I Want Opinions on DOA Guarantee - Long Post

Isoprene

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Part 1:
What are your feelings on DOA guarantees, 1 hour, 5 hours, 1 day, in the bag photos etc.?

I personally feel if it arrives in good condition the responsibility of the corals health resides on the buyer. So pictures in bag are required for replacement in some form (part 2).

Im curious to what you all think about this, but more importantly, why?

Part 2:

All goes as unplanned. The corals arrive dead, the vendor is responsible. The customer has already paid. The vendor agrees to compensate the buyer, but how? What as a customer do you want in return if they show up dead? This part comes with an example.

ex)

Completely Theoretical (aka THIS DID NOT HAPPEN)
A vendor sells a customer a 2 '' encrusted purple monster frag for $XX. It shows up white as a ghost, dead, but from sale photos its obviously the same coral, shipping was the cause.

Vendor agrees to compensate but can not provide another 2'' frag for about 6 months (purple monster, unless huge is tough to even cut a frag this big, let alone 2, to replace one if it dies in shipment).

The vendor agrees to offer $XX in store credit (vendor credit or whatever you want to call it) in corals as long as the customer pays shipping costs for the second shipment and does not receive credit for the initial shipping cost.

Fair or unfair?

...more importantly I want to know why, what reasoning do you have for being understanding, paying the shipping costs and picking new corals, or being angry, demanding money back, new frag etc?

I want explanations if you feel like it. I know a lot of variables play into this, like vendors packing, heat packs, cold packs, cooler etc...try to think broad scope.

I want customer and vendor perspectives taking into account this theoretical situation that the customer and vendor agree it was shipped correctly, but it died for some reason (this happens, but not often).

Sorry for the length of this post but I have been wondering this for some time on how to setup my DOA guarantee policy when selling on FB and forums. I see a wide variety of policies from vendors and I just want a few outside perspectives before I set it in stone. Thank you if you respond to this novel of a post. Also btw I have not lost a shipment of coral like this, just trying to prepare for the unfortunate downfalls of this hobby when shipping delicate animals such as sps.

AGAIN THIS IS INFORMATIVE ONLY I AM NOT STARTING DRAMA OR REFERENCING ANY SITUATION OR PERSONS I HAVE EVER DEALT WITH OR HAVE HEARD OR READ STORIES ABOUT.

Thank you.
 
I had a situation that came up that was similar. I offer 2hr pic in the bag DOA (which seems standard). Well anyways, the significant other of the reefer signed for the box and then put the coral in the tank. It didn't ship well is my assumption, because when the reefer got home later that night, he said it was bleached white. So the best solution I came to was to offer another frag to the buyer - but they would need to wait a couple months since I had to cut it and want it to grow a little on the plug. The buyer was good with this solution. They understood the DOA policy, which was a nice thing. Had the buyer gone on to berate me about refunding, etc, I wouldn't have done anything. Being understanding helped in this case, and I don't want anyone to end up with nothing, especially some of the higher priced frags. He is happy, I'm happy that he will get a frag of what he paid for, and all is well.

I am covering shipping as well, because it's the right thing to do. I'm not a business (and never will be), but I want to take care of anyone that buys from me as much as possible. Because it isn't about the money. I'm just gonna buy more coral anyways, so I will forego a couple pieces and cover shipping. No biggie.

Just my two cents. Not quite the same situation, but similar.
 
I think a day is preferable but at least an hour or 2. I don't like the in the bag part for DOA that most people put because I have gotten orders before where everything is alive but as soon as its in the tank it just melts. I know its the coral and not me because the other corals in the order will be fine as will the corals in my tank. As far as refunds go, I think it should be a refund and not a store credit. Giving store credit is not really fair because it locks you into having to buy from that vendor again, even if you do not want to or want to get the same coral from somewhere that still has it in stock.
 
I would say your answer should reflect the level of value you want to be refered to as a company.

I.e. You order from a retailer - your order shows up broken and not working??
You now have to eat shipping - pay for shipping back and they cover the return for the 2nd time shipping back to you. Leaving you paying double shipping on a broken item. I call that crappy business. I was sent the exact piece of still non working equipment they simply said they fixed. With the same option to get fixed the 2nd time as the 1st.

Now think a reputable company - one you would most order from again as when there was a prob they get you the label for return on them to be fixed and sent back out to you no charge as that is how the scenerio should have played out in the beginning.
You making purchase paying for shipping and getting in the end what you payed for.

Granted I would put this with receiving a dead white coral in the bag on arrival. I know im talking equipment here instead of corals but its the examples I was after
 
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Keep em' coming! I am loving the responses and ronnie, your situation, response, and explanation make a whole lot of sense. Thanks. Shep, I never really took that into account, I have had a melter look perfect in the bag, survive the mild dip and go into the tank and insta-tissue necrosis on me and have been mildly upset but just chalked it up to a finicky coral species/colony. This feedback is what i'm looking for, thanks guys. Keep it coming.
 
I think there are some issues with photo of DOA in bag. This is a recent experience I had with a DOA. Received an order of about 8 frags. Mostly mushrooms/rics/zoas and an acan. One of the mushrooms was a very nicely colored rhodactis which was really the reason I had initiated the order and then just filled it out with other stuff. Looking into the bag, the coral looked ok, but after opening the bag and placing into the acclimation container I could tell there was an issue and that the foot was compromised. It was still not "dead" and doubt I could have photoed the foot effectively. I continued with the acclimation. The coral was slime the next morning, took a picture of that. Everything else from the shipment acclimated fine.

I contacted the vendor to let them know and their response was basically ... yeah... I'll try to work something out on your next order.

Also in this order was an acan which I like... but is nothing like the acan that was supposed to be in the order, and I know these are notorious for morphing, but should at least START representative of what was pictured. There was another mushroom that was sent that is different than ordered, sent a rhodactis and ordered was a discosoma species.. although both were green.

So now I have a DOA and 2 corals that are completely different than what was ordered. I would be ok with a vendor credit so that they would have another opportunity to recover the situation. But I don't feel like I should pay shipping for the guest recovery effort. It is really a guest recovery issue at that point. If the customer pays for shipping >>I'm<< the one paying for the guest recovery.

The saying "Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice..." comes to mind. Why would I pay for the guest recovery? That makes no sense. So I won't be doing business with that vendor again. no thank you.

Had they offered store credit and cover the shipping I would give them another opportunity to win my loyalty. And really, with the experiences I have had lately, I will be relying mostly if not all on those vendors who have offered great customer service, representative photos and ethical policies.
 
I have a question on DOA. Been eyeing some corals on eBay from reputable sellers and one said they have a 72 hour after you receive it DOA policy. You have to take a picture of the coral still in the bag for a full refund.

The way I understand that is you have to leave the coral in the bag for 72 hours after you receive it or you won't get a refund?
 
If your post was sincere, which im just going to assume it is :) no that means you have to get them pictures within that time frame of the corals when they arrived still inside of the bags they were shipped in. Just trying to see the condition they arrived in to judge hopefully and not conclude if they are liable or not. Word of advice, be careful with ebay. I have not personally ordered coral myself. But i have heard horror stories of dead skeletons arriving and sellers vanishing. Not posting to discourage you, just be sure to do your background research on the seller prior to making a live animal purchase!
 
If your post was sincere, which im just going to assume it is :) no that means you have to get them pictures within that time frame of the corals when they arrived still inside of the bags they were shipped in. Just trying to see the condition they arrived in to judge hopefully and not conclude if they are liable or not. Word of advice, be careful with ebay. I have not personally ordered coral myself. But i have heard horror stories of dead skeletons arriving and sellers vanishing. Not posting to discourage you, just be sure to do your background research on the seller prior to making a live animal purchase!


Haha. Yes it was sincere. Just kinda confused me. I haven't dealt with shipping corals. In the past I always bought locally. I'm probably not going to bid on any of them but I probably wouldn't buy from a individual on there just selling one or two. The ones I was looking at have a feedback rating in the thousands. I'd really rather just buy from someone on here.
 
I recently had an order of corals delivered to my office. It was raining. The box was soaked and one side about to break . UPS gave box to one of my employees, said it was wet from rain and high stepped away. Clearly there was a leak. We got box open , one of the bags was empty of water but damp. It had a nice 3.5 inch maricultured pocillapora. We open another coral bag , and added the damp coral, then acclimated. Coral was fine. Point being some coral can ship fine with no water in bag. They are pretty hardy.
Establish a relationship with a good dealer, they will take care of you. If a dealer is questionable , buy somewhere else.
 
In response to part one,I prefer the same day DOA policy.When I am busy with a large order the last thing I want to worry about is taking pictures of dead corals and uploading photos.
For compensation I would personally prefer a refund from a company as I don't order corals that often.Maybe I would opt for store credit if a bonus of some sort was offered.When ordering from a hobbyist,I would be more open to credits or replacements.Especially for a reputable person. Going halfies on shipping to receive a replacement coral (I really want,even a month later)might work for me.
I would not expect to be given credit for the initial shipping,unless a large percentage of the order was lost.
 
I recently ordered several expensive fish. From a seller on a forum who ships fish a lot. Fed ex dropped box off and box was wet.they said that's how they received it. When I opened it I had empty bags with dead fish in them. I took pics and the person immediately refunded my money including shipping. I didn't even ask him to. I was so impressed by this I ordered the same fish again and got them fine the next time and have since ordered all my fish from him and will continue to do so.
I personally am a business man, and my business practice has always been the customer is always right.
If I sell something no matter what it is or what service it may be I alway stand behind it 100% if you do this you will build an amazing reputation and word of mouth advertising is the absolute best. So if you have to spend some of your profits to make other buyers happy then so be it. It will pay off in the end guaranteed.
Just my opinion. Great thread!!!
 
My Opinion, on how I would prefer to be treated when buying any Coral.

1st - I don't think 1 day is to much to ask, however in the bag can be.
You can receive a coral that looks perfectly healthy in the bag, but when you have taken it out and examined it even further you could have damage or bleaching that could not otherwise be seen. A person that loses the coral after dipping or placing it in their tank, within the 1 day limit should be reimbursed a full refund of the coral, not shipping, as long as they have a photo of the coral dying off. I work in a place that the motto is document, document, document. That is what you should require.

2nd - I think you should give the consumer choices, Credit, Coral replacement, or Refund. Don't limit the customer and make them feel like their back is in a corner. If they choose Credit or Coral replacement offer them complimentary shipping on the next order. As was stated before, spending some of your profits to make a customer happy will pay off in the end. Another thing to remember is that ever buyer has friends in the hobby, and they will spread the reputation of your business to others.
 

IF YOU HAD TO TAKE A REEFING EXAM, WOULD YOU PASS?

  • Yes!

    Votes: 32 45.7%
  • Not yet, but I have one that I want to buy in mind!

    Votes: 9 12.9%
  • No.

    Votes: 26 37.1%
  • Other (please explain).

    Votes: 3 4.3%
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