ich, rays , eels and anemone

[Rueda]

got an established 150 gal tank with ich which killed all my fish and eel. the only survivor is my smalll chilean ray, anemone, and the turbo snails. what can i do to try to save these guys. i have another 30 gal established tank but too small for ray and afraid anemone will carry ich eater to it. any suggestions?

 

[Gweeds1980]

got an established 150 gal tank with ich which killed all my fish and eel. the only survivor is my smalll chilean ray, anemone, and the turbo snails. what can i do to try to save these guys. i have another 30 gal established tank but too small for ray and afraid anemone will carry ich eater to it. any suggestions?

First I'd query if it was ich... eels are normally not affected (although can be) and I'm yet to see a confirmed report of ich killing one. Could have been velvet or brook possibly?

Working on the assumption it was ich... if you want to eliminate it you can't treat with copper, even in QT as the ray won't cope, it also won't cope with hypo. Your only real option is ttm with the ray and leaving the DT fallow for 76 days.

Be sure to QT everything you put in the DT if you want to remain ich free. Treat all fish either with copper for 30 days or with ttm and qt all inverts, rock, sand etc (anything wet!) fishless for 76 days.

Good luck!

 

[Rueda]

I thought it was ich because a powder tang I had was with the visible white spots. I treated with copper, hypo, and it seemed to cure it. they were all fine for awhile, then they started hyperventilating so I thought the ich got inside their gills. now I think it was velvet. I'm just soo lost now ans want to save the ray, anemone and remaining eel

 

[fishbox]

Can anemones carry ich?

 

[Tahoe61]

Can anemones carry ich?

No in the sense that anemones are not a vector. Any moist rock, net, shells, corals have the potential to introduce encapsulated tomonts.

 

[Rueda]

I guess I'm going to pray the ones left survive. don't want to med and kill the ray. I hear they are sensitive to meds

 

[Gweeds1980]

I thought it was ich because a powder tang I had was with the visible white spots. I treated with copper, hypo, and it seemed to cure it. they were all fine for awhile, then they started hyperventilating so I thought the ich got inside their gills. now I think it was velvet. I'm just soo lost now ans want to save the ray, anemone and remaining eel

Sounds more like velvet to me... on the plus side, it's basically the same treatment. Is really difficult on elasmobranchs like the ray, but can be done. You'll need to treat all the fish, regardless of whether they've shown signs or not. Take a look at the stickys on here for how to carry out ttm...

I've heard of quinine sulfate being used to successfully treat ich in tanks with sharks, but I don't know the details or the recommended dosages etc... maybe @4FordFamily @Humblefish @melypr1984 @ngoodermuth may be able to chime in?

 

[Rueda]

Sounds more like velvet to me... on the plus side, it's basically the same treatment. Is really difficult on elasmobranchs like the ray, but can be done. You'll need to treat all the fish, regardless of whether they've shown signs or not. Take a look at the stickys on here for how to carry out ttm...

I've heard of quinine sulfate being used to successfully treat ich in tanks with sharks, but I don't know the details or the recommended dosages etc... maybe @4FordFamily @Humblefish @melypr1984 @ngoodermuth may be able to chime in?

well I have left now is an eel, ray, and the anemone. awhile ago I medicated a tank with an anemone in it and the anemone shrinked and shriveled up

 

[Gweeds1980]

well I have left now is an eel, ray, and the anemone. awhile ago I medicated a tank with an anemone in it and the anemone shrinked and shriveled up

Yep, never treat a tank with inverts in... they'll die... what did you treat with out of interest?

As stated, you'll need to remove the fish, use ttm to rid of the parasites and leave the main tank free of any fish for 76 days. That will eradicate the problem, whether it's ich or velvet.

 

[4FordFamily]

I agree with what's been said - unfortunately you'll have to treat the ray or else every new fish added will be indicted as the ray will allow the parasite to complete its life cycle (even if not noticeably afflicted). I believe CP is a better option but you are stuck between a rock and a hard place. That's the only option for long term success. Or get rid of the ray.

Either way the tank will need to be fishless for 76 days to starve off ich and velvet.

 

[Humblefish]

^^ Agree with probable velvet diagnosis.

I also agree that Quinine Sulfate is a suitable treatment for sharks, rays and eels: http://fishmedsonline.com/product/quinine-sulfate/

However, that drug has proved to be harsh on most other species of fish, and thus Chloroquine phosphate is a better alternative: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/chloroquine-phosphate.192309/

 

[Rueda]

would leaving the tank fishless for 72 days with just the eel and ray kill off the parasite since there would be no host?

 

[Rueda]

Chloroquine phosphate says it will kill inverts, worried for my nemo, I guess safe for ray/eel

 

[Humblefish]

would leaving the tank fishless for 72 days with just the eel and ray kill off the parasite since there would be no host?

No; the eel/ray will still host the parasite, just at sublethal levels. The overall concentration of the parasite in the tank will be low, but it will still be present and it will continue on with it's lifecycle at a reduced capacity.

Chloroquine phosphate says it will kill inverts, worried for my nemo, I guess safe for ray/eel

CP is generally safe to use on all fish, except wrasses, anthias & Hippo Tangs. It was actually first promoted as a safe alternative to copper for scaleless fish (e.g. eels, sharks, rays).

 

[Reeferside]

Leave your tank fishless. Wait it out and QT all your new fish or buy established fish from other members local to you.

 

[Reef and Dive]

No; the eel/ray will still host the parasite, just at sublethal levels. The overall concentration of the parasite in the tank will be low, but it will still be present and it will continue on with it's lifecycle at a reduced capacity.

CP is generally safe to use on all fish, except wrasses, anthias & Hippo Tangs. It was actually first promoted as a safe alternative to copper for scaleless fish (e.g. eels, sharks, rays).

I’ve spent many weeks searching for any documented evidence (scientific articles would be best) that eels can host cryptocaryon but found absolutely none.

Mr Humblefish I truly admire your work, and I’m writing a chapter for a book.

So I would like to ask, are you aware of any documented evidence that eels really can host cryptocaryon? Or is this hypothetical?

Anyone else?

This is just a question to be 100% sure I won’t write anything that raises doubts, not intended to bet disrespectful at all.

 

[Humblefish]

@Reef and Dive This is the closest evidence I have ever found, but it's important to note that A. ocellatus is very different from "true eels":

In Alaska, Cryptocaryon has been reported at two large aquarium facilities parasitizing captive greenling, sculpins, wolf eels and rockfish.

Source: https://www.adfg.alaska.gov/static/species/disease/pdfs/fishdiseases/white_spot_disease.pdf

 

[Reef and Dive]

@Reef and Dive This is the closest evidence I have ever found, but it's important to note that A. ocellatus is very different from "true eels":



Source: https://www.adfg.alaska.gov/static/species/disease/pdfs/fishdiseases/white_spot_disease.pdf

Yeah... thats actually a perciform with an eel “look”, not a true anguilliform. I’m still trying to do the best research I can in this topic.

It seems cryptocaryon never appears on scientific anguilliform diseases meetings. I’ll keep searching.

Thanks a lot for the answer.