How much head height?

[Uncle99]

I need to pump from my sump, up 10ft to the return of my 180 gallon. It’s straight up, no turns.
I have a Jebao DCQ 10000lph (2650 Gph) 80 watt return pump which has a max head height of 18 feet.

Can anyone indicate if my return pump will be sufficient to move my water with a reasonable flow rate?
Or is it too small?

 

[ludnix]

I couldn't find a flow chart for your pump but the similarly rated vectra would be about 800gph at 10', I'm not sure what kind of turn over rate your looking for but I think that would be adequate for most sump setups. The flow through the sump doesn't need to incredibly fast so as long it's not your only source of flow in the tank I think it would work.

 

[Uncle99]

Thank you for taking the time to help me.
I agree, it may be a bit slow, but I think it’s ok as I have two gyres to help the internal flow as well.

Cheers!

 

[dbowman5]

DC's are not known for their ability to overcome head. the comparable Syncra would deliver 1000 gph at that height
supposing a couple of 90's to get into the tank

 

[Bret]

I have that same pump and was surprised by the reduction in flow from my plumbing. Depending on how much turnover you are looking for, you may be ok though. Definitely use large diameter plumbing (1.25"+).
Also, there should be a flow chart on the side of the box.

 

[Uncle99]

I have that same pump and was surprised by the reduction in flow from my plumbing. Depending on how much turnover you are looking for, you may be ok though. Definitely use large diameter plumbing (1.25"+).
Also, there should be a flow chart on the side of the box.

Thanks for your response. A chart would be helpful, maybe online.
My return is only 3/4”.......just going to return this pump and get the DCT, which is 4000gph to a max head of 20ft......I like to have about 1000gph up 10 feet from sump

Doesn’t increasing pipe diameter lower head?

 

[radsdad]

A larger pipe will give you less friction loss, thus increasing pump head slightly.

 

[Bret]

Thanks for your response. A chart would be helpful, maybe online.
My return is only 3/4”.......just going to return this pump and get the DCT, which is 4000gph to a max head of 20ft......I like to have about 1000gph up 10 feet from sump

Doesn’t increasing pipe diameter lower head?

I would be very surprised if you got 1000gph out of a 3/4" pipe on that pump, that is a huge restriction. I would try and switch to larger diameter pipe if you can, even if its not for the whole run.

 

[92Miata]

Thanks for your response. A chart would be helpful, maybe online.
My return is only 3/4”.......just going to return this pump and get the DCT, which is 4000gph to a max head of 20ft......I like to have about 1000gph up 10 feet from sump

Doesn’t increasing pipe diameter lower head?

Getting a bigger pump isn't going to help you much. You're just going to have higher head losses due to increased velocity.

You need to run bigger pipe.

 

[dbowman5]

I would be very surprised if you got 1000gph out of a 3/4" pipe on that pump, that is a huge restriction. I would try and switch to larger diameter pipe if you can, even if its not for the whole run.

i have the Hydor Seltz D varia 2400 ac pump and am using a 11/4 " return with a 9' head. i get a lot of flow. i agree that 3/4" pipe might limit your flow look at this link: #1 FlexPVC®.com Water Flow Charts Based on Pipe Size (GPM/GPH) ie, How much water can flow through Sch 40 Pvc Pipe Size 1/2" 3/4" 1" 1.5" 2" 2.5" 3" 4" 6"

 

[Uncle99]

I would be very surprised if you got 1000gph out of a 3/4" pipe on that pump, that is a huge restriction. I would try and switch to larger diameter pipe if you can, even if its not for the whole run.

So you guys are saying the return of 3/4” is a large barrier to flow especially in a vertical 12 foot run.

So, instead of using 3/4”, I should use 1” or even 1-1/4” From the return pump and this will allow more flow, is that correct?

I can easily do this through the entire run except where the pre-installed return is 3/4”. (About 2’)
I am understanding correctly?

Would appreciate any further advice or just a note that I am understanding.

 

[Uncle99]

I have that same pump and was surprised by the reduction in flow from my plumbing. Depending on how much turnover you are looking for, you may be ok though. Definitely use large diameter plumbing (1.25"+).
Also, there should be a flow chart on the side of the box.

The chart says for 12’ head (3.6m) the flow would be about 800gph, which is 5 times turnover, BUT, it doesn’t say based on what pipe diameter. I’d like to get that up to at least 1000.

Since you have this pump, it makes sense to me to follow your advice, especially since I know completely nothing when it comes to sump pump returns.

What I can do is use 1-1/4” diameter return line from the pump, up 10’, but the last 2’ has to stay 3/4” because the return is pre-installed from the bottom of the tank to where the water comes out.

Does this make sense?
Am I understanding you correctly?

Thanks for helping me out......

 

[dbowman5]

I understand your wish to use the 3/4" going into the tank. what if you mocked up the pump and some 1 1/4 " pipe to the height you need and end with 3/4 and check the flow. then remove the 3/4 and elbow out with 1 1/4" and compare use two brutes and see how long it takes to move 25 gallons from one to the other. i would consider going over the top with the return good luck

 

[Uncle99]

I understand your wish to use the 3/4" going into the tank. what if you mocked up the pump and some 1 1/4 " pipe to the height you need and end with 3/4 and check the flow. then remove the 3/4 and elbow out with 1 1/4" and compare use two brutes and see how long it takes to move 25 gallons from one to the other. i would consider going over the top with the return good luck

Now that is an excellent idea, actually both are solid.
Test the flow before piping the flow, yup, super idea,
Thank you!

 

[Bret]

The chart says for 12’ head (3.6m) the flow would be about 800gph, which is 5 times turnover, BUT, it doesn’t say based on what pipe diameter. I’d like to get that up to at least 1000.

Since you have this pump, it makes sense to me to follow your advice, especially since I know completely nothing when it comes to sump pump returns.

What I can do is use 1-1/4” diameter return line from the pump, up 10’, but the last 2’ has to stay 3/4” because the return is pre-installed from the bottom of the tank to where the water comes out.

Does this make sense?
Am I understanding you correctly?

Thanks for helping me out......

You got it.
The first 10’ at 1.25” should get you where you need to be.

 

[KStatefan]

The chart says for 12’ head (3.6m) the flow would be about 800gph, which is 5 times turnover, BUT, it doesn’t say based on what pipe diameter. I’d like to get that up to at least 1000.

The head on the pump chart is not based on pipe size. It is just telling you that at 12' or 5.2 psi the pump would flow 800 gph. That could be 12 feet of 1.5" pipe straight up or 25 feet of 3/4" horizontal.

 

[Uncle99]

The head on the pump chart is not based on pipe size. It is just telling you that at 12' or 5.2 psi the pump would flow 800 gph. That could be 12 feet of 1.5" pipe straight up or 25 feet of 3/4" horizontal.

Man, too me, sump pumps, seem really hard to size.
My understanding was as long as your vertical height (assuming it’s straight) was lower than head height by approx 50%, you could expect that flow would be reduced by 2/3’s, or 66%. Appears that’s wrong.

I see these guys on YouTube with basement sumps and tons of piping, fittings, gates, and exit points and they are using DC pumps, so they can wind down flow. Wind down?

I guess the only way to really “know” is for me to attach 12 feet of different sized pipe, drop the thing in the pool and plug her in.

I’m thinking just watching the flow coming out should give me a reasonable idea if it will be sufficient, it’s only for sump so I’m really only looking for 5-7 times turn in a 180, so say 900gph to 1100gph.

If not, I going to plumb both this pump and a Jebao 18000 and I gotta get some flow.

Thanks for educating me on what is turning out to be a pain....

 

[Uncle99]

You got it.
The first 10’ at 1.25” should get you where you need to be.

Thanks my friend.
In a few days, I will drop it in the pool with 10’ of 1.25” and 2’ of 3/4” and plug her in.
Let’s see what comes out the top.
Glad all you guys came to the rescue, as I would have just plumbed it, and had to rip it out.

 

[KStatefan]

I think there are a number of people who think they have way more flow then they actually do.

 

[Uncle99]

So I completed the “test” of the Jebao DCQ 10000, using an exact copy of the return.
We measured the output volume five times, then took the average.
The pump pushes 960gph, up 10’ through the return in my 180g (5.3 Turnover)
Thanks to the members for their great help.