How to increase color intensity and definition.

[mtraylor]

Thank you very much for your answer.

Understood. just a little frag.

Even though I'm sure you are right about this tenuis...


What a wonderful WD you have. For me it's just day dreaming...in Spain that corals just don't arrive.

I'm interested in your lighting scheme

Apart from using leds, you use a UV bulb ?


Have never heard of them

Sorry for the ignorance!! Thank you again for the reply!

Thank you. I run GHL Mitras over my aquarium. I have 5-GHL Mitras 6300's over my 255 gallon aquarium.

When I was reffering to UV. I"m running a UV sterilizer on the aquarium. I change out the bulb about every 10 to 12 months. I hadn't noticed till I hooked up the new bulb that half the bulb was not working before I changed it out. Onced I changed the UV sterilizer bulb out, the water got allot clearer in the aquarium thus allowing more light to penetrate the aquarium.

 

[mannyhernz]

Very nice specimen.. can i ask where you acquired it?
But on the color question..poster above is right.. take a small frag and try different placement and find what par makes it happy-er. You might have correct water parameters but not giving it enough par to make it pop.

 

[Da8]

This is the tenius I took the pic at same time this morning. I think its very similar to yours. I will see if I have a old pic before it got washed out.

It's similar. But seems to have better color than mine!!


Please try and find .

I'm saving the bravery to cut three frags and place them in different places to prove the theory.

 

[Da8]

Thank you. I run GHL Mitras over my aquarium. I have 5-GHL Mitras 6300's over my 255 gallon aquarium.

When I was reffering to UV. I"m running a UV sterilizer on the aquarium. I change out the bulb about every 10 to 12 months. I hadn't noticed till I hooked up the new bulb that half the bulb was not working before I changed it out. Onced I changed the UV sterilizer bulb out, the water got allot clearer in the aquarium thus allowing more light to penetrate the aquarium.

Yes, that is another thing. Don't you use active carbon to filter the water ?? It's true that UV makes water extra clear!!! And yes that can make lighting more effective.

I'm just running carbon because even though I believe UV sterilizers are great but the fact that kill both good and bad doesn't convince me much.

Very nice specimen.. can i ask where you acquired it?
But on the color question..poster above is right.. take a small frag and try different placement and find what par makes it happy-er. You might have correct water parameters but not giving it enough par to make it pop.

Bought it on a shop here in Spain.

Just a random tenuis.

Yes. Must frag it and start with the different light positions.

Thank you very much for your reply.

 

[Rogergolf66]

Well to me everyone missed the most import factor for color. Lighting everyone got but no one mentioned flow. About 5 years ago I was talking with jason fox about colors and water parameters and he said to we u asked the right questing. Everyone else ask what light I use he said. He said water quality number 1 but the one that most everyone misses is flow. Flow for sps is more important then lighting he said. Brs and wwc just confirmed the flow thing in there most reagent videos if u haven't seem thrm.I would also look to get your nitrates to never be undetectable again. Small doses of food grade sodium nitrate like .5ppm a day and then check nitrate like u check alk to make sure it's in line

 

[Da8]

Well to me everyone missed the most import factor for color. Lighting everyone got but no one mentioned flow. About 5 years ago I was talking with jason fox about colors and water parameters and he said to we u asked the right questing. Everyone else ask what light I use he said. He said water quality number 1 but the one that most everyone misses is flow. Flow for sps is more important then lighting he said. Brs and wwc just confirmed the flow thing in there most reagent videos if u haven't seem thrm.I would also look to get your nitrates to never be undetectable again. Small doses of food grade sodium nitrate like .5ppm a day and then check nitrate like u check alk to make sure it's in line

You are right.

But I gave it for granted that we all know that strong flow is a must.

Yes, I've got very strong flow, specially on that side. So I don't think is that.

About nitrates, again, for me is very important not to have undetectable levels.

I was about to start dosing nitrate but instead increased nutrition and now with 1/2 of N im almost happy.


Do you have links to the videos mentioned?


Thanks for your contribution

 

[justingraham]

What’s “strong” flow?

As what I consider strong and what u consider strong can be drastically different

Also I wouldn’t be messing with ur lighting esp leds without a par meter or some way of measuring light ur previous settings were working I would leave that alone

 

[jda]

I don't find flow to be a huge deal in color. Sure, you need a competent amount (which is usually a lot in a SPS tank), but more is not super important. I think that it is pretty easy to get here in a SPS tank and most of the people who see beneficial things by increasing flow were way too low to begin with. I just have a wavebox and a pair of 6105s on my 240G and that is enough. I do think that random is more important than static - flow pumps are better than a single gyre alone in this aspect. If your polyps are constantly moving, then you are OK.

Lighting is the thing for me. Put some more T5s on there, or switch to some Metal Halides if you want the best of best color - Radion can get you to 80-85% (without the tricks), but they cannot get you as far as other lights can. Did you see a boost when you added the T5s? If so, then more will boost even more. For people who want the best-of-the-best acropora color, they add a few T5s to their LEDs, see the difference... then add more... see more of a difference... then they wonder why they are even have LED in the first place and either go all T5s or just go to MH. Most add back in some LED strips for when they want the trick lighting (reefbrite and now Orphek). I know that my opinion about this trend makes a lot of people mad, but it is how I feel and very much true when people get to a higher level of recognition and desire - most people never get there. The people who make this transition never look back and some have even PM'd me to apologize for clowning me for posting stuff like this.

Increasing nitrogen and phosphorous can give you richer and deeper colors, but the brightness and contrast suffer. Either are cool. To each their own on which they like. Some people have a strong preference on which one that they like. For me, very low residual numbers (test kit) but very high throughput with high import (feeding) and high export is where I like to be.

 

[justingraham]

I don't find flow to be a huge deal in color. Sure, you need a competent amount (which is usually a lot in a SPS tank), but more is not super important. I think that it is pretty easy to get here in a SPS tank and most of the people who see beneficial things by increasing flow were way too low to begin with. I just have a wavebox and a pair of 6105s on my 240G and that is enough. I do think that random is more important than static - flow pumps are better than a single gyre alone in this aspect. If your polyps are constantly moving, then you are OK.

Lighting is the thing for me. Put some more T5s on there, or switch to some Metal Halides if you want the best of best color - Radion can get you to 80-85% (without the tricks), but they cannot get you as far as other lights can. Did you see a boost when you added the T5s? If so, then more will boost even more. For people who want the best-of-the-best acropora color, they add a few T5s to their LEDs, see the difference... then add more... see more of a difference... then they wonder why they are even have LED in the first place and either go all T5s or just go to MH. Most add back in some LED strips for when they want the trick lighting (reefbrite and now Orphek). I know that my opinion about this trend makes a lot of people mad, but it is how I feel and very much true when people get to a higher level of recognition and desire - most people never get there. The people who make this transition never look back and some have even PM'd me to apologize for clowning me for posting stuff like this.

Increasing nitrogen and phosphorous can give you richer and deeper colors, but the brightness and contrast suffer. Either are cool. To each their own on which they like. Some people have a strong preference on which one that they like. For me, very low residual numbers (test kit) but very high throughput with high import (feeding) and high export is where I like to be.

The brs series with WWC would disagree with your flow statement

Wwc claims their colors are better in the tanks with more flow and looks ok in the mixed reef with sand because they can not turn up the flow

Everything is the same lighting wise in all three tanks the only difference is the flow

 

[jda]

This was one of my main points. In both of those cases, the "low flow" that the have is incompetent. You cannot just have a return pump and maybe a single MP40 that fizzles out over 2 feet. Unfortunately, nobody can really measure flow from a video or on a forum post. I don't really want to get into WWC and their colors again... this ticks people off too when I talk about it (I guess that this is just a post where I make people mad)... but I have been in their shop about 6 times over the last few years and I would not be very happy if I had their colors... they do VERY WELL for a retail store. High end hobbyists can do better than high end stores and it is not even close... just look to WWC, Vivid, Jason Fox, etc. to learn a few things, but pay attention to the high end hobbyists if you want the nicest tank possible.

I have just a Tunze Wavebox and a pair of 6105s on a 240G tank. I challenge anybody to find better color and growth than what I have. This is not a lot of flow compared to some... but it is competent.

 

[justingraham]

This was one of my main points. In both of those cases, the "low flow" that the have is incompetent. You cannot just have a return pump and maybe a single MP40 that fizzles out over 2 feet. Unfortunately, nobody can really measure flow from a video or on a forum post. I don't really want to get into WWC and their colors again... this ****** people off too when I talk about it (I guess that this is just a post where I make people mad)... but I have been in their shop about 6 times over the last few years and I would not be very happy if I had their colors... they do VERY WELL for a retail store. High end hobbyists can do better than high end stores and it is not even close... just look to WWC, Vivid, Jason Fox, etc. to learn a few things, but pay attention to the high end hobbyists if you want the nicest tank possible.

I have just a Tunze Wavebox and a pair of 6105s on a 240G tank. I challenge anybody to find better color and growth than what I have. This is not a lot of flow compared to some... but it is competent.

Yea we’re just going to disagree
2 MP60’s and 5 MP40’s on a five foot tank is low flow.

Yes hobbyist are better then retailers but to disregard facts is crazy if u have been to wwc six times in the last few years and only think they have one mp40 on their mixed reef well I can see why people get mad at u because u are only seeing what u want to see. Have u been to there farm? Seen the two tank in the back? I’m not saying they have the best of the best color wise but i wouldn’t mind having my tank look like that.

And then to ad to my point have you seen the video by Dana riddle where he measured the flow and the Corals grew faster and had a better color with more flow? As with more flow you could ad more light

A majority of the best retailers claim after proper water quality the most important thing is flow. But what would they know am I right they have one MP40 and a trickle out of the return pump

So I’ll ask you this when u buy a coral and it gets held up for an extra day and it does not make it to you alive what was the reasoning?

Obviously it’s the lack of light that killed the Corals during transport.

 

[jda]

I did not say that WWC or any vendor had only one mp40 and a return pump... just that in general is probably not competent for an SPS tank yet can be fine on other types of systems. I am sorry that you misread this.

Again, I do not care very much what a retailer says or does. Nobody should too much unless they factor in EVERY SINGLE thing that they do and not just cherry pick one thing like flow or lighting. I listen to it and process it, but do not take it for gospel or offer it as a solution to people without a bunch of caveats. They have different goals than me. The turn and burn paradigm and farming are different than growing a reef in my home. What does a good hobbyist say? Does Copps or Ed or JB blast so much flow that their sand cannot stay put? Nope. Do they have better tanks than WWC or Jason Fox? Depends... yes, for a hobbyist, but they would not be able to do what Jason Fox or WWC do on a daily basis and would have to change it up to farm or do retail.

There is so much more at work here when you are talking about a retailer vs a hobbyist. Do people forget that Jason Fox changes a massive amount of water quite frequently? ...is it like 50% a week? Is this not a factor? Just deciding to change 50% water a week and thinking that you can be like Jason Fox is just as unrealistic as thinking that his amount of flow is all that matters. Some of these retailers do not dose two-part, run a CaRx or do any kind of calcium and carbonate supplementing since they are constantly adding in fresh saltwater to replace water that goes out the door in bags.

I did see the Riddle exercise. Almost no flow vs a competent amount... my point exactly.

We probably are not disagreeing that much at all. Competent water flow for SPS is no small amount. However, I have far less than 2 mp60s and 5 mp40s on my larger tank and I do not know how I could have much better results. Are there any high-end hobbyist examples that you would like to share where massive amounts of flow have better results than just a competent amount of flow? I have seen a few, but I have also seen many that show the opposite.

BTW - if anybody is any good at keeping acropora and other SPS, your flow will not be the same in 6, 12 or 24 months... as the stuff grows, the flow gets weaker and the type of flow starts to matter. If you have a wide-body flow pump (like MPs), they they tend to flow around stuff where as the more pointed and directional pumps can still get into and inbetween the corals. Wavebox can also get in-between every branch of every colony all at the same time. This is not a huge deal with frags and mini colonies, but with actual colonies the type pump matters.

 

[Graffiti Spot]

Flow contributes to the health of the coral, which then allows the colors the coral can produce dependant on lighting and nutrients. Everything is linked together. Nothing is more important than the other. But some things are closer linked to coral colors than others. I would say nutrients and lighting are the top two.
I don't even bother reading most of the stuff that comes from a place who profits from talking about certain points.

 

[Da8]

What a cool conversation.

Yes. What's enough flow? You don't have certainty until you increase it and discover you could have more ...


I think you all are right.
As Jda says, a lot of flow is needed for a sps tank. And that amount of flow progressively is reduced with growth.

Light is key. I never wanted to go out my t5 but led was the solution for my cubic aquarium. Adding some t5 was marvelous.

Nutrients are needed. I'm sure. They are very valuable for many of the process required.

More over. Nobody talks about feeding the acropora, or at least all the environment that surrounds them and therefor feeds the directly.

Another critical point is the par needed and usable by each animal. Knowing it's needs makes easier making the most of them.

And that's my main problem with that tenuis. I'm sure as they said, it needs less light to get better coloration.

Thank you all for your contributions. Is nice to hear your opinions and valuable experience .

 

[Da8]

And what about polip coloration ??


Al my polips are or white/brown

 

[markalot]

I can't add much but you might want to try blue+ or a blue+, Coral+ combo for the t5's. With my setup, which is way different from yours, I had pleasing results in a few stubborn acros by only using blue+ for the t5's and bumping up those dirty white LED's a bit to compensate visually. Spectrum can make a difference ... but who the heck knows exactly what change will do it? I'm only 2 months into the lighting change so I can't say for sure if all results will end up positive.

 

[Velcro]

2 MP60’s and 5 MP40’s on a five foot tank is low flow.

This is the most absurd statement I've seen in a while. Maybe if the tank is 10 feet wide? lol. Or are you saying that JDA said that much flow is low? He didn't if that's what you are getting at.