ICH, despite my efforts

[Mundeez]

First, I want to thank @Humblefish and @melypr1985 for all their great information regarding quarantine.... if it wasn't for the Reef2Reef community and all of their help I would have dumped sick fish immediately into my DT without a second thought. Fortunately though, before I purchased my first tangs (Purple and Hippo) I set up a quarantine system. Currently, these two tangs have been in QT for the last four weeks. During the first two weeks, they were treated with Prazi Pro. Once that was done, about two weeks ago, I started copper treatment with copper safe. I've made absolutely sure that copper levels were within therapeutic range, even during water changes. Today however, I noticed that my Hippo is now covered in white spots, and I fear she is suffering from ICH.

I'm so glad that they didn't go directly into my DT, because they sure "looked" healthy during the month I've had them. I will admit that I almost caved a couple times and had to stop myself from taking them out of quarantine early because they looked so good! Again, that is a testament to the great information provided by @Humblefish and @melypr1985.

My question now is, where do i go from here? Now that the white spots have manifested themselves, does that start the timer all over? Is it normal for a fish that DID have ICH, and has been in QT the whole time to show these spots...as part of the ICH life cycle? Is the fish simply shedding the nasties?

My Seachem Ammonia badge is registering zero. They're BOTH still eating like hogs...i feed them Rod's food every day and give them Nori five or six times a week.

 

[Mundeez]

 

[Brew12]

This is very unusual. If you are at therapeutic levels of copper you really shouldn't see any symptoms after around 7 days.

What test kit are you using with your coppersafe?

My initial thoughts go one of two ways. Either you haven't actually been at therapeutic levels of copper or it isn't Ich.

If there is a strain of Ich out there than can infest a fish after 2 weeks in therapeutic levels of copper that would be devastating.

 

[Humblefish]

If there is a strain of Ich out there than can infest a fish after 2 weeks in therapeutic levels of copper that would be devastating.

This is the second instance recently of something like this happening: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/ich-that-isnt-ich.303048/page-3#post-3759547

@Mundeez Two questions:

1. Did you do one or two rounds of Prazipro? If two, how far apart were the dosages?
2. What is your current copper level in the QT and how long has it been above 1.5ppm?

 

[4FordFamily]

I have to assume it's something faulty somewhere.

@Humblefish we need to see if both of these people are using the same copper and same test kits.

Hopefully we don't have a crazy new strain here.. I think it's unlikely but that would be awful..

 

[Humblefish]

We need to see if both of these people are using the same copper and same test kits.

@Mundeez see above ^^

 

[immafishguy]

@Mundeez, are the spots on your blue tang like mine? Super small and kinda powdery looking... or are they raised pustules?

 

[Mundeez]

This is the second instance recently of something like this happening: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/ich-that-isnt-ich.303048/page-3#post-3759547

@Mundeez Two questions:

1. Did you do one or two rounds of Prazipro? If two, how far apart were the dosages?
2. What is your current copper level in the QT and how long has it been above 1.5ppm?

Yes I did two rounds of Parazi Pro that were about 3 to 4 days apart. I'm using Fritz Mardel Coppersafe, testing with API test kit. See this morning's results of that test, it appears well above 1.5 to me. This morning when i checked on her she's out scratching on the PVC pipes [emoji37] [emoji27]

 

[Humblefish]

Yes I did two rounds of Parazi Pro that were about 3 to 4 days apart.

You redosed too soon. You typically need to wait 5-7 days so you can time it just right to kill any hatchlings.

 

[Mundeez]

You redosed too soon. You typically need to wait 5-7 days so you can time it just right to kill any hatchlings.

I'm confused then, what does the Prazi Pro treatment have to do with the ICH outbreak?

 

[Humblefish]

I'm confused then, what does the Prazi Pro treatment have to do with the ICH outbreak?

I'm speculating that your fish may still have flukes, because they are sometimes visible on dark colored fish (photos below).

 

[Mundeez]

I'm speculating that your fish may still have flukes, because they are sometimes visible on dark colored fish (photos below).

Gotcha, so I'll do a freshwater dip to verify. Should i put a spec of copper in the freshwater just in case it's not flukes... So i don't break the copper cycle?

 

[Humblefish]

Gotcha, so I'll do a freshwater dip to verify. Should i put a spec of copper in the freshwater just in case it's not flukes... So i don't break the copper cycle?

No, even if a trophont were to drop off during the FW dip, it could not complete it's lifecycle and reattach in just 5 mins.

 

[Mundeez]

No, even if a trophont were to drop off during the FW dip, it could not complete it's lifecycle and reattach in just 5 mins.

Ok, i just gave her a 5 minute freshwater dip and there were no flukes present...So it looks like I'm not getting off that easy. What should i do next?

 

[Humblefish]

Ok, i just gave her a 5 minute freshwater dip and there were no flukes present...So it looks like I'm not getting off that easy. What should i do next?

I would continue copper treatment for 2 more weeks (so, 4 weeks total) and we'll reevaluate their condition then.

 

[melypr1985]

I would continue copper treatment for 2 more weeks (so, 4 weeks total) and we'll reevaluate their condition then.

Agreed. This sure is frustrating though! I hate seeing this happen to two different people.

 

[4FordFamily]

I would continue copper treatment for 2 more weeks (so, 4 weeks total) and we'll reevaluate their condition then.

X3. Sorry for the trouble, this is definitely not common

 

[Mundeez]

I would continue copper treatment for 2 more weeks (so, 4 weeks total) and we'll reevaluate their condition then.

Should i keep using the same brand I've been using? Or try another type? She is miserable in there[emoji27]

 

[Triggreef]

Why not abandon the copper and switch to ttm? Be done in 12 days. After the 12 days put them in observation to be sure it's not velvet your dealing with.

<-- not a copper fan. Too much work, too much room for error.

 

[ngoodermuth]

Have we ruled out brook here? Is two weeks too long for it to present itself?