Ich or velvet?

[MnFish1]

My protocol is exactly what has gaven me results now not saying it’ll work a million times but it definitely has worked on both tanks. Crank that UV and FEED FEED FEED I get raw shrimp grind it throw some brine in it to mix with vita-chem feed that two times a day auto feeder pellets 2 times a day and nori two times a day they eat it all up, in about a month I’ll get back to you and see if they managed to over come the ich,

You seem really really abrasive. It, I think, is everyone's opinion that you came here for advice - your response to me was sarcastic - and uncalled for - I asked you what your protocol for Ich management was. that's it.

 

[Lavey29]

I see you got a lot of time, good thing because I do as well. Your asking me to post a picture of my tank for what I don’t know since the topic of this thread isn’t to show off the tank it’s to ID the fishes problem, but if you give me a solid reason then maybe I’ll post a picture just to fulfill your desire. A Redsea reefer 525 DT is a 112 gallon system it’s a complete great all around size for the tangs that I have in there at the moment also is 60” which if you didn’t know its 5ft, not “4 feet wide” here you go again with “assuming”. You mentioned all three of my tanks if you can read correctly I stated “I did have a 350” did is a past tense, which leads me with how many now 2 because 3-1: 2 right? I don’t wonder why my fish “At the time had visible ich” because I know the ich didn’t come from the stress of an undersize tank because it’s clearly not undersized. The ich came from a dominator alpha PT the was showing territorial and picking on new fish which is completely normal when you introduce 1 tang to another before you come w your bs comments yes I would isolate box the tang and add mirror etc that can only do so much, eventually all the ICH was NOT VISIBLE they all overcame the ich and then is called a “ich management reef” which at the time and right now I am completely aware and accept the fact, now with my 1000 also another “ich management reef” all the fishes prior to this had caught ich again due to territorial eventually all fish in the 1000 also beat the ich and was none visible, then I saw a beautiful gold rim which I bought QTed!!!! Knowing those fishes are ich magnets I went ahead, and qted him after I qt him I threw him in again my PT from my 1000 bullied him and here we are. So I was wondering if it was ich or velvet and that’s the moto of this thread again.

I won’t consider myself knowing everything like you stated but I do know a ich management tank is fine w me. Idk what you do for living but I can tell you, you would be one heck of a FWC officer

I see you got a lot of time, good thing because I do as well. Your asking me to post a picture of my tank for what I don’t know since the topic of this thread isn’t to show off the tank it’s to ID the fishes problem, but if you give me a solid reason then maybe I’ll post a picture just to fulfill your desire. A Redsea reefer 525 DT is a 112 gallon system it’s a complete great all around size for the tangs that I have in there at the moment also is 60” which if you didn’t know its 5ft, not “4 feet wide” here you go again with “assuming”. You mentioned all three of my tanks if you can read correctly I stated “I did have a 350” did is a past tense, which leads me with how many now 2 because 3-1: 2 right? I don’t wonder why my fish “At the time had visible ich” because I know the ich didn’t come from the stress of an undersize tank because it’s clearly not undersized. The ich came from a dominator alpha PT the was showing territorial and picking on new fish which is completely normal when you introduce 1 tang to another before you come w your bs comments yes I would isolate box the tang and add mirror etc that can only do so much, eventually all the ICH was NOT VISIBLE they all overcame the ich and then is called a “ich management reef” which at the time and right now I am completely aware and accept the fact, now with my 1000 also another “ich management reef” all the fishes prior to this had caught ich again due to territorial eventually all fish in the 1000 also beat the ich and was none visible, then I saw a beautiful gold rim which I bought QTed!!!! Knowing those fishes are ich magnets I went ahead, and qted him after I qt him I threw him in again my PT from my 1000 bullied him and here we are. So I was wondering if it was ich or velvet and that’s the moto of this thread again.

I won’t consider myself knowing everything like you stated but I do know a ich management tank is fine w me. Idk what you do for living but I can tell you, you would be one heck of a FWC officer

So you are unable to post full tank pictures of your Red Sea 1000 tank? Why am I not surprised. Here you are with at least 12 large fish (per your prior post) stuck in an undersized tank and you have a fish disease problem for what the 3rd time now in 6 months? Sadly your fish will suffer, most will probably die and you will run to the LFS again wallet in hand to stuff your tank again and of course we will see future threads from you describing your troubles and expert "ich management " techniques.

 

[Spare time]

Big believer in nutrition assisted immunity. Been doing that with my boa constrictors past 30 plus years. Kept warm and well fed and they fight off most ailments. Hit them with antibiotics or other medications to solve the problem and some never fully recover because they are constantly getting sick. As if their immune system never got fixed. As a kid I played in dirt and no clue of anti bacterial soap. Natural immunity, within reason. Sometimes no choice but getting doped with meds yet have always been of the mindset that was of last resort.

Ich management makes more sense to me each day knowing I'm likely not going to completely eradicated everything even with strict QT. I'm human and often inpatient. Plus fish can be jerks to new kids.

"likely not going to completely eradicate everything even with strict QT"

So stopping most of fish from getting disease isn't good enough? I don't quite get this statement. It is saying because there is a small chance that something will slip by, might as well do nothing.



A repeated invasion by parasites that they would never encounter to such volume in the wild is not the same as an "ailment."


The immune system isn't as great as people like to make it out to be. The immune system failing is the reason why most living things die outside of predation.

 

[GARRIGA]

"likely not going to completely eradicate everything even with strict QT"

So stopping most of fish from getting disease isn't good enough? I don't quite get this statement. It is saying because there is a small chance that something will slip by, might as well do nothing.



A repeated invasion by parasites that they would never encounter to such volume in the wild is not the same as an "ailment."


The immune system isn't as great as people like to make it out to be. The immune system failing is the reason why most living things die outside of predation.

My opinion based on keeping fish since the 70s and breeding/collecting boa constrictor and other reptiles since the late 80s. I'll take my experience and knowledge gained and apply it. You don't need to follow it and I'm too exhausted to get into another debate because the internet misinterpreted or feels the need to correct me. I'm also just too old for it. Perhaps ask a different way but only after you go back and read what I said again to avoid making outlandish assumptions as fact or putting words in another they never said.

 

[vetteguy53081]

That's not what I'm finding. Where exactly did you get this conclusion and are you speaking of any one item or just in general as to store bought 3% USP in the brown bottles?

Store bought

That's not what I'm finding. Where exactly did you get this conclusion and are you speaking of any one item or just in general as to store bought 3% USP in the brown bottles?

Been using this stuff for aquarium use at least 30 years. You dont have to go with myself or Jay's recommendation but I do know time is being wasted while fish are infested in the process of trying to find an easy way out with this. The whole day has gone by and a debate on which Peroxide is all that has occurred

 

[GARRIGA]

Store bought

Been using this stuff for aquarium use at least 30 years. You dont have to go with myself or Jay's recommendation but I do know time is being wasted while fish are infested in the process of trying to find an easy way out with this. The whole day has gone by and a debate on which Peroxide is all that has occurred

Yet no clue what exact hydrogen peroxide you're using last 30 years. Near me. Walgreens, CVS and Publix. All branded by them with no clue what's in them. Some say stabilized. Others don't. My current option from CVS doesn't claim stabilized. Call them and they looked up the batch number which only claims it has purified water and hydrogen peroxide. Literally read off their list which according to the FDA doesn't need to list inhibitors because it's a topical treatment unlike food grade.

Explain this. If it has no inhibitors then why does it have an expiration date of November 2026? Perhaps if unopened yet as I understand hydrogen peroxide, soon as it's bottled it starts to decompose unless inhibitors added. Either the science is lying or for past 30 years your usage hasn't been high enough to be toxic. I'm going to be pushing the envelope and pretty sure will exceed likely in one tank a higher concentration than you have but could be wrong and bringing up Jay doesn't persuade the fact you have no clue what's in your batch were you using that I have access to since the seller likely just as clueless and it's never been intended for consumption or food use.

As for the day wasted. By who? Just trying to advance knowledge. Do you feel I'm not providing it? Do you feel I'm giving wrong information? Will fish perish because of me? Have you decided my contributions not welcomed? Perhaps lets all take a breath and try seeing if new ideas have merit because Humble Fish has already started applying hydrogen peroxide to treat ich and I'm just seeing if use of UV can advance that progress. BTW, he's using the brown bottle 3% USP not food grade so perhaps it really doesn't matter but I'd still like confirmation it won't contain silver or other inhibitors that in high enough concentrations over extended time might cause concern and will kill fish along with corals and all other inhabitants exposed. For me it might be more of a concern since I avoid water changes where's other it might not. We all reef as we please therefore why assume one shoes size fits.

 

[vetteguy53081]

Yet no clue what exact hydrogen peroxide you're using last 30 years. Near me. Walgreens, CVS and Publix. All branded by them with no clue what's in them. Some say stabilized. Others don't. My current option from CVS doesn't claim stabilized. Call them and they looked up the batch number which only claims it has purified water and hydrogen peroxide. Literally read off their list which according to the FDA doesn't need to list inhibitors because it's a topical treatment unlike food grade.

Explain this. If it has no inhibitors then why does it have an expiration date of November 2026? Perhaps if unopened yet as I understand hydrogen peroxide, soon as it's bottled it starts to decompose unless inhibitors added. Either the science is lying or for past 30 years your usage hasn't been high enough to be toxic. I'm going to be pushing the envelope and pretty sure will exceed likely in one tank a higher concentration than you have but could be wrong and bringing up Jay doesn't persuade the fact you have no clue what's in your batch were you using that I have access to since the seller likely just as clueless and it's never been intended for consumption or food use.

As for the day wasted. By who? Just trying to advance knowledge. Do you feel I'm not providing it? Do you feel I'm giving wrong information? Will fish perish because of me? Have you decided my contributions not welcomed? Perhaps lets all take a breath and try seeing if new ideas have merit because Humble Fish has already started applying hydrogen peroxide to treat ich and I'm just seeing if use of UV can advance that progress. BTW, he's using the brown bottle 3% USP not food grade so perhaps it really doesn't matter but I'd still like confirmation it won't contain silver or other inhibitors that in high enough concentrations over extended time might cause concern and will kill fish along with corals and all other inhabitants exposed. For me it might be more of a concern since I avoid water changes where's other it might not. We all reef as we please therefore why assume one shoes size fits.

Peroxide is an oxidizer and is made of water and peroxide - No stabilizers.
Not finger pointing at you - Its more of " why arent these fish being treated yet?"

 

[GARRIGA]

Peroxide is an oxidizer and is made of water and peroxide - No stabilizers.
Not finger pointing at you - Its more of " why arent these fish being treated yet?"

Honestly, went down the rabbit hole with hydrogen peroxide and I can with full confidence tell you it's not just an oxidizer with water. Soon as it's created it starts decomposing. There's no if then or buts about it. Only way to prolong storage is with a stabilizer or inhibitor. Here's the crazy part. Once opened it really starts decomposing. Most past six months might just be water and why I have test strips arriving tomorrow that test strength up to 10% so that I know I'm not dosing a placebo literally down the drain. Have test strips that test to 100 ppm because ich treatment seems to be based on 150. Have test strips to 400 ppm because I want to push the envelope and see how far I can go before test subjects get irritated. There's even test strips to 5000 ppm should I find 400 not the limit. Reason for all these test strips because none are going to be precise, this is obviously not mainstream, no probes hooked up to controllers, ORP might indicate but might not and in the end since I can't find another pushing this envelope that I can glean then I have no choice but to press on and hopefully don't screw it up yet it is from mistakes that we learn and I expect to learn.

Just try this on for size. What if I prove out that by judicially using UV to neutralize HP in a QT environment that allows me to shock the system similar to how we shock inhabitants with dips but after treatment just turn the light on and wipe it clean? In the process that UV also oxidizes anything passing through it as the HP is being neutralized. What if one can also run HP through a mechanical filter and have the detritus reduced because it was at an elevated enough level to work yet once exposed to UV it was removed or minimized to levels that don't compromise life. However, because of the volume used any inhibitors present would overtime cause concern because it would accumulate quickly in such a confined space. Why I need to know what it contains yet know food grade safer yet considerably more expensive and much more short lived. Possible savior in all this is sodium percarbonate which at 120g/L creates 27.5% HP plus some unknown amount of soda ash. We all love soda ash so that one impurity being a good thing.

Like I said. Went down the rabbit hole which is normal operation for me until either I know all there is or finally conclude it was a total waste of time and now onto the next new thing. Let's learn. Let's hopefully stop killing fish. Only so much habitat left and I believe least I can do is find a way to prolong that I obtain and why I left the industry in the mid 90s. Both fish and reptiles. For everyone received countless lost in holding or transport or fact we the buyers rather clueless on how to keep. Much has advanced yet we still get ich. Be nice If I've found something others have started and together as a community pushed the envelope and finally found one less nightmare to lose sleep and fish.

Sorry if I came across aggressive before but it's the internet and often impossible to interpret that said plus I'm exhausted and hungry. Latter two not the best combo

 

[vetteguy53081]

Honestly, went down the rabbit hole with hydrogen peroxide and I can with full confidence tell you it's not just an oxidizer with water. Soon as it's created it starts decomposing. There's no if then or buts about it. Only way to prolong storage is with a stabilizer or inhibitor. Here's the crazy part. Once opened it really starts decomposing. Most past six months might just be water and why I have test strips arriving tomorrow that test strength up to 10% so that I know I'm not dosing a placebo literally down the drain. Have test strips that test to 100 ppm because ich treatment seems to be based on 150. Have test strips to 400 ppm because I want to push the envelope and see how far I can go before test subjects get irritated. There's even test strips to 5000 ppm should I find 400 not the limit. Reason for all these test strips because none are going to be precise, this is obviously not mainstream, no probes hooked up to controllers, ORP might indicate but might not and in the end since I can't find another pushing this envelope that I can glean then I have no choice but to press on and hopefully don't screw it up yet it is from mistakes that we learn and I expect to learn.

Just try this on for size. What if I prove out that by judicially using UV to neutralize HP in a QT environment that allows me to shock the system similar to how we shock inhabitants with dips but after treatment just turn the light on and wipe it clean? In the process that UV also oxidizes anything passing through it as the HP is being neutralized. What if one can also run HP through a mechanical filter and have the detritus reduced because it was at an elevated enough level to work yet once exposed to UV it was removed or minimized to levels that don't compromise life. However, because of the volume used any inhibitors present would overtime cause concern because it would accumulate quickly in such a confined space. Why I need to know what it contains yet know food grade safer yet considerably more expensive and much more short lived. Possible savior in all this is sodium percarbonate which at 120g/L creates 27.5% HP plus some unknown amount of soda ash. We all love soda ash so that one impurity being a good thing.

Like I said. Went down the rabbit hole which is normal operation for me until either I know all there is or finally conclude it was a total waste of time and now onto the next new thing. Let's learn. Let's hopefully stop killing fish. Only so much habitat left and I believe least I can do is find a way to prolong that I obtain and why I left the industry in the mid 90s. Both fish and reptiles. For everyone received countless lost in holding or transport or fact we the buyers rather clueless on how to keep. Much has advanced yet we still get ich. Be nice If I've found something others have started and together as a community pushed the envelope and finally found one less nightmare to lose sleep and fish.

Sorry if I came across aggressive before but it's the internet and often impossible to interpret that said plus I'm exhausted and hungry. Latter two not the best combo

No worries. I now get what you are trying to accomplish and am interested to see how it turns out and hopefully it does

 

[Alex_hairymoney]

For Boas?

For the

So you are unable to post full tank pictures of your Red Sea 1000 tank? Why am I not surprised. Here you are with at least 12 large fish (per your prior post) stuck in an undersized tank and you have a fish disease problem for what the 3rd time now in 6 months? Sadly your fish will suffer, most will probably die and you will run to the LFS again wallet in hand to stuff your tank again and of course we will see future threads from you describing your troubles and expert "ich management " techniques.

 

[Alex_hairymoney]

For the

For the

Are you still surprised ??? You also want a pic of the 525? Lol you need to get a life homie. Don’t @ me no more

 

[Alex_hairymoney]

You seem really really abrasive. It, I think, is everyone's opinion that you came here for advice - your response to me was sarcastic - and uncalled for - I asked you what your protocol for Ich management was. that's it.

You seem really really abrasive. It, I think, is everyone's opinion that you came here for advice - your response to me was sarcastic - and uncalled for - I asked you what your protocol for Ich management was. that's it.

And I answered you I wasn’t being sarcastic nor rude you asked I answered. Now with lavey the Fwc officer with him I was EXTREMELY SARCATIC but with you I wasn’t if I came off in the wrong for with you mnfish1 my apologies no sarcasm intended

 

[Lavey29]

For the

Looks nothing like the pictures you first posted and appears to be missing quite a few fish. Strange you didnt use the same phone as your first pictures too...things that make you go hhmmm..... and those bright white rocks