Ich Questions

[HTXReefer]

Yesterday I noticed my Blue Tang had a couple of spots. I immediately started making water to get a HT up and running. Then yesterday evening I noticed a significant increase in the number of spots and she was hiding in the rocks but still coming out to eat.

I couldn’t make water fast enough to get her out last night so I picked up some imagitarium Parasite Remedy from Petco and started dosing the DT per instructions.

I got the HT running today and moved the Tang over and started on Paraguard per LFS recommendation.

I have read that I should pull all fish and quarantine for a minimumof 30 days for the DT to clear up the infestation.

Should I move all other fish that show no symptoms to the HT with the Tang? Or leave all other fish in the DT and finish the Imagiterium dose? Or, Should I setup another QT and watch them for the 30 days?

I am new to Saltwater and Reefing and appreciate any input from the forum

 

[HTXReefer]

 

[DLHDesign]

Sounds like you've got the right process in motion in terms of equipment and setup. Note that Paraguard will not treat ich. It may help some of the symptoms, but it does not effect the parasite itself. You will need copper, CP, or the TTM process for that.

Yes; you will need to remove all your fish and keep your DT fallow (fish free) for 76 days if you want to have a chance of eliminating ich from your tank. While I always recommend treatment and eradication, it's important to point out that there are other options out there. Check out this thread for details on ich eradication vs. ich management.

It's hard to tell for sure with the picture (may just be the light), but this looks like it could be Brooklynella and not (or in addition to...) ich. Check out this thread to compare.

 

[HTXReefer]

Sounds like you've got the right process in motion in terms of equipment and setup. Note that Paraguard will not treat ich. It may help some of the symptoms, but it does not effect the parasite itself. You will need copper, CP, or the TTM process for that.

Yes; you will need to remove all your fish and keep your DT fallow (fish free) for 76 days if you want to have a chance of eliminating ich from your tank. While I always recommend treatment and eradication, it's important to point out that there are other options out there. Check out this thread for details on ich eradication vs. ich management.

It's hard to tell for sure with the picture (may just be the light), but this looks like it could be Brooklynella and not (or in addition to...) ich. Check out this thread to compare.

I don’t think it looks like brooklynella. She is still swimming pretty good right now so it’s hard to snap a pic. I do think it looks a little more like velvet based on the thread you sent. I say this because of the number of small spots and how quick they popped up. Is the procedure for clearing the DT similar to ich?

 

[gobble]

If it's velvet get her in copper immediately. You don't have much time.

 

[TheShrimpNibbler]

I don’t think it looks like brooklynella. She is still swimming pretty good right now so it’s hard to snap a pic. I do think it looks a little more like velvet based on the thread you sent. I say this because of the number of small spots and how quick they popped up. Is the procedure for clearing the DT similar to ich?

It looks like scales and skin are missing on the side of the fish by the head. If this is true and there is stringy mucus coming off the fish, it could be brook. It could just be ich or velvet though. Either way, remove all fish for a minimum of 8 weeks, but 11 if you want to be really safe. Copper and hypo are the only treatment for ich, and formaldehyde is the only treatment for brook.

 

[gobble]

That fish could be dead in a day. If it's velvet you need to get all the fish out of the display and treat them as well. Seriously, no time to screw around here.

 

[HTXReefer]

That fish could be dead in a day. If it's velvet you need to get all the fish out of the display and treat them as well. Seriously, no time to screw around here.

I’ll get all of the fish out now. I do have a gold face blenny in the tank but it hasn’t been seen since I put it in. I had to move most of the rock around this weekend and couldn’t find him. Every once in a while we see sand being kicked up but the fish doesn’t come out.

 

[DLHDesign]

I do think it looks a little more like velvet based on the thread you sent.

The initial treatment for both ich and velvet are the same, just the urgency changes. What you'll most likely be able to get your hands on soonest will be some form of copper. Ideally, you'll want a "chelated copper", but anything that is actually copper for marine fish will work. It's key to make sure you get the right test kit for whatever kind of copper you get.
Here is a good post on using copper to treat both ich and velvet.
Given what you've been able to get so far, you're likely to be able to find Seachem Cupramine and the Seachem Copper Test Kit. Both of these are fine to use on the fish you have identified so far.

Is the procedure for clearing the DT similar to ich?

I wouldn't worry about your DT at this point. Treat your fish; nothing you are dealing with will harm the tank once the fish are out, and pretty much all of them involve getting the fish out anyways.

 

[TheShrimpNibbler]

I’ll get all of the fish out now. I do have a gold face blenny in the tank but it hasn’t been seen since I put it in. I had to move most of the rock around this weekend and couldn’t find him. Every once in a while we see sand being kicked up but the fish doesn’t come out.

If you have to take all the rock out to get the blenny, then that’s what you have to do.

 

[MERKEY]

If you dont have anything in the tank but fish just treat the DT.

 

[DLHDesign]

Given the hour, you may not be able to get copper tonight. One option you can use to help get the fish through the night is to give it a Freshwater Dip. This is not a cure - it's like a tourniquet on a bleeding wound.

 

[HTXReefer]

If you have to take all the rock out to get the blenny, then that’s what you have to do.

I read somewhere there could be a bacterial infection along with the velvet. Is there anything I should use for that as well?

 

[HTXReefer]

If you dont have anything in the tank but fish just treat the DT.

I do have a handful of coral frags, a LTA, and Other assorted inverts

 

[MERKEY]

Ya that makes it a bit harder....

 

[DLHDesign]

I read somewhere there could be a bacterial infection along with the velvet. Is there anything I should use for that as well?

I wouldn't stress about that right now. The wounds from both ich and velvet can cause secondary infections that may need to be treated, but combining medications isn't a great idea. If you can keep the fish eating throughout the initial stages of copper treatment, then you can look into medications to help it fight off infections. But first things first - get rid of the plague that is the parasites.

(Note on Freshwater Dips - Blue Tangs are notorious for "playing dead" during freshwater dips. Watch the gills - they should keep moving, even if slowly. If so, they are doing as well as can be expected.)

 

[HTXReefer]

Given the hour, you may not be able to get copper tonight. One option you can use to help get the fish through the night is to give it a Freshwater Dip. This is not a cure - it's like a tourniquet on a bleeding wound.

I can do this again. I did one earlier in the day while waiting for LFS to open to get the paraguard.

I wouldn't stress about that right now. The wounds from both ich and velvet can cause secondary infections that may need to be treated, but combining medications isn't a great idea. If you can keep the fish eating throughout the initial stages of copper treatment, then you can look into medications to help it fight off infections. But first things first - get rid of the plague that is the parasites.

(Note on Freshwater Dips - Blue Tangs are notorious for "playing dead" during freshwater dips. Watch the gills - they should keep moving, even if slowly. If so, they are doing as well as can be expected.)

Thank you for all of your help. I can’ get the copper tonight. How often can you perform freshwater dips? I have plenty of RODI water made up now.

 

[HTXReefer]

I can do this again. I did one earlier in the day while waiting for LFS to open to get the paraguard.


Thank you for all of your help. I can’ get the copper tonight. How often can you perform freshwater dips? I have plenty of RODI water made up now.

Cannot

 

[DLHDesign]

How often can you perform freshwater dips?

How often SHOULD YOU is no more than one every 24-48 hours. This gives the fish time to recuperate and recover from the process (which is stressful and can have some adverse effects).
How often CAN YOU depends upon the fish. If it recovers well and seems to handle the dip without too much stress, you can do them more often. I don't think I would ever do more than one every 12 hrs myself, and that would only be if the fish was recovered fully.

It's kind of a balancing act. If the FW Dip is helpful in reducing the symptoms, then it may be better to do more dips rather than let the fish suffer through the problem. But if the dip doesn't really help any, then you're better off not doing them and letting the fish keep it's natural strength and energy high.

 

[HTXReefer]

How often SHOULD YOU is no more than one every 24-48 hours. This gives the fish time to recuperate and recover from the process (which is stressful and can have some adverse effects).
How often CAN YOU depends upon the fish. If it recovers well and seems to handle the dip without too much stress, you can do them more often. I don't think I would ever do more than one every 12 hrs myself, and that would only be if the fish was recovered fully.

It's kind of a balancing act. If the FW Dip is helpful in reducing the symptoms, then it may be better to do more dips rather than let the fish suffer through the problem. But if the dip doesn't really help any, then you're better off not doing them and letting the fish keep it's natural strength and energy high.

Well I don’t think she’s going to make it. Just went into my office where the HT is setup and she doesn’t look good at all. Just laying on the bottom of the tank and it’s breathing seems shallow.

I’m a little disappointed with myself about this one. A couple of rookie mistakes made for sure. One not having water on standby and the proper treatment on hand. What chemicals or medications should I have on hand at all times to be able to react a whole lot faster?
I’m mixing new salt water at the moment. If she doesn’t make it I am planning on draining the HT, sterilizing and refilling with fresh water before bringing the other fish over.