Ich or Velvet Need QT Advice

[Eagle_Steve]

Not sure which right now as I am not at home, but specks of white on a few fish. Long story short. Wifes friend had a small nano tank, tore it down as her clown jumped out and died, there was a small chromis left that needed a home. Wife brought chromis home, acclimated it and put it in my 110 with all the other fish while I was at work. Was praying all would be well, but today my Clown Tang and the chromis have white specks. I think my wife has learned her lesson after the phone call we had when she called to ask why they had sand all over them. (I was nice but brought up the money to be lost if all went wrong)

Now the emergency part. I have a 40 breeder, marineland 350 HOB (no bio wheels), sponges (small) in my sump that have been there for 6 months now, heater, light, cover and a powerhead. I also have a lot of copper left over and a hanna from when first stocking the big tank.

I know i need an ammonia alert badge, gonna get some biospira just cause, and more sponges since all I have are small ones, but need to know I am not missing anything. I live quite a ways from town, not sure if its ich or velvet so they are getting started tonight, and if velvet will be getting copper up quickly.

I also need some help with the fish load. Will the 40b be enough for the below list?

They will be in there for 12 weeks while the 110 sits fathom. Well some may get moved to my untainted 45 AIO after 30 days to ease the load if needed. I have no issue with having 50 gallons of pre mixed water with copper in it as I have a spare plastic drum I can use to make water change water with the correct level of copper for when a water change is made.

All help is appreciated.

Sizes below may be listed slightly larger then the fish actually are.
Male clown (2 inches)
Female clown (2.5 inches)
Firefish (2.5 inch)
Firefish (2.5 inch)
Firefish (2.5 inch)
Chromis (1 inch) (aka the culprit)
Mandarin male (3 inches) Eats marine cuisine and I can get pods if needed
Mandarin female (2 inches) Eats marine cuisine and I can get pods if needed
Scooter blenny (2 inches) Eats marine cuisine and I can get pods if needed
Tailspot blenny (2 inches)
Clown Tang (3 inches)
Starry Blenny (3 inches)

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Also to note, all fish have already been through a QT previously with copper so I know they can handle at least a 7 day ramp up. One question I forgot was do I do a FW dip to aid in relief as well a lighten the load of actual nasties going into the QT. Never had to do an emergency set up before thanks to this forum for that. Missed out on a lot of the noob mistakes lol.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Bout to leave work, anyone got any input?

 

[Ubergroover]

Bout to leave work, anyone got any input?

Look into a diatom filter......I have eradicated most every parasitic disease using one. Biggest underestimated tool a reefer can have. If the disease suspends in the water colum the diatom filter is your best bet. Most people scoff.

 

[4FordFamily]

I think you’ll be crowded but fine assuming you can keep ammonia at bay. That’s going to be the challenge. Fritz turbostart 9000 is better than BioSpira but both are good. You may require large water changes to keep everything functioning without ammonia.

If you can swing it, a 55 gal would be more comfortable, however.

 

[HotRocks]

Bout to leave work, anyone got any input?

I would skip the diatom. Sounds like you are on the right track. You have the Hanna checker and copper so you can accurately monitor the Cu level.

You will want to ramp up faster than 7 days if you are dealing with velvet. 48 hours is recommend timeframe to be to the therapuetic level.

Diatom filter may allow you to successfully manage parasites by killing most free swimmers. This will likely not completely erradicate ich.
Using one to control velvet spells disaster.
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/ich-eradication-vs-ich-management.188775/

 

[4FordFamily]

I would skip the diatom. Sounds like you are on the right track. You have the Hanna checker and copper so you can accurately monitor the Cu level.

You will want to ramp up faster than 7 days if you are dealing with velvet. 48 hours is recommend timeframe to be to the therapuetic level.

Diatom filter may allow you to successfully manage parasites by killing most free swimmers. This will likely not completely erradicate ich.
Using one to control velvet spells disaster.
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/ich-eradication-vs-ich-management.188775/

I couldn’t agree more. I think diatom filters are useful if cleaned regularly (which I would not) and assuming velvet doesn’t take over. UV sterilizers are another great tool for managing parasites.

The problem though is to decide if you want a bandaid on the issue or surgery. Eventually, the bandaid will fall off. Especially in the water

Just my .02

 

[Eagle_Steve]

So I got everything set up, added 4 big bottles of bio spira and the emergency sponges I had in the sump (actually had 4 large ones in there) and all of the fish are in as well. I am using the 40b and a 29 tall for the qts. Forgot I had a 29 in the garage. As for diatom filter I agree it helps, but I plan to do the 76 days fathom for the 110 and just eradicate it all that way. Once copper is done and fathom is done there shouldn’t be any issues. And only after 76 days will the fish be moved back to the display.

My wife realizes what she did wrong and won’t add another fish again without QT. She was just trying to keep a fish from dying. I get that. And after the hustle to get everything setup and all the help she gave to get it all setup, there will be no grief from me about the mistake. We all make them.

Also it is not velvet. Verified under a microscope to be ich. Thank the good lord for that.

Another good thing is they were moved at feeding time. 2 liter bottle and a Gatorade bottle with the necks cut, necks turned inside the bottle and zip ties holding them together caught all but the tang and mandarins in 5 minutes. Tang swam into the net for a piece of nori and the mandarins were easy to get as they were hunting on the back wall. 10 minutes to get all of the fish. The good lord was surely on my side today. Being as feeding was interrupted and they were hungry I fed them again lightly and not a bit made it to the bottom. They all seem to be happy and swimming around checking things out for now.

Let the 76 day journey to again being disease free start. (Well once I get copper to therapeutic levels then the countdown begins lol)

 

[Picard's Lionfish]

I had to endure a similar situation once. I did TTM and observation., (for all new fish as well). Took me a week and a tank tear down to catch all my fish

How long from the time they were added to the time ich showed up?

 

[Eagle_Steve]

I had to endure a similar situation once. I did TTM and observation., (for all new fish as well). Took me a week and a tank tear down to catch all my fish

How long from the time they were added to the time ich showed up?

3 days on the Chromis and tang. Chromis was only new addition and all fish that were in there prior all had standard QT with copper and prazi before going into display. I am assuming that zero issues before with any fish my DT was sterile and the stress on the Chromis brought it out and as tangs are very suceptable to ich, it showed on it first. No other fish are showing signs, but they are all thick slime coat fish.

Either way I got lucky catching all the fish and my wife is now 110% aware of why I always qt anything new. She is actually going to work from home for the rest of the year to watch the fish and make sure ammonia doesn’t get them. Luckily she has the option to do it, but doesn’t as she likes to socialize at work. So she is definitely taking responsibility and working to ensure all goes well. Mainly as the clowns are hers and they eat from her hand lol. Like little kids to her.

 

[Picard's Lionfish]

Is 3 days enough for the ich to show on your fish?

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Is 3 days enough for the ich to show on your fish?

From everything I have read, it depends on where the life cycle was on the host fish and where it was in the water the host fish came from. 3 days is very possible with how the host fish was introduced. The fish was drip acclimated and then all water was dumped in to DT by wife. Also the fish were not totally covered, well the chromis had more then the tang, but the tang only had 4-5 small specks. Either way, a whole year with no fish showing any signs, all fish went through copper (except the chromis), and all corals are dipped and then Qt'd themselves for 76 days. In short nothing was introduced that could have it, no cross contamination as all tanks have their own equipment, etc. etc. Chromis came from a tank where a fish died from what we have now determined as ich. (Come to find out it was covered with it when it died. Wife didnt know that when she decided to save the chromis). In short the new addition is the logical explanation.

Either way, it is what it is, and all fish are in QT working to therapeutic levels of copper and doing well. At least I still have my shrimps and corals in the big tank to look at lol.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Ok, so in the end I went with a 55 and then 2x 20s for the pod eaters to do ttm in. All fish in copper are up to therapeutic levels and eating well. Mandarins and scooter are eating just hatched baby brine shrimp during their ttm. My clowns did spawn today as well. We will see how that goes, I am going to try and raise the little buggers this time, as I just remove the pipe and set up a 10g for them. I already have rotifiers and other stuff to try this. Worst that happens is they do not make it. They wouldn't make it in the qt anyways due to the flow and HOBs.

Ohh yeah, being as I have no fish in the DT and still had the 40, I decided to get an Atlantic Blue Tang for my DT and a couple clown gobys for my frag tanks (3 tanks, 1 per tank). They are set up in the 40 and are going thru my normal QT process. So far the clown gobies are not fighting and I have a ton of 3/4" pvc elbows in there for them to hide.

The only issue is the HOBs are noisy lol. 55 in the bedroom on a makeshift stand, 40 under the 55, 2x 20s in the office (only 1 setup at a time), and the baby brine setup in the office as well. Fun stuff for sure.

Only good thing out of this, is the wife likes the 55 we have (snagged off of craigslist for little of nothing) and it is going to get setup in the bedroom. It is an acrylic 55 cube (27x27x18), drilled for a ghost overflow (plugged right now with bulkheads and plugs), and it has 3" eurobracing around the perimeter. Fits nicely into an empty corner of our bedroom. Once this is done there will be a new tank build thread for it.