How to increase probability of keeping two yellow tangs together

sghera64

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I recently did an experiment in my 125 display tank. Initially, the tank contained 1 yellow tang and 1 Kole tang. Both had established themselves nicely, without aggression towards any other fish. The yellow tang had been in the tang for over 1 year before the Kole tang was added. From the start, they ignored each other. That's normal from what I understand.

About 6 months after that, I wanted to add another yellow tang. I know that given my current condition, adding a second yellow tang was almost certainly inviting a fight to the death.

I added the second yellow and they began to spar and fight after about an hour. This continued for about 24 hrs. The second tang looked pretty bad the second day with torn dorsal and tail fins. The original tang did not seem to have any wounds.

I immediately inserted some egg-crate to divide the tang roughly into half. This remained in place for about 6 weeks. The two tangs would make aggressive moves towards each other, but clearly could not reach each other. Eventually, the new tang found a nice hiding spot on the left side of the tank (see video) behind the clam and beneath the rock. The two fish often came to the egg-crate to eat at the algae that was there. Sometimes they would eat and ignore each other. Sometimes they would "mirror" each other. Sometimes they would accelerate back and forth pacing each other (aggression).

After 6 weeks, I created a gap between the egg-crate and the back wall. You can see in the video (attached) that fish easily passed back and forth. On three separate occasions, I found the original tang crossing over from the right side to the left side. But, when the new tang spotted him and started to swim towards him, the original tang shot back over to his side of the divider (right side). This was the case for about another 10 days. Then, I removed the divider completely.

With the divider removed, the two left each other alone for an hour. Then they started to chase each other. The original tang chased the new tang into his newly established home. The new tang then aggressively defended it. After about 3-6 days, the chasing and sparing completely stopped.

You can see in the second half of the video they are getting along just fine now.

I believe that given time, the new tang found his new home and considered his. With the divider removed, the original tang attempted to "reclaim" or test the new domain. Ultimately, they worked it out that each has their space that they will defend aggressively and the other has space that each might want to challenge. In summary, it appears that each tang has committed to one space and will "test' the other. Commitment yields high and winning aggression while "testing and investigating" produce weak force, defensiveness and retreat.

This experiment tells me that this technique might not be a guaranteed way of introducing a second yellow tang after a first has been established without one killing the other, but it may be a way to increase the probability of success.

 
Thanks for the write up -- but what I don't understand is why? It sounds like a tang got pretty beat up, and I don't understand why. This is not likely to work for most people. If it does, it's very likely to be temporary...

I've kept lots of zebrasoma together but never just two unless they're different species and mixed amongst many other tangs, to spread aggression. Always added simultaneously.

It seems that nearly every tang rule was broken here and a fish suffered for it? Why try it again, or encourage others to do the same?

I'm sorry if I'm coming off as a Debbie downer I just don't understand.

To anyone curious about tang aggression, here's an article I wrote on the matter:

https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/tang-aggression-understanding-and-combating.76/
 
Thanks for the write up -- but what I don't understand is why? It sounds like a tang got pretty beat up, and I don't understand why. This is not likely to work for most people. If it does, it's very likely to be temporary...

I've kept lots of zebrasoma together but never just two unless they're different species and mixed amongst many other tangs, to spread aggression. Always added simultaneously.

It seems that nearly every tang rule was broken here and a fish suffered for it? Why try it again, or encourage others to do the same?

I'm sorry if I'm coming off as a Debbie downer I just don't understand.

To anyone curious about tang aggression, here's an article I wrote on the matter:

https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/tang-aggression-understanding-and-combating.76/


I agree with the perception that this experiment challenges (breaks) a lot of established patterns of observed zebrasoma cohabitation. All of your other points are valid as far as I feel too.

The reason I bought a second yellow tang is a pervasive one and one that I predict will persist so long as there are yellow tangs available to buy and large tanks in people's homes. I both wanted two yellow tangs and hoped it would turn out okay. At first it did not turn out okay. The experiment was not planned a priori. I was compelled to do it to buy myself time. My back-up plan was to return the fish to a store or another hobbiest. But, as I observed the two separated by the egg-crate, I saw several behavior changes. The "gap phase" of the experiment was more telling.

Before I did this experiment people all over the world were ignoring sage advice and putting two together to "test the waters" - - just like me. They will continue. Some (like me) will surf the net before they do to see if there is a way to make it work. Once I realized this worked for me, I decided it is better to share this result instead of leaving everyone out on this new information. It is only 1 sample (n = 1). If others repeat (for better or worse), please post your observations.

Why might this have worked:
  1. Dumb luck - but they did not get along initially.
  2. The divider gave the second tang a chance to establish his habitat while the first "let go" and moved on never attempting to reclaim the entire tank again.
    1. This is where individual results might vary. My first tang might have a short memory, or is humble enough to "let go". If others tangs are more stubborn, this result might not repeat in that case.
I'm no "fish whisperer". Just formulating and sharing a hypothesis because I want to know why too. That's why I titled this thread like I did. I don't believe this is a 100% fix for the old problem. Probably not even a 90% fix. We will need more data and thus others will have to share their results.
 
So it has been about 9 months since I did the experiment with an eggcrate divider to acclimate two yellow tangs into the same 135 gallon display tank.

The divider has been absent for about 8 months now without issues. I thought I would do a follow up so others can learn about the longer term result. Attaching a short representative video of them as well.

 
One thing on tangs especially yellows. Keep them in odd numbers. . 1,3,5 and so forth.
 
One thing on tangs especially yellows. Keep them in odd numbers. . 1,3,5 and so forth.

Sooooooooooo. . . I have two yellow now. . . Which means I get to tell my wife that you are advising me to buy one more to make it an odd number, right (wink-wink)?

I do have that Kole tang. I’m a little concerned about having 4 rather large fish in this 135 gallon tank that has only the front open for long swims. There is quite a bit of rock on the right side.

And adding another yellow at this time, hmmmm. Would that new one be set up for being ganged up on by TWO established yellows?
 
Sooooooooooo. . . I have two yellow now. . . Which means I get to tell my wife that you are advising me to buy one more to make it an odd number, right (wink-wink)?

I do have that Kole tang. I’m a little concerned about having 4 rather large fish in this 135 gallon tank that has only the front open for long swims. There is quite a bit of rock on the right side.

And adding another yellow at this time, hmmmm. Would that new one be set up for being ganged up on by TWO established yellows?

Absolutely Yes or there will be a major In-tank war with a german U-boat and torpedos. IF YOU'RE STILL MARRIED AFTER THIS STORY, we need to get a beer !
 
So what’s the secret to keeping two tangs and a sailfin together
Any genus of tangs, you want to go with odd numbers. 1 -3 - 5 and so forth. I have 5 in one tank

660g tangs 7.3.jpg
 
So

2 yellow
1 sailfin
1 scopas

would be deadly
wouldnt be deadly but expect short term squabbling.
If the yellows are the issue , If you have a mirror place against tank and yellows should become preoccupied with the reflected image rather than tank mates
 
I purchased the sailfin , and yellow tang for 18 bucks each from a local reefer he was moving.

i already have one yellow , so i was going to see how it would work out..
How much ??? WOW
 
150 gallon
That may work for a while. Long-term, the sailfin will likely outgrow the tank and the yellows may not tolerate each other. Great long term home for a yellow and some other large fish though.
 

IF YOU HAD TO TAKE A REEFING EXAM, WOULD YOU PASS?

  • Yes!

    Votes: 32 45.7%
  • Not yet, but I have one that I want to buy in mind!

    Votes: 9 12.9%
  • No.

    Votes: 26 37.1%
  • Other (please explain).

    Votes: 3 4.3%
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