodka in the tank.

 

[prsnlty]

Thanks for the info. I will keep doing the water changes. What equipment is needed to vodka dose other than a good skimmer and have any of you tired it? Iam just a little nervous about putting vodka in the tank.

It is a little tricky but there is a sticky on it in the forums here. If you want to try something a little simpler, safer, try bio pellets. You will need a reactor, I use a simple tlf phosban reactor with an mj1200 power head, bio pellets and microbactor 7. For me, this was the cheapest method other than vodka.

Jackie

 

[chris124]

It is a little tricky but there is a sticky on it in the forums here. If you want to try something a little simpler, safer, try bio pellets. You will need a reactor, I use a simple tlf phosban reactor with an mj1200 power head, bio pellets and microbactor 7. For me, this was the cheapest method other than vodka.

Jackie

Cool thanks.

 

[Pete polyp]

If you want to go the carbon dosing route (vodka, vinegar, pellets) then I would do some searches here on vodka dosing and carbon dosing to gather as much information as you can. It will have long term effects on the tank and be something you will have to do for a long time (several months) there's nothing wrong with this method, its quite effective. But on the other hand, time will fix the issue as well. If you watched your feeding and promote better husbandry, more than likely in a month our two the nitrate will not be an issue any longer.

 

[Reefing Madness]

I still vodka dose. 12mls in the am and 12mls in the pm, on a 240g tank. Ya just need cheapnno flavored vodka and a childs medicine syringe.

 

[Jon Warner]

If you want to go the carbon dosing route (vodka, vinegar, pellets) then I would do some searches here on vodka dosing and carbon dosing to gather as much information as you can. It will have long term effects on the tank and be something you will have to do for a long time (several months) there's nothing wrong with this method, its quite effective. But on the other hand, time will fix the issue as well. If you watched your feeding and promote better husbandry, more than likely in a month our two the nitrate will not be an issue any longer.

Not a major correction but to clarify, "BioPellets" are not "Carbon Dosing". Carbon dosing is the process of adding a soluble Carbon source to the aquarium. "BioPellets" are insoluble and don't work by releasing Carbon into the water stream. "BioPellets" are consumed by bacteria inside of a reactor.

 

[Pete polyp]

The pellet is a carbon source for the bacteria to colonize and then breaks away due to the tumbling so it can be skimmed. Its the same thing as using vodka or vinegar, its just in pellet form and does not have to be dosed daily. It takes a while for the pellets to be consumed by the bacteria and eventually need replacement.

 

[CastAway]

At the root of every single ppm of Nitrate is the same thing, waste. Be it uneaten food, dead matter, decaying fish, or fish poop, the nitrogen cycle doesn’t change – Ammonia to Nitrite to Nitrate.

Personally, and I may be just flat out wrong and misinformed on this, but I do not think mangroves are a large consumer of Nitrate. In my own personal opinion, I think a fast growing Caulerpa or Chaeto drastically outperform it. It’s easily trimmed and discarded to truly get NO3 out of the system altogether.

Same old answers - don’t overfeed, do frequent water changes and use a harvestable macro algae.

If there’s no acceptable balance in those measure, i.e. numbers you can live with, then supplement with dosing or pellets. When dosing or using pellets, it’s the protein skimmer that ultimately harvests the excess nitrate, bound in the bacteria removed from the water column. So, a very effective skimmer is a must.

 

[Pete polyp]

At the root of every single ppm of Nitrate is the same thing, waste. Be it uneaten food, dead matter, decaying fish, or fish poop, the nitrogen cycle doesn’t change – Ammonia to Nitrite to Nitrate.

Personally, and I may be just flat out wrong and misinformed on this, but I do not think mangroves are a large consumer of Nitrate. In my own personal opinion, I think a fast growing Caulerpa or Chaeto drastically outperform it. It’s easily trimmed and discarded to truly get NO3 out of the system altogether.

Same old answers - don’t overfeed, do frequent water changes and use a harvestable macro algae.

If there’s no acceptable balance in those measure, i.e. numbers you can live with, then supplement with dosing or pellets. When dosing or using pellets, it’s the protein skimmer that ultimately harvests the excess nitrate, bound in the bacteria removed from the water column. So, a very effective skimmer is a must.

Very well said

 

[Jon Warner]

The pellet is a carbon source for the bacteria to colonize and then breaks away due to the tumbling so it can be skimmed. Its the same thing as using vodka or vinegar, its just in pellet form and does not have to be dosed daily. It takes a while for the pellets to be consumed by the bacteria and eventually need replacement.

Not true.

During the US Patent authoring and application process for ecoBAK I researched this extensively. The polymer doesn't "break away", that's silly. What "breaks away" is the bacterial biomass growing on the surface of the pellet. Without getting too deeply into this, the bacteria have a biochemical process for consuming the bio-polymer... the bacteria produce proteins internally that decompose the bio-polymer and the individual components are pulled into the bacteria through the cell wall via osmosis or active transport.

BP reactors dislodge bacterial biomass from the surface of the pellets, this can be either:

1) Skimmed Out

2) Settled Out

3) Consumed by bacterioplanktonic feeders

 

[b_rad_G]

NP Biopellets Filter Media

reducing BioPellets are composed of biologically degradable polymers that can be placed in a fluidized filter or filter canister. The pellets will allow aerobic growth of bacteria which consequently will consume nitrate and phosphate simultaneously. The bacteria will use up the carbon from the BioPellets, whilst nitrogen and phosphorus are taken from the water as nitrate and (ortho)phosphate. This conversion of organic BioPellets (together with inorganic nitrogen and phosphorus) into microbial biomass is called immobilization. In addition, anaerobic layers will develop, resulting in additional denitrification.

The surplus of bacteria will be consumed by filter and suspension feeding organisms such as sponges and corals, or skimmed off by a protein skimmer. On average this “solid wodka method” takes 2-4 weeks to give rise to sufficient bacteria to allow nitrate and phosphate levels to drop. The main advantage of this method over using Wodka or sugar as a carbon source is that NP-reducing BioPellets stimulate local growth of bacteria in a filter compartment, instead of all over in the aquarium where they may clog up pipes and hoses. They also prevent the growth of cyanobacteria, as the bacteria growing on NP-reducing BioPellets will compete with these phototrophic nuisance microbes. Finally, NP-reducing BioPellets will save the aquarist a lot of time, as no daily dosages of carbon are required.

 

[Pete polyp]

Not true.

During the US Patent authoring and application process for ecoBAK I researched this extensively. The polymer doesn't "break away", that's silly. What "breaks away" is the bacterial biomass growing on the surface of the pellet. Without getting too deeply into this, the bacteria have a biochemical process for consuming the bio-polymer... the bacteria produce proteins internally that decompose the bio-polymer and the individual components are pulled into the bacteria through the cell wall via osmosis or active transport.

BP reactors dislodge bacterial biomass from the surface of the pellets, this can be either:

1) Skimmed Out

2) Settled Out

3) Consumed by bacterioplanktonic feeders

This is exactly what I said, or meant. The bacteria breaks away from the pellet due to tumbling. The bacteria also consumes the polymer so it eventually has to be replaced. Its just another carbon source for the exact same bacteria to consume like with vodka and vinegar.

 

[Eckolancer]

So how long before you will no longer need to dose mb7 to the tank with pellets?

 

[Pete polyp]

So how long before you will no longer need to dose mb7 to the tank with pellets?

Its not necessary to dose mb7 when using pellets. They're going to take a few weeks for them to take effect. I think purple use the mb7 in those first weeks to feel like they're accomplishing something. I'm not saying the product is bunk, or trying to disprove anything. All I'm saying is that its not necessary to use when starting pellets.