Hyposalinity for prazi resistant flukes?

[SaltwaterGuruNeeded]

Just to clarify - that is the hyposalinity regimen for ich, that is lower than what is needed for Neobenedenia, and is more stressful. If you are battling both issues, then of course do that, but for Neo only, it is gentler on the fish to go with half salinity.
Jay

Ok then maybe I'll run half salinity 1.020, for treating any flukes that survived prazipro and I'll add copper for anything that may be on them like velvet or ich that I can't see just to be sure. And hopefully at half salinity I won't have much of a pH problem but I'll get some buffer just to be safe.

 

[SaltwaterGuruNeeded]

Here's the buffer I bought...

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Ok then maybe I'll run half salinity 1.020, for treating any flukes that survived prazipro and I'll add copper for anything that may be on them like velvet or ich that I can't see just to be sure. And hopefully at half salinity I won't have much of a pH problem but I'll get some buffer just to be safe.

Sorry - lets check numbers: full strength seawater has a specific gravity of 1.025. Half salinity is 1.0125, not 1.020

Jay

 

[SaltwaterGuruNeeded]

Update:
Managed to get my quarantine from 1.026 SG to 1.020 today.

Still waiting on ammonia badge, copper power, and cheap thermometer in the mail...ofc they run late...

Will not lower past 1.020 until I get my reef buffer to maintain pH, which it's saying will come on sept 8th . Fish seem to be doing well.

I have also since raised my Display tank temperature to 82 Degrees Fahrenheit to have more of a chance to have success in wiping out protozoans such as marine ich which the clowns had in the beginning but never showed up again, or velvet,ect. Which I suspect is possible that it may have killed my tang.

I am aware that hyposalinity is a bad treatment for velvet, which is why I want to add copper power and do hyposalinity at the same time. The hyposalinity is for my suspected prazi resistant flukes and the copper power would be for any ich and possible velvet.

My goal is to bring my salinity down to 1.011 and dose copper power at the same time for I think 30 days, bit will probably do 35 if I can.

Here is a pic of my 10g quarantine with 2 clowns and 1 sleeper Banded Goby. Qt tank set at 78 degrees.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Update:
Managed to get my quarantine from 1.026 SG to 1.020 today.

Still waiting on ammonia badge, copper power, and cheap thermometer in the mail...ofc they run late...

Will not lower past 1.020 until I get my reef buffer to maintain pH, which it's saying will come on sept 8th . Fish seem to be doing well.

I have also since raised my Display tank temperature to 82 Degrees Fahrenheit to have more of a chance to have success in wiping out protozoans such as marine ich which the clowns had in the beginning but never showed up again, or velvet,ect. Which I suspect is possible that it may have killed my tang.

I am aware that hyposalinity is a bad treatment for velvet, which is why I want to add copper power and do hyposalinity at the same time. The hyposalinity is for my suspected prazi resistant flukes and the copper power would be for any ich and possible velvet.

My goal is to bring my salinity down to 1.011 and dose copper power at the same time for I think 30 days, bit will probably do 35 if I can.

Here is a pic of my 10g quarantine with 2 clowns and 1 sleeper Banded Goby. Qt tank set at 78 degrees.

I normally avoid using hypo and copper at the same time, so I don’t have a very robust data set as to if these stressful treatments will act synergistically or not….proceed carefully.

Jay

 

[SaltwaterGuruNeeded]

I normally avoid using hypo and copper at the same time, so I don’t have a very robust data set as to if these stressful treatments will act synergistically or not….proceed carefully.

Jay

Ok, Well If I fail, at least we'll be able to learn what not to do. But let's hope things go ok.

 

[Miami Reef]

DO NOT use copper and hypo. You’ll kill your fish! Choose whether you want to treat for ich or flukes first.

The toxicity of most metals such as cadmium, chromium, copper, mercury, nickel, and zinc was reported to increase with decreasing salinity.

Source: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7576155

 

[SaltwaterGuruNeeded]

DO NOT use copper and hypo. You’ll kill your fish! Choose whether you want to treat for ich or flukes first.


Source: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/7576155

Thanks for the info! I guess I'll do hypo first and then copper. Just hoping I don't have any velvet in the meantime!

 

[Miami Reef]

Thanks for the info! I guess I'll do hypo first and then copper. Just hoping I don't have any velvet in the meantime!

Marine Velvet will be suppressed during hypo. However, if you suspect your fish has velvet, I’d highly encourage treating with copper first. Flukes rarely kill fish, but velvet on the other hand…

 

[SaltwaterGuruNeeded]

Marine Velvet will be suppressed during hypo. However, if you suspect your fish has velvet, I’d highly encourage treating with copper first. Flukes rarely kill fish.

Think I can dose copper at 1.020 SG?

 

[Miami Reef]

Think I can dose copper at 1.020 SG?

Can I ask why your salinity will be at 1.020? That salinity will have no effect on any parasites. I think the possible benefit of adding relief from parasites (unlikely) doesn’t outway the possible effects of copper and lower salinity.

I personally think 1.020 will be fine with copper, but there isn’t evidence nor studies that say how much more toxic copper would be at that salinity.

I just don’t see if the juice is worth the squeeze.

Also, did you say you dosed prazi in your DT?

 

[SaltwaterGuruNeeded]

Can I ask why your salinity will be at 1.020? That salinity will have no effect on any parasites.

Also, did you say you dosed prazi in your DT?

I dropped my SG from 1.026 to 1.020 today in qt, my goal for hypo was 1.011. I'm just asking if I need to raise it before copper.

And yes I dosed prazipro in display 4x.

 

[Miami Reef]

I dropped my SG from 1.026 to 1.020 today in qt, my goal for hypo was 1.011. I'm just asking if I need to raise it before copper.

And yes I dosed prazipro in display 4x.

I’d feel more comfortable with a higher salinity.

Also, I doubt that you actually have prazi resistant flukes. The more probable likelihood is that the bacteria in your DT is degrading the medications before the prazipro can have the effect on the flukes. It’s a real problem and the main reason why I sterile my QT ever 2-3 batches.

 

[SaltwaterGuruNeeded]

I’d feel more comfortable with a higher salinity.

Also, I doubt that you actually have prazi resistant flukes. The more probable likelihood is that the bacteria in your DT is degrading the medications before the prazipro can have the effect on the flukes. It’s a real problem and the main reason why I sterile my QT ever 2-3 batches.

Maybe...But I should treat copper first because I had a tang die like a week ago, and it had fast breathing for 2 days and then died. Didn't see any powder on it but it was off colored. I'm also nervous because I can't get the goby's tail and eyes clear ever since I got him. The eyes have a haze on them and so does his tail fin. Eating well though.

 

[Miami Reef]

Maybe...But I should treat copper first because I had a tang die like a week ago, and it had fast breathing for 2 days and then died. Didn't see any powder on it but it was off colored. I'm also nervous because I can't get the goby's tail and eyes clear ever since I got him. The eyes have a haze on them and so does his tail fin. Eating well though.

Sounds like a bacterial infection for the cloudy eyes and fin rot. Food soak selcon (fish vitamins) and it will clear up. The fish’s immune system can fight most bacterial infections. In the event that it’s spreading rapidly and gram negative: antibiotics should be used.

I don’t believe you should use antibiotics now. It’s a mild case. Antibiotics work by slowing the bacteria spread so the fish’s immune system can fight them off. So far it appears the fish has control over it.

Is your tank empty from all fish?

 

[SaltwaterGuruNeeded]

Sounds like a bacterial infection for the cloudy eyes and fin rot. Food soak selcon (fish vitamins) and it will clear up. The fish’s immune system can fight most bacterial infections. In the event that it’s spreading rapidly and gram negative: antibiotics should be used.

I don’t believe you should waste time with antibiotics in your case. It’s a mild case.

Is your tank empty from all fish?

Yes, display has no fish in it. I have been using selcon for about 2 months now. No change. Not spreading rapidly, been the same for almost 2 months.

 

[Miami Reef]

Yes, display has no fish in it. I have been using selcon for about 2 months now. No change. Not spreading rapidly, been the same for almost 2 months.

2 months?!

Question: How did you know that you have prazi resistant flukes? Did you do any freshwater baths to diagnose the flukes?

Second: I want you to know that eye flukes are a thing. It will make the fish’s eye cloudy. I’m going to find a resource with pictures right now.

 

[Miami Reef]

Here’s step 1: Raise your Display tank temperature at 81F and mark 45 days later from when you removed all fish. That is the day you can add back all the fish.

We are going to come up with a treatment plan now. I need pictures of the goby.

Also answer how you learned you still had flukes.

 

[SaltwaterGuruNeeded]

2 months?!

Question: How did you know that you have prazi resistant flukes? Did you do any freshwater baths to diagnose the flukes?

Second: I want you to know that eye flukes are a thing. It will make the fish’s eye cloudy. I’m going to find a resource with pictures right now.

Well, I tried skin scrapes, fw dips, prazipro, even dosed Kanaplex in display thinking it might be a bacterial infection. On the fw dips little specks came off but looked at them under microscope and didn't see anything. I posted pics of things I found but no avail. Then I thought maybe they are gill flukes, can't see em and hard to get a sample so there's that.

 

[SaltwaterGuruNeeded]

Here’s step 1: Raise your Display tank temperature at 81F and mark 45 days later from when you removed all fish. That is the day you can add back all the fish.

We are going to come up with a treatment plan now. I need pictures of the goby.

Also answer how you learned you still had flukes.

Ok display is set at 82 degrees.